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My 3lectr1cal Conquests!
- Thread starter 3lectr1cPPC
- Start date
CC_333
Well-known member
The Pismo isn't really that much different from a Lombard, except it features a somewhat faster, improved logic board architecture, a pair of Firewire ports in place of the SCSI port, and an internal AirPort card slot.
The Lombard shares more in common with the tray loading iMac (allegedly, the original iMac was essentially a PowerBook logic board redesigned to fit within the iMac's form factor), so it's a bit more quirky. Also, something neat I discovered about the Lombard is that it actually has a mostly implemented multi boot screen that's quite different from the one featured on all subsequent Macs, and isn't invokable via holding the Option key (one must enter the OF prompt and type "multi-boot", I believe). It's apparently undocumented, because I've never read anything about its existence anywhere.
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The Lombard shares more in common with the tray loading iMac (allegedly, the original iMac was essentially a PowerBook logic board redesigned to fit within the iMac's form factor), so it's a bit more quirky. Also, something neat I discovered about the Lombard is that it actually has a mostly implemented multi boot screen that's quite different from the one featured on all subsequent Macs, and isn't invokable via holding the Option key (one must enter the OF prompt and type "multi-boot", I believe). It's apparently undocumented, because I've never read anything about its existence anywhere.
c
3lectr1cPPC
Well-known member
Huh, neat! Kinda sad because there’s a cheap Pismo on Mercari right now but I just spent my “old crap” money on a parts unit to fix my ps/note 425… another day. There are more Pismos in the world.
AndyO
Well-known member
There doesn't seem to be a shortage of them, but they do seem to sell for a variety of prices. Not usually cheap though!
BTW, not that it matters, but the reason I was more interested in Lombards was because of the SCSI. Can't say I have any need for FW - though somewhere in the house there's at least one FW external HD enclosure. Haven't used that in at least 15 years!
3lectr1cPPC
Well-known member
The hyperinflated prices I don't get are for the 1400 series. There's always like 20 of them on eBay and they are all at least $200. They are nowhere close to rare.
CC_333
Well-known member
That's simply how eBay works nowadays.
And, to play devil's advocate for a bit, it's not 100% greed on the part of the sellers, unfortunately, because the fees and taxes can be pretty steep.
So basically, the overhead is so high that to turn an actual profit, sellers sometimes have to add like 50% or more.
This doesn't excuse opportunists who price things like 1000% above fair market value, of course. That's greed, plain and simple.
c
It is greed. Listing an item for $500 when it's worth $150 is not excusable. Thankfully, most of those listings just seem to sit there as nobody is willing to pay over the odds. There's an ordinary Mac SE listed on eBay UK for £2000 and it's been up for 3 years so far. I imagine it will still be there in another 3 years.
But yeah, PowerBooks are not rare at all. The rarest I can think of are the JLPGA PowerBook 170 (was there a 145 model too? can't remember) and the 2400c. Maybe some prototypes but otherwise, PowerBooks always sold in volume so they are not rare at all. What is rarer are certain upgrades for PowerBooks, especially third party ones like the stuff VST made. I'd love some more modules for my Pismo but they don't come up often.
But yeah, PowerBooks are not rare at all. The rarest I can think of are the JLPGA PowerBook 170 (was there a 145 model too? can't remember) and the 2400c. Maybe some prototypes but otherwise, PowerBooks always sold in volume so they are not rare at all. What is rarer are certain upgrades for PowerBooks, especially third party ones like the stuff VST made. I'd love some more modules for my Pismo but they don't come up often.
3lectr1cPPC
Well-known member
The rarest PowerBooks I’d say would go in roughly this order:
1. JLPGA 170 & 145 (not sure which one was made in higher numbers)
2. PowerBook 550c (Japan exclusive, probably didn’t sell very many)
3. PowerBook 2400c (More common in Japan than the 550c, limited sales in the US)
4. PowerBook G3 Kanga (only sold for a few months while Apple was still fighting off bankruptcy)
5. PowerBook 540 Grayscale (discontinued after only a few months, I’d imagine not many bought it either. Not really sought after though, you can find one at normal prices)
Anything else is pretty common.
1. JLPGA 170 & 145 (not sure which one was made in higher numbers)
2. PowerBook 550c (Japan exclusive, probably didn’t sell very many)
3. PowerBook 2400c (More common in Japan than the 550c, limited sales in the US)
4. PowerBook G3 Kanga (only sold for a few months while Apple was still fighting off bankruptcy)
5. PowerBook 540 Grayscale (discontinued after only a few months, I’d imagine not many bought it either. Not really sought after though, you can find one at normal prices)
Anything else is pretty common.
3lectr1cPPC
Well-known member
Eventually in a world where I end up with every single PowerBook that I really want to have, I’d have a Kanga, PDQ, and a Pismo. So, 1/3 of the way there. Part of me says the Lombard is cool because it’s got SCSI and such, but I just wouldn’t use it enough.
3lectr1cPPC
Well-known member
Funny you mention that because my 3400 is one of if not my most used Apple laptop… for me it’s that I’ve got 5 working battery packs for it and it’s the fastest laptop Mac that runs system 7 (officially, a 1400/G3 would beat it) and it’s also really solid for OS 8 and the speakers are nice.
AndyO
Well-known member
I wanted to really like the Lombard, but I don't find the big PowerBooks all that good to use. A Wallstreet or PDQ is better, but that's down to the keyboards, with smaller and more contoured key caps. Model after model, these flattened out and my fingers just don't locate on flatter keys at all well.
So I tend to go backwards, where the 3400 is better, the 5300 better yet, and the 100-series the best of all.
I toyed with the idea of getting one of each model, but there's no way I'm going to find a 550c, and even if I did, I very much doubt I'd want it - I don't like the 500-series at all.
1400s are odd. The keyboards are actually very good to use, but there is something about the model that is very unsatisfying, but that may be because I never did like the 1400cs which I bought new at the end of 1996. It, and I, get along a little better these days, but not much!
So I tend to go backwards, where the 3400 is better, the 5300 better yet, and the 100-series the best of all.
I toyed with the idea of getting one of each model, but there's no way I'm going to find a 550c, and even if I did, I very much doubt I'd want it - I don't like the 500-series at all.
1400s are odd. The keyboards are actually very good to use, but there is something about the model that is very unsatisfying, but that may be because I never did like the 1400cs which I bought new at the end of 1996. It, and I, get along a little better these days, but not much!
3lectr1cPPC
Well-known member
I have to disagree about the 500 series, I really love the design. I understand not liking it, it's up to opinion after all, but it's one of my personal favorite laptop designs. I just don't use mine much because my charger is failing and I need to recap my other one that I've already cracked open. 550c would be amazing, but I probably won't ever get one... importing one from Japan would be extremely costly. I like my 540c enough already. Of the two Japanese PowerBooks, the 2400c is the one I really want, but I'm going to wait for one with a US keyboard.
AndyO
Well-known member
I know I'm in a tiny minority who don't like the design of the 500 series, and it's not that I can put my finger on why I don't, except that when I got diagnosed, one of the primary characteristics was poor motor control. I was told that due to this, I would probably find objects that were square with hard edges easier to physically locate and manipulate than ones that were rounded or contoured. Turns out that's actually true, even to the point that the 500-series downward curve on the wrist rest makes it feel odd and misplaced in use, even though the curve is quite slight.
But that's just an example of how small design choices can have curious impacts on users!
The other issue with the 500-series is the PSU - an interesting choice, which isn't replicated as far as I know in anything else, which means no modern alternatives that I know of. Even the oddball PSU for the 190/5300 has a modern - albeit Chinese - model. Of the three 500-series PSUs I own, only one actually works.
The 2400c is certainly excellent, and mine has the US keyboard - though I might actually prefer a Japanese one. I am shocked how much these things seem to sell for, and thankful I didn't know that before I got this one!
3lectr1cPPC
Well-known member
Never responded to this for whatever reason... I will now.
I'm just quite fond of the design of the 500 series, I just think they look cool. They're also quite fast 68k Macs. Get one with an active matrix screen and it's a great laptop, 540 or 540c, both are great. I know you've got a 540c (it's dead though If I remember?), but I can understand one disliking it, your words on the palm rest curve make sense. Both mine also have stiff keyboards unfortunately.
Oh but the PSU!!! Worst part of those, it's terrible! If you get one without it, that's $50 for a new one! Crazy! Best part is the caps will go bad within a few months and it will be a paperweight. Either bust open the case to replace the caps, leaving it mangled forever, or try your luck with another one. I've already busted one of mine open, and it also looks like a nightmare to recap. It's very cramped, and to add insult to injury, there's a vertical sub-board similar to the IIsi PSU that I'll have to desolder. I can spot a little electrolytic cap on it. Not looking forward to it but will have to soon, as my other 5xx supply is dying as well.
As for the 2400c, you got super lucky. Right after you bought yours, a bunch of sellers in Japan started listing a few at $700-900, a few even sold. Guess prices are totally out to lunch now, will probably never find one, but who knows... I don't want to pay more than around $300 for one. Doesn't need to have a G3, not even the 240MHz processor or a lot of RAM. Just a unit that works, in decent shape, and no exploded PRAM battery.
I'm just quite fond of the design of the 500 series, I just think they look cool. They're also quite fast 68k Macs. Get one with an active matrix screen and it's a great laptop, 540 or 540c, both are great. I know you've got a 540c (it's dead though If I remember?), but I can understand one disliking it, your words on the palm rest curve make sense. Both mine also have stiff keyboards unfortunately.
Oh but the PSU!!! Worst part of those, it's terrible! If you get one without it, that's $50 for a new one! Crazy! Best part is the caps will go bad within a few months and it will be a paperweight. Either bust open the case to replace the caps, leaving it mangled forever, or try your luck with another one. I've already busted one of mine open, and it also looks like a nightmare to recap. It's very cramped, and to add insult to injury, there's a vertical sub-board similar to the IIsi PSU that I'll have to desolder. I can spot a little electrolytic cap on it. Not looking forward to it but will have to soon, as my other 5xx supply is dying as well.
As for the 2400c, you got super lucky. Right after you bought yours, a bunch of sellers in Japan started listing a few at $700-900, a few even sold. Guess prices are totally out to lunch now, will probably never find one, but who knows... I don't want to pay more than around $300 for one. Doesn't need to have a G3, not even the 240MHz processor or a lot of RAM. Just a unit that works, in decent shape, and no exploded PRAM battery.
Can a third party PSU not be used for a 500 series? Something funny about the barrel or are they standard, I can't remember?
I miss my 540c - got it for free and let it go (can't remember what happened to it) but I should've hung onto that machine.
The 500 series was a design award winner back in the day, it was popular at the time, they appeared in a lot of tv shows/movies as well.
I miss my 540c - got it for free and let it go (can't remember what happened to it) but I should've hung onto that machine.
The 500 series was a design award winner back in the day, it was popular at the time, they appeared in a lot of tv shows/movies as well.
3lectr1cPPC
Well-known member
500 series uses a proprietary 4 pin connector, DIN style thing sort of. Will post a photo. I’ve seen a few other laptops that used something similar, but usually with the genders reversed to how they are on the 5xx.
3lectr1cPPC
Well-known member
I made the trip back out to NJ this year for the VCF Swap Meet! Went last year and had a great time (and left with a ton of new projects) so I definitely wanted to return this year. And return I did! And I had an even better time this year than last. And I think I've also topped last year in terms of finds. Here's a rundown on what I left with (newest to oldest). A lot of this is PC stuff but I did leave with a few Apple computers and some assorted goodies too which are all further down as they're older.
1 - Lenovo ThinkPad T430 (2012)
Price paid: $35
The newest thing I bought there. I've wanted to get one of these for a while now as I've been looking for a really nice laptop to use for Windows 7 stuff and this one stood out. You can upgrade and mod these a lot and they're the best there is once you're done. This one's far from bad stock too! It's currently got an i5, 4GB RAM, 1366x768 LCD, 256GB SSD, and Windows 10 installed but I'm planning several upgrades to everything. And it was for a great price!
2. Lenovo ThinkPad T61 (2007)
Price Paid: $5
Guy said it worked when it was put away. It does POST but needs a new fan and I can't really test it further until I get one of those. The hinges are also extremely stiff.
3. Dell Latitude C640 (2002)
Price Paid: I forget but it wasn't much.
It was untested. Currently I've tested it to POST and it's got a 2.0GHz P4M, 256MB RAM, SXGA+ screen (standard on these IIRC) and seems to work fine. Good cosmetics, but it needs a hard drive before I can test further. Caddy's also missing.
4. Dell Inspiron 8100 (2001)
Price Paid: Bought it with the C640. I seem to remember $40 for the pair but again I forget.
Also untested. This one has the caddy but I think it's drive is missing too. It does POST though! 1.0GHz P3, forget what RAM, SXGA+ screen as well (standard on these). Good cosmetics too and I can't wait to get this one going! I've been looking for one of these for a while. It was complaining about the internal CD-ROM being not detected though so that may need attention.
5. Sony VAIO PCG-220FX (2001)
Price Paid: $20 IIRC
I've been looking for one of these cool purple and gray VAIO laptops for a while now and I've finally got one! It works great and it's in nice shape too. Boots up right into Windows Me haha. Needs the melted rubber feet on the bottom removed and the OS could use with a re-install. I'm going to put Win2k on there probably. Not sure the CPU speed but hopefully it's 1GHz since it's from '01.
6. IBM ThinkPad A22p
Price Paid: $5
Seems like someone opened it up and left screws out. Powers on but gives a RAM error beep. We'll see if I can get it running again. Great cosmetic condition!
6. CTX EZ-Book 800 Series
Price Paid: $20 once again IIRC
Excellent shape and appears to work perfectly. Boots Windows 98. 300MHz AMD-K6 3D. I believe @CC_333 had one similar to this. Neat laptop. It can take either a battery or a CD-ROM module, but not both at once. I've got both and the batt even holds some sort of charge! Need to test further though. Got this one with documentation too.
7. Toshiba Tecra 500CDT
Price Paid: $50
Another one I've been looking for for a while - not this model specifically but any gray 90s Toshiba. It boots into Windows 95 but takes forever to make it through POST. I may have to actually replace the CMOS battery in this one instead of just removing it because it genuinely takes 5 whole minutes to make it through all its tests. In any case the CMOS and suspend batts need to come out - they're VARTA packs that leak. It's got a big ol' crack on the palmrest but it otherwise great cosmetically. Nice keyboards on these.
8. PowerBook 1400 Lot of two
Price Paid: $75
This is probably the best find - one is a 117MHz model with some issues (screen is a mess of lines) but I didn't need another one of those anyway. Already got one. The second one though is a 166MHz with maxed out RAM, woohoo!! I've been looking for 1400 upgrades for two whole years now and finally found them! It’s also been given a 16GB CF card SSD which is also sweet. It's very rough cosmetically, clearly it was dropped long ago before the plastics were brittle but one corner is bent out of shape as a result. I'm going to do a case swap with my other one. Funny enough though this one isn't cracking around the hinges yet. Will be installing reinforcements ASAP! Should be able to finally build a nice 1400 I'm proud to own with the parts.
9. Dauphin 900N/930
Price Paid: FREE!
This one was free and for good reason. It doesn't start and the screen has pixel rot and minor vinegar syndrome, and also doesn't display anything. That last one is probably bad caps. It's a WEIRD laptop though, it has no contrast controls that I can find but is a passive matrix screen. Also has a trackball but no visible left/right click buttons? Research is required. This one may be a goner though.
10. Power Macintosh 7100
Price Paid: $30
Supposedly works but I haven't tested it yet. Hasn't been recapped, and I can't do much testing till I get an HDI-45 video adapter or a NuBus video card.
No image for now, it’s still in the car.
11. Macintosh IIsi
Price paid: $50
Fully recapped PSU included! Great, great deal! Decent cosmetics, missing a hard drive and caddy though. Will throw some sort of SSD device in there soon. I tested this one for power and it chimes loud and clear! Need to buy a dip-switch DB15 adapter and play the "will the monitor sync on green" lottery first though.
Accessories and other parts:
Best find of the day perhaps? Got an original AEK with mechanical switches for FIVE DOLLARS! People want silly money for those, right? Haven't tested it fully yet but the power button powered the IIsi fine so it isn't completely dead at least. Was sold as untested. It's dirty as can be but not that yellowed.
Also got the following other things:
1. Dell latitude D-bay floppy module ($5)
2. Various bags of NOS Dell trackpoint caps and one ThinkPad trackpoint cap ($5, great price, can't find those on eBay anymore)
3. PowerBook Video Adapter (Mini-15 to DB15) ($5)
4. Apple ADC Converter to DVI/USB/PSU combo thingy ($35) - I've been needing one of those for my ADC Cinema Display! Now I can use it on any system, not just my G5.
5. Two 120GB SATA SSDs ($20)
So yeah a lot of stuff... The reason I got so much was the prices!! It's so much lower than what you'll find anything for on eBay, and plus it's a great experience. Got to have great talks with some cool people. Definitely worth the saving and the trip. Only in the hole around $400, if that was all in eBay prices it would be so, so much more. I'd fully recommend it to anyone that's close enough to make the trip!
1 - Lenovo ThinkPad T430 (2012)
Price paid: $35
The newest thing I bought there. I've wanted to get one of these for a while now as I've been looking for a really nice laptop to use for Windows 7 stuff and this one stood out. You can upgrade and mod these a lot and they're the best there is once you're done. This one's far from bad stock too! It's currently got an i5, 4GB RAM, 1366x768 LCD, 256GB SSD, and Windows 10 installed but I'm planning several upgrades to everything. And it was for a great price!
2. Lenovo ThinkPad T61 (2007)
Price Paid: $5
Guy said it worked when it was put away. It does POST but needs a new fan and I can't really test it further until I get one of those. The hinges are also extremely stiff.
3. Dell Latitude C640 (2002)
Price Paid: I forget but it wasn't much.
It was untested. Currently I've tested it to POST and it's got a 2.0GHz P4M, 256MB RAM, SXGA+ screen (standard on these IIRC) and seems to work fine. Good cosmetics, but it needs a hard drive before I can test further. Caddy's also missing.
4. Dell Inspiron 8100 (2001)
Price Paid: Bought it with the C640. I seem to remember $40 for the pair but again I forget.
Also untested. This one has the caddy but I think it's drive is missing too. It does POST though! 1.0GHz P3, forget what RAM, SXGA+ screen as well (standard on these). Good cosmetics too and I can't wait to get this one going! I've been looking for one of these for a while. It was complaining about the internal CD-ROM being not detected though so that may need attention.
5. Sony VAIO PCG-220FX (2001)
Price Paid: $20 IIRC
I've been looking for one of these cool purple and gray VAIO laptops for a while now and I've finally got one! It works great and it's in nice shape too. Boots up right into Windows Me haha. Needs the melted rubber feet on the bottom removed and the OS could use with a re-install. I'm going to put Win2k on there probably. Not sure the CPU speed but hopefully it's 1GHz since it's from '01.
6. IBM ThinkPad A22p
Price Paid: $5
Seems like someone opened it up and left screws out. Powers on but gives a RAM error beep. We'll see if I can get it running again. Great cosmetic condition!
6. CTX EZ-Book 800 Series
Price Paid: $20 once again IIRC
Excellent shape and appears to work perfectly. Boots Windows 98. 300MHz AMD-K6 3D. I believe @CC_333 had one similar to this. Neat laptop. It can take either a battery or a CD-ROM module, but not both at once. I've got both and the batt even holds some sort of charge! Need to test further though. Got this one with documentation too.
7. Toshiba Tecra 500CDT
Price Paid: $50
Another one I've been looking for for a while - not this model specifically but any gray 90s Toshiba. It boots into Windows 95 but takes forever to make it through POST. I may have to actually replace the CMOS battery in this one instead of just removing it because it genuinely takes 5 whole minutes to make it through all its tests. In any case the CMOS and suspend batts need to come out - they're VARTA packs that leak. It's got a big ol' crack on the palmrest but it otherwise great cosmetically. Nice keyboards on these.
8. PowerBook 1400 Lot of two
Price Paid: $75
This is probably the best find - one is a 117MHz model with some issues (screen is a mess of lines) but I didn't need another one of those anyway. Already got one. The second one though is a 166MHz with maxed out RAM, woohoo!! I've been looking for 1400 upgrades for two whole years now and finally found them! It’s also been given a 16GB CF card SSD which is also sweet. It's very rough cosmetically, clearly it was dropped long ago before the plastics were brittle but one corner is bent out of shape as a result. I'm going to do a case swap with my other one. Funny enough though this one isn't cracking around the hinges yet. Will be installing reinforcements ASAP! Should be able to finally build a nice 1400 I'm proud to own with the parts.
9. Dauphin 900N/930
Price Paid: FREE!
This one was free and for good reason. It doesn't start and the screen has pixel rot and minor vinegar syndrome, and also doesn't display anything. That last one is probably bad caps. It's a WEIRD laptop though, it has no contrast controls that I can find but is a passive matrix screen. Also has a trackball but no visible left/right click buttons? Research is required. This one may be a goner though.
10. Power Macintosh 7100
Price Paid: $30
Supposedly works but I haven't tested it yet. Hasn't been recapped, and I can't do much testing till I get an HDI-45 video adapter or a NuBus video card.
No image for now, it’s still in the car.
11. Macintosh IIsi
Price paid: $50
Fully recapped PSU included! Great, great deal! Decent cosmetics, missing a hard drive and caddy though. Will throw some sort of SSD device in there soon. I tested this one for power and it chimes loud and clear! Need to buy a dip-switch DB15 adapter and play the "will the monitor sync on green" lottery first though.
Accessories and other parts:
Best find of the day perhaps? Got an original AEK with mechanical switches for FIVE DOLLARS! People want silly money for those, right? Haven't tested it fully yet but the power button powered the IIsi fine so it isn't completely dead at least. Was sold as untested. It's dirty as can be but not that yellowed.
Also got the following other things:
1. Dell latitude D-bay floppy module ($5)
2. Various bags of NOS Dell trackpoint caps and one ThinkPad trackpoint cap ($5, great price, can't find those on eBay anymore)
3. PowerBook Video Adapter (Mini-15 to DB15) ($5)
4. Apple ADC Converter to DVI/USB/PSU combo thingy ($35) - I've been needing one of those for my ADC Cinema Display! Now I can use it on any system, not just my G5.
5. Two 120GB SATA SSDs ($20)
So yeah a lot of stuff... The reason I got so much was the prices!! It's so much lower than what you'll find anything for on eBay, and plus it's a great experience. Got to have great talks with some cool people. Definitely worth the saving and the trip. Only in the hole around $400, if that was all in eBay prices it would be so, so much more. I'd fully recommend it to anyone that's close enough to make the trip!
