Am I too dumb to burn a pre-OSX CD?

Be careful. I'm not quite sure if the Mac_OS_8.5.toast_.zip (first entry in the list) would be bootable. I had a look at the image: Disk Utility doesn't detect any partitions. file does however, but doesn't list the partitions as in the German image. Maybe this is just the HFS partition? It would probably boot SheepShaver but not a real Mac. Are you sure you didn't accidentally download this image?

The (renamed) Mac_OS_8.5.toast_.zip image:


The tested and working German image (MacOS85_DE.ZIP):

Hey thanks!

I have checked again it was the (MacOS85_DE.ZIP) The file is still on my iMac.
Your "file" screenshot says processor 68000. But I use a PPC 603e/200
Now

- I download MacOS85_DE.ZIP from macintoshgarden from the .de mirror

- Unzip it (using onboard tools)?

- rename .toast to .iso or extend .toast to .toast.iso?

- then burn with right click using disc utility?

I am just extra precise so that we use the same prrocess, just different machines.

Moloko said:

Do I have to find an old MacMini with 10.4? Or use a virtual Machine and MacOS Tiger?

Click to expand...

<record mode='scratched'>I have a mac mini G4 running Mac OS 9.2.2 and it is great for downloading images, making images and burning images. I strongly recommend getting one and putting Mac OS 9.2.2 onto it.</record>

I'll burn a post you out a burnt copy of Mac OS 8.5 & the Mac OS 8.6 Update on 2x CDs if you like but it means you will have to send me your address by PM. Giving your address to strangers on the Internet is not usually recommended so I'll let you weigh up the pros & cons.

In general, read up on what @MrFahrenheit has to say. He is knowledgable in this area. He has posted above and he also has an excellent post on the Macintosh Garden.

And, because of your handle, I have this song back worming through my ears:

The 68000 thing doesn't matter. Many things in the early PPC era were still emulated.

Your description looks ok. Likely the renaming isn't even required on Mac OS. I appended .iso, but replacing the .toast with .iso should be equivalent. Just be sure the file is really renamed (a dialog will pop up) and not just changed from xxx.toast to xxx.toast.iso.toast with invisible extension. This didn't happen in my case though.

Best run the file command before burning and make sure the output looks the same as in my case. This isn't required of course but is the last chance to verify the image quality.

Disk utility isn't directly involved in the burning.

I made a screen recording for you:

Edit: Choosing Eject after burning ("Medium auswerfen") is probably more convenient...

View attachment Disk burning with Finder.mov

Nope.

Did exactly how you described it and burned the disc on BigSur and on 10.6.8 (which AGAIN burned the CD as extended!!!!!!)

I ask myself if the problem is with the hardware. I get a happy mac, then the CD starts to read/boot and then it does nothing anymore.

The only different thing from a standard Performa is that I fitted the Performa with a IMS Twin Turbo. I have a Matrox Millennium in my storage which I will try tomorrow.

As said before the disc can be read on my Performa. I also haven’t found any known Problems with the Performa and OS 8.5 I already searched on google, duckduckgo, brave, bing and even yandex (which btw. is great if you search for old Hardware info, including schematics etc.!!!)

Nevertheless thanks for your help!

Now this is very strange. Did you use the same technique (using Finder only) when burning on 10.6? Booting up to a happy Mac would indicate that the CD was burned somehow correctly. Do you have another CD drive to use in your Mac for booting? Can you send a screenshot of Disk Utility in 10.6 with the "Mac OS Extended" disk mounted. (or maybe just the output of diskutil list?)

robin-fo said:

Now this is very strange. Did you use the same technique (using Finder only) when burning on 10.6? Booting up to a happy Mac would indicate that the CD was burned somehow correctly. Do you have another CD drive to use in your Mac for booting? Can you send a screenshot of Disk Utility in 10.6 with the "Mac OS Extended" disk mounted. (or maybe just the output of diskutil list?)

Click to expand...

Happy Mac only seems to mean it has found an OS. Badly formed bootable disks often hang at that point.

Phipli said:

Happy Mac only seems to mean it has found an OS. Badly formed bootable disks often hang at that point.

Click to expand...

More or less, yes - it means it thinks it's found an OS. I think it gets put up as soon as it finds valid boot blocks - so if a disc used to have an OS on it but it doesn't any more, or that OS is corrupted, it can certainly get a happy mac.

True, but as long as we assume that the CD, burner and Image are working correctly, I'm now quite inclined to blame the vintage Mac...

robin-fo said:

True, but as long as we assume that the CD, burner and Image are working correctly, I'm now quite inclined to blame the vintage Mac...

Click to expand...

You're assuming a lot there.

Well the Image and the burning software I verified myself; if the burned CD was verified successfully, we can also almost be sure that the burning hardware is also working correctly... So a not quite so weak assumption (?)

robin-fo said:

Well the Image and the burning software I verified myself; if the burned CD was verified successfully, we can also almost be sure that the burning hardware is also working correctly... So a not quite so weak assumption (?)

Click to expand...

I'm think about how the disk is writing as HFS+ in some scenarios. That means the burning software is likely modifying the image. If it is changing that, it doesn't bode well for keeping it bootable.

But I'm probably missing something, the thread has got long and I'm out of touch with macs post about 10.9.

Moloko said:

Nope.

Did exactly how you described it and burned the disc on BigSur and on 10.6.8 (which AGAIN burned the CD as extended!!!!!!)

I ask myself if the problem is with the hardware. I get a happy mac, then the CD starts to read/boot and then it does nothing anymore.

The only different thing from a standard Performa is that I fitted the Performa with a IMS Twin Turbo. I have a Matrox Millennium in my storage which I will try tomorrow.

As said before the disc can be read on my Performa. I also haven’t found any known Problems with the Performa and OS 8.5 I already searched on google, duckduckgo, brave, bing and even yandex (which btw. is great if you search for old Hardware info, including schematics etc.!!!)

Nevertheless thanks for your help!

Click to expand...

Is there any chance someone has replaced your CD drive with an aftermarket one?

robin-fo said:

Now this is very strange. Did you use the same technique (using Finder only) when burning on 10.6? Booting up to a happy Mac would indicate that the CD was burned somehow correctly. Do you have another CD drive to use in your Mac for booting? Can you send a screenshot of Disk Utility in 10.6 with the "Mac OS Extended" disk mounted. (or maybe just the output of diskutil list?)

Click to expand...

I don't have another CD Rom drive. You need a Apple 1 with these old amchines. AND it works with 7.5. and 7.6

robin-fo said:

True, but as long as we assume that the CD, burner and Image are working correctly, I'm now quite inclined to blame the vintage Mac...

Click to expand...

But the 7.6 from macos9lives had worked without any problem.

Moloko said:

AND it works with 7.5. and 7.6

Click to expand...

That's good to know. Not the drive or computer like you said.

Phipli said:

Is there any chance someone has replaced your CD drive with an aftermarket one?

Click to expand...

the imac has the original Optiarc Drive (device delivered by Apple)
On my Macbook I use a Hitachi external USB Burner via USB3. Never had a problem, but I also only burned 2 CDs so far

Here is the "file" info from the 7.6.1 CD from macos9lives:

Last login: Mon Oct 23 22:50:50 on ttys000
johngalt@MBP-von-John ~ % file /Users/johngalt/Desktop/MacOS7.6.toast
/Users/johngalt/Desktop/MacOS7.6.toast: Apple Driver Map, blocksize 2048, blockcount 0, devtype 1, devid 1, driver count 2, contains[@0x200]: Apple Partition Map, map block count 5, start block 64, block count 128, name Macintosh, type Apple_Driver43, processor 68000, valid, allocated, in use, has boot info, readable, writable, pic boot code, contains[@0x400]: Apple Partition Map, map block count 5, start block 192, block count 128, name Macintosh, type Apple_Driver_ATAPI, processor 68000, valid, allocated, in use, has boot info, readable, writable, pic boot code, contains[@0x600]: Apple Partition Map, map block count 5, start block 320, block count 476739, name MacOS, type Apple_HFS, valid, allocated, in use, readable, chain compatible driver, contains[@0x800]: Apple Partition Map, map block count 5, start block 477059, block count 1641085, name Extra, type Apple_Free, valid, allocated, in use, readable, writable, contains[@0xA00]: Apple Partition Map, map block count 5, start block 1, block count 63, name Apple, type Apple_partition_map, valid, allocated, in use, readable, writable
johngalt@MBP-von-John ~ %

It differs quite a bit from the file info of the 8.5 ISO especially with the boot info!

I really wonder if these OS images are real duplicates or just data copies. Because if I remember right, a data copy doesn't copy/retain the "bleesed" bit of the system and finder. This would also explain, why I can run the installer but not boot from the harddisk after install.

Moloko said:

This would be very nice. Is it a working retail CD?
I live in germany, so no need to sent them.

Somewhen between 2002 and 2010 I must have missed something.
I think it would have been cheaper to get a used Macmini, iMac or Macbook with G4/Tiger. Becaue these systems also have working appletalk.

Click to expand...

Yes I have working retail install CDs, but only US English region ones.

I’m convinced that it’s likely:

1. A bad ISO extract (unless someone else has confirmed the file is good by burning it already and testing, I see lots of messages and haven’t read them all) or;

2. Somehow you’re missing a step or introducing a step.

Anyway, my offer is there if you want a pair of CDs mailed out. Reach out by DM if you would like that or want me to extract and upload my 8.5 CD.