What's the difference between the various Radius 24 cards?

[Nathan_A]

I got through just over half the testing last weekend. I'll hopefully get through the rest this weekend.

 

[slomacuser]

Some tests from Macworld Oct 1994.

As in our last video-card roundup, we found that accelerated video handily outpaces the 68040's unaccelerated on-board video but that the subjective difference
between one accelerated card and another that costs twice as much is only slight. In using the cards over a period of several months, for example, I was dissatisfied with the pace of only two cards, the $699 Mirror Tornado and the $1999 RasterOps Horizon 24. The other cards performed so similarly I could hardly tell them apart.

The Power Mac Factor

No matter how much emphasis you place on the occasional speed differences between the five cards, the equally fast performance of the PDS cards included with
Apple's Power Mac 7100 and 8100 calls the entire category of accelerated graphics cards into question.

Don't expect an accelerated video card to turn your graphics applications into speed demons. Upgrading from a Quadra to a Power Mac, for example, will have a greater impact on the speed of native applications such as PageMaker and Adobe Photoshop than will adding on a new graphics card.

Meanwhile, Macworld Lab found that the PDS card actually performed faster than any thirdparty card tested when using native Power Mac graphics programs such as Aldus FreeHand 4.0 and Adobe Illustrator 5.5. (Previous Macworld Lab results show that the PDS video was slower when using prerelease native software.)

Of the five cards tested, the SuperMac Spectrum Power• 1152 gets the highest recommendation, thanks to its relatively modest price and its quick performance (the fastest of the five cards tested). Certainly, the LeMansGT is every bit as good as the SuperMac card, and I even prefer many aspects of its software. But its high price makes it more attractive to graphics professionals who need sophisticated calibration options, and these options won't be available until Radius ships new software for its PrecisionColor Cal ibrator sometime in late September.-

 

[trag]

The XK differs from the XP and X on one of the larger chips (lower right). Different brand, but I can't tell if it's the same type. The XP has a different kind of memory module than the X and XK. All three have different Firmware versions and slight differences in chips, jumpers, and overall PCB layout.

Radius Precision Color Pro 24X [v1.5 Firmware]:

View attachment 11527

Radius Precision Color Pro 24XK [v2.0 Firmware]:

View attachment 11528

Radius Precision Color Pro 24XP [v1.51 Firmware:

View attachment 11529

Taking another, more careful look at the three photos, the only substantial difference I can see in the components, is that the RAMDAC is a different speed on each card. 110 on the top card, 80 on the middle card and 66 on the bottom card.

I just received my order of BT473KPJ110 RAMDAC chips, so if anyone is feeling adventurous.....

They're all clearly pulls with different date codes. Make me sad to think they may have come off of NuBus cards that were killed....

 

[pizzigri]

Resurrecting this thread to ask what difference does the FW revs 1.1 and 2.0 make on the Radius/Apple display card 24AC. If there is a significant difference, is there any way to obtain a programmed chip with the FW on it? I have a 24AC with Rev. 1.1

 

[pizzigri]

After extensive search I found out that rom V.2 will allow operation on PowerPC and compatibility with Mac OS 9.
Would anybody be able to program a chip for me with the V2 Rom?

 

[Phipli]

After extensive search I found out that rom V.2 will allow operation on PowerPC and compatibility with Mac OS 9.
Would anybody be able to program a chip for me with the V2 Rom?

The roms are mostly interchangeable, but they are different for different cards. What card do you have?

Sorry, didn't spot the older post.

 

[Phipli]

After extensive search I found out that rom V.2 will allow operation on PowerPC and compatibility with Mac OS 9.
Would anybody be able to program a chip for me with the V2 Rom?

I can't remember which ROMs have been uploaded, do you have a rip of the ROM you want to use? I could post you one at cost if the postage isn't too expensive? I'm UK based.

 

[pizzigri]

Sadly, before reading this thread, I wasn't even aware revisions different than 1.1 existed, let alone materially have .bin dumps of them. Postage from UK for such a small part is not a problem, a letter envelope with a cardboard filler and a hole in the middle works well....

 

[Phipli]

Sadly, before reading this thread, I wasn't even aware revisions different than 1.1 existed, let alone materially have .bin dumps of them. Postage from UK for such a small part is not a problem, a letter envelope with a cardboard filler and a hole in the middle works well....

How long are you willing to wait? My dad has an AC card with what should be a version 2.0 ROM, but I won't see him for about 5 weeks (he lives on the far side of the country). I've asked him to bring his cards so I can rip the ROMs. Otherwise we could try Bolle's ROM, but I haven't tried it in different cards.

I'll need to get a ROM too, I only have 3.3V ROMs and these will be 5V.

 

[pizzigri]

How long are you willing to wait? My dad has an AC card with what should be a version 2.0 ROM, but I won't see him for about 5 weeks (he lives on the far side of the country). I've asked him to bring his cards so I can rip the ROMs. Otherwise we could try Bolle's ROM, but I haven't tried it in different cards.

I'll need to get a ROM too, I only have 3.3V ROMs and these will be 5V.

Hey Phipli,
I have absolutely no rush whatsoever. Wiling to wait whatever there’s to wait. And I’m grateful for whatever you can manage to do! Also, if you need to purchase EPROMs I’ll be happy to help

 

[Phipli]

The XK differs from the XP and X on one of the larger chips (lower right). Different brand, but I can't tell if it's the same type. The XP has a different kind of memory module than the X and XK. All three have different Firmware versions and slight differences in chips, jumpers, and overall PCB layout.

Radius Precision Color Pro 24X [v1.5 Firmware]:

View attachment 11527

Radius Precision Color Pro 24XK [v2.0 Firmware]:

View attachment 11528

Radius Precision Color Pro 24XP [v1.51 Firmware:

View attachment 11529

Hey @olePigeon, do you still have these cards? Do you have a way of reading the ROMs on these cards?

 

[Phipli]

View attachment 11546

View attachment 11547

It looks like my Red 24X is a later version than your Green 24X. Mine has the 2.0 ROM and it's in the lower position, hrmmm?

Interesting, My XP also has the 2.0 ROM, this is probably good news for you experiment. I ran the 24X 2.0 ROM on the 24XP successfully. It didn't work, probably because of the lower capacity RAMDAC. However it made a great grayscale 21" TPD card out of the 16" Resolution 24XP.

Jailbreaking the Radius PrecisionColor 24XP . . .

We'll have to check compatibility with OS9.x.x with these cards. I'm wondering if your X will do 9.1, even with the 2.0 ROM. If mine is a 24X at all. :?:

As above, @Trash80toHP_Mini, do you still have these cards and are you able to rip the ROMs?

 

[mg.man]

Just came across this thread and haven't fully digested... I do have a 24X, but it has a 1.4 ROM IIRC. Perhaps more interesting, I also have a 24XP:


With this...

 

[Phipli]

Just came across this thread and haven't fully digested... I do have a 24X, but it has a 1.4 ROM IIRC. Perhaps more interesting, I also have a 24XP:
View attachment 56912

With this...
View attachment 56913

Oooooooh

Rip it!

The DAC is the same speed as my XK... what is the part number on the VRAM chips?

 

[Phipli]

Just came across this thread and haven't fully digested... I do have a 24X, but it has a 1.4 ROM IIRC. Perhaps more interesting, I also have a 24XP:
View attachment 56912

With this...
View attachment 56913

Looking at photos earlier in the thread I can see they're 128k chips, so the card has 1.5MB of VRAM. That's the difference between the XP and XK, same speed DAC, but the XK has 3MB. The XK does 24bit at higher resolutions I guess.

 

[mg.man]

Oooooooh

Rip it!

Oh... OK. Might not be 'til the w/e tho.

what is the part number on the VRAM chips?

lemme see...

 

[mg.man]

Oooo... look what else I found :


More importantly :

 

[Phipli]

So interestingly, that card has 3MB of VRAM like mine, but KM428C257 chips instead of my KM428C256 chips. The 257s have 512 bit shift registers. Not sure if this has no impact on performance or helps somehow.

Datasheets to save faff

 

[Phipli]

I believe the extra functionality of the VRAM chips (512 bit shift registers on the serial output) is unused, because other 24X cards just have the 256 bit chips. I suspect they were used as substitute parts and used identically.

 

[mg.man]

I'm back on this thread since my question is not limited to the 24X... Looking above, you can see the pics of my "red" card has a 24X 2.0 ROM (which I have posted in the other 24X-specific thread). However... when looking at my other 24X card, I spotted a significant design difference. Here is the above "red" card next to my other "24X" (yes, I know neither has a ROM) :



So, the question -- is my "red" card really a 24X?

As you can see on the lower card, the silkscreen states "PrecisionColor 24X". On the "red" card, only the ROM has "24X" on it. If you look higher up in the thread, you'll see I also posted a picture of my "blue" card - which has a 24XP ROM. Curiously, the "blue" card layout is pretty much identical to the "red" card, apart from what appears to be a faster RAMDAC on the "red" card. Are these "red" and "blue" cards just a latter design, and the "red" card really is the "24X" variant?