Netatalk SD Card Image?

[cheesestraws]

so as a server it only has TCP/IP.

a2server does not only have TCP/IP, it does AppleTalk as well.  That's part of the point.  That's also why it's a bit picky, because the AppleTalk support in the Linux kernel is a bit hit-and-miss (mostly miss).

And I've connected to it via TCP/IP from my G4 Mini just fine

Yes.  I'm talking about the client running OS 8 that you were having "Server not responding" with.  Some versions of AppleShare will do service discovery over AppleTalk, then change to IP for the data connection, apparently.  If AppleTalk on the client is working but IP is not, then I got that error message.  This was a client-side fix for me.  That said, there are hundreds of reasons why the server might randomly stop responding so this is very much offered up for what it is worth.

 

[pcamen]

Hmm, well @cheesestraws other than adding a new share and enlarging the disk of the default a2server VM, I haven't made any other changes to the configuration.  I would assume then that it has Appletalk enabled, that seeming to be the point of the a2server setup.  But I'm just guessing.  I'll have to dig in and see if I can find some info about that.

But I did fire up another a2server VM that has not had any changes from the distribution to see if that makes a difference (and thusly I screwed something up in my changes). 

What is strange though is that if I have both running, in the Appletalk control panel, it won't let me choose between the Appletalk zones (as I renamed the zone in my modified one to include my server name).  But if I turn the modified one off, reboot, it seems the new (default config) one. 

 

[cheesestraws]

Yeah, I meant that you need to make sure that IP is enabled and working on the OS 8 client, not on the server.  But if you haven't changed anything then, well.  AppleTalk on Linux is a bit of a mystery honestly :-/

 

[LaPorta]

What are your VM network adapter settings? How about the IP settings inside the Linux server?

I can always look at and compare my stuff with yours, if necessary.

 

[cheesestraws]

as I renamed the zone in my modified one to include my server name

If you have two things claiming to be a router and supplying zone info on the same network, weird things might happen?  That's a wild guess, I don't have a2server here, so I can't check what it's claiming

Sorry my suggestions are a little woolly

 

[pcamen]

If you have two things claiming to be a router and supplying zone info on the same network, weird things might happen? 

Well, I've been reading up a little on Appletalk Zones, and I think this is the way it works.

- Apple talk zones allow you to segment stuff on your network to make it more manageable.  But it isn't a physical separation like a VLAN or different sub-networks, it it just a naming separation.

- You can name stuff to belong to a particular Appletalk zone, and then when you select that zone, only the things named with that zone will show up.  Convenient if you have 50 printers in a building and only want the ones near you (engineering zone) to show up, for example.

If that is really how it works, then in theory, both of my zones should be available, and I should be able to select either of them.  I should also be able to change my modified a2server back to the standard a2server zone and have both servers show up under that zone. 

I'll have to do some more playing around. 

 

[pcamen]

Well, that may be a just plain wrong now that I found this:

https://developer.apple.com/library/archive/documentation/mac/pdf/Networking/Introduction_to_AppleTalk.pdf

[SIZE=16.6667px]A [/SIZE][SIZE=16.6667px]zone[/SIZE][SIZE=16.6667px] is a logical grouping of nodes in an AppleTalk internet. The use of zone[/SIZE]s allows [SIZE=16.6667px]a network administrator to set up departmental or other logical groupings of nodes on [/SIZE][SIZE=16.6667px]an internet. A single extended network can contain nodes belonging to any number of [/SIZE][SIZE=16.6667px]zone[/SIZE]s; an individual node on an extended network can belong to only one zone. Each [SIZE=16.6667px]zone[/SIZE] is identified by a zone name.

[SIZE=16.6667px]Ok, so far so good.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=16.6667px]An AppleTalk [/SIZE][SIZE=16.6667px]nonextended network[/SIZE][SIZE=16.6667px] is one in which[/SIZE][SIZE=11.6667px]n[/SIZE][SIZE=16.6667px]the network has one network number assigned to it[/SIZE][SIZE=11.6667px]n[/SIZE][SIZE=16.6667px]the network supports only one zone[/SIZE][SIZE=11.6667px]n[/SIZE][SIZE=16.6667px]all nodes on the network share the same network number and zone[/SIZE] name[SIZE=11.6667px]n[/SIZE][SIZE=16.6667px]each node on the network has a unique node ID[/SIZE]

[SIZE=16.6667px]An AppleTalk [/SIZE][SIZE=16.6667px]extended network[/SIZE][SIZE=16.6667px] is one in which[/SIZE][SIZE=11.6667px]n[/SIZE][SIZE=16.6667px]the network has a range of network numbers assigned to it[/SIZE][SIZE=11.6667px]n[/SIZE][SIZE=16.6667px]the network supports multiple zone[/SIZE]s[SIZE=11.6667px]n[/SIZE][SIZE=16.6667px]each node on the network has a unique node ID (Nodes can also have different [/SIZE][SIZE=16.6667px]network numbers that fall within the network number range and different [/SIZE][SIZE=16.6667px]zone[/SIZE] names.)

Ah, ok.  So everything on the same non-bridged network has to be in the same zone.  So I guess running two a2servers with different zone names is a no-go then.  I'll have to change my zone name back to just "a2server" and give the server itself a different name to differentiate it from the stock one I fired up. 

 

[cheesestraws]

Yes, but the zone information for what nodes are available for a given network is stored by a canonical node which speaks the full Zone Information Protocol, as far as I know (I'll have to go and dig out Inside AppleTalk to check).  Even though they do not separate traffic (except multicast! which is surprisingly important...) they are still centrally defined objects, not an emergent property of the network.

So, my guess here is when you set a zone name explicitly, netatalk is going "well, nobody else is managing zone names on this network, I'd better do it", and firing up a ZIP listener (??).  If you end up with two in this situation, it might break stuff.

 

[cheesestraws]

So everything on the same non-bridged network has to be in the same zone

On an extended network (e.g. EtherTalk) there can be multiple zones per segment.  But a single node has to be responsible for maintaining the list of what zones are available.  On a non-extended network (i.e. LocalTalk, LToUDP etc), all machines must be in the same zone.

 

[pcamen]

Well, I now have two a2server instanced, both with the same zone name (in /etc/netatalk/atalkd.conf) and different host names (in /etc/hostname) and with the A2SERVER zone selected, I can see both servers.  So at least we know _that_ part works.  Now to fire up the 540c and try it with the stock a2server. 

 

[pcamen]

Oh, and BTW, I had to downgrade Virtualbox from the 6.1.x release branch to the 6.0.18 release as there is a bug that won't let a Virtualbox VM create a bridge with a thunderbolt ethernet adapter that was introduced in the 6.1 branch. 

 

[pcamen]

Okay so from the 540c running 8.1, it *can* access the stock a2server but I have the same problem on my modified one.  So something in my settings is causing the issue.  I'll keep poking around. 

And 8.1 on the 540c can see both servers now that they are on the same zone. 

 

[pcamen]

I just checked all the config files in /etc/netatalk and there are no differences other than server name. 

I did set up my modified a2server with a static IP address, so I tried changing it back to DHCP but this made

no difference.

It is really baffling.  Not sure what might be causing the issue.  I've verified with another 540c that I can get

the login prompt with the stock server but not with my modified one. 

 

[LaPorta]

Are you able to connect via the Chooser on System 7/8 with the stock one? No IPs or anything?

 

[pcamen]

Yes, it works fine.  I am now on the process of applying all my changes to the stock one to see where it might go bad. 

So far I added the MACFILES share and it works fine.  Next step making the disk larger. 

 

[pcamen]

Well, I grew the disk without issue, so that wasn't the problem.  Perhaps it is the hostname change that screwed things up. 

Anyways, I am going to just use the new VM with the larger disk; copying my files over now. 

 

[LaPorta]

I had the same bizarre situation. Given that the whole thing is a hack job of sorts, I’m amazed it works at all.