Decked out Apple IIgs vs. Decked out PLUS

[UNA_Lion]

In late '86, I was using an old Timex Sinclair 2068, and I lusted after Macintosh products. Other than the Apple IIe computers we used in high school, I knew little about Apple II computers, other than how to program them in Basic. So probably would have gone for the Mac.

 

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

If I hadn't already seen comps done on the Mac in printout from LaserWriters and Lino output, using them for projection patternmaking and screen printing, I likely would have been tempted by the IIgs as well. I liberated one on the sidewalk near the shop later on, pretty cool hardware.

I'm still using the KBD from that one! :approve:

 

[68kbits]

Would the Plus have actually had a hard drive?

No hard drive with either, I would have chosen the IIGS, might still today.

Hard drive with the Plus, I probably would have chosen a Plus.

Although, back then I would have only been interested in games, so the IIGS would probably have won out.

Tough call, did I flip flop enough?

 

[68kbits]

@NJRoadFan

Do you also boot from the CFFA card?

I am curious how the speed compares between the HD and your SCSI card.

I finally acquired a SCSI card for an Apple II, but it's just the standard model Apple SCSI, not the high speed model.

 

[NJRoadfan]

I have done informal benchmarks between the CFFA3000 and my RamFAST Rev. D SCSI card with the stock 256k cache. Keep in mind that this was done before the latest CFFA3000 firmware with improved access times.

Boot up time from power-on to desktop.

CFFA3000 (no DMA support available): 44 seconds

RamFAST (DMA Off): 41 seconds

RamFAST (DMA On): 38 seconds

The RamFAST lives up to its name, even though its connected to an old, slow Apple 40SC external hard drive. Its most noticeable when closing Finder windows (at least on a machine with a TWGS running at 12.5Mhz with 32k cache). You get a pause when the CFFA3000 writes the FINDER.DATA file information before closing the window, while it instantly closes on the SCSI drives. CFFA volumes take a second to mount when returning to Finder, while the RamFAST volumes mount instantly. Part of it is DMA and part of it is aggressive caching. Chances are you won't notice any speed difference anyway if you are running a stock 2.8Mhz IIgs.

If it wasn't bottlenecked by an 8bit 1Mhz bus, the RamFAST is likely faster than Apple's built in SCSI implementations.

 

[68kbits]

Interesting for sure. Was that with a Compact Flash card, or does it not matter USB vs compact flash?

Do you think the performance of your SCSI card would improve with a faster drive?

If I'm not mistaken you have the fastest accelerator and the fastest SCSI card made for the IIGS right?

I am looking forward to using mine with an actual SCSI drive.

 

[NJRoadfan]

The RamFAST is the fastest SCSI card for the Apple II. The Transwarp GS could run up to 16Mhz, but that requires modification and a better power supply. The law of diminishing returns kicks in though, so any speed boost over 12Mhz would be negligible. Performance of the card likely won't improve much with a faster hard drive. The Apple II bus is the bottleneck. Speed of CF vs. USB doesn't make a difference, both are so much faster compared to the host system. The CFFA3000 has more processing power than the IIgs its in!

 

[theos911]

If I were where I am now [HS Senior] in 1986 I'd be accustomed to Apple II software, so that and color would send me to the IIgs. Luckily I now have both and don't have to make a choice.

In late '86, I was using an old Timex Sinclair 2068, and I lusted after Macintosh products.

I just sold a TS1000 last month.

 

[FireBlade93RR]

that's how i got hooked, ZX81 with 1k memory, (original from Timex 1000)

as for choice, me i would take the IIgs, never had or touched a plus went from the IIgs to IIfx

 

[Gorgonops]

Gotta love how you could peel the keyboard off a ZX81/TS1000 like a sticker. Best use I ever found for one was as a source of a spare Z-80 when the one in my Tandy 4P went *poof*.

 

[Cosmo]

There you go ZX80 replica -> http://www.ebay.com/itm/ZX80-Replica-Kit-/151179082155?pt=US_Vintage_Computers_Mainframes&hash=item2332f9b9ab :lol:

 

[uniserver]

is that what these things are?

there was piles of em.

 

[mcdermd]

Yup.

 

[Gorgonops]

ZX-81s/TS-1000s were like cockroaches for a while, crawling out of the woodwork when you least expected it. Sometime around 1990 a friend of the family was given a box of three of them (two of one and one of the other models, I *think* the TS-1000s outnumbered the ZX-81s) because someone they knew heard "Oh, you don't have a computer at home? But your kid (then about five) needs to learn computers!" and thought they were helping by donating them. I was asked for help to set up their "new" computer, and upon seeing what they were given I volunteered to trade them an IBM XT I got at the government surplus depot for... what was it, $15? for the lot. No kid deserves to have a Timex Sinclair inflicted on them.

In addition to being a good source of Z-80s they did indeed make excellent doorstops.

 

[uniserver]

good i am glad i didn't go to alot of trouble to get em.

 

[mcdermd]

A close second for worthless is the Commodore Plus/4. If anyone wants one in the box, I have one for you.

 

[genie_mac]

Ah the ZX81 wasn't all that bad, very affordable when it came out (even cheaper if you built it yourself) and great for learning BASIC. But a ZX81 in 1990...

Actually neither was the Plus4, especially with a proper graphical operating system running on it in the form of GEOS (once the 3rd most popular OS in the world by sales).

Well basically you can fun with pretty much any old piece of junk if you're into that

 

[68kbits]

A close second for worthless is the Commodore Plus/4. If anyone wants one in the box, I have one for you.

Im interested in a Plus 4, looking for a 16 too...

Uniserver, did you grab any of those? I think both the sinclair and the Plus were pretty much only used with tape drives.

That kit is interesting, but for that much money I think I would pay the extra and build an Apple 1 clone.

 

[FireBlade93RR]

yeah the keyboard of the ZX81 was the first thing to go, i replaced it with a keyboard of a mainframe workstation where i re-wired the individual keys,

then built a wooden enclosure for the keyboard where the whole ZX81 board fitted under, like a VIC-20 / Comodore 64 type.

i might still have it somewhere at my parent's place with all my other childhood stuff

 

[68kbits]

That would be pretty cool to see.

I have 2 of then I think. I can't remember of they are the same model or not.

I need to hook up an old TV and see of they still work.