Am I too dumb to burn a pre-OSX CD?

[Moloko]

Hi,

It seems to me, that I am no longer able to make usable CDs anymore.

First, what I have available:

iMac 12,1 MacOS 10.6.8, Burn 1.7.21u, Toast 8 and 11

MacMini 6,1 Mac OS 10.9.5 and Burn 3.1.6

MacbookPro 11,4 and Burn 3.1.7

and multiple 8.5 images (toast and ISO)

After finding out that some of the „universal installers“ are G3 installers and some of the toast and ISO images contain MacOS-X files i found an image which looked okay. A universal installer, no machine specific stuff.
It burns okay on my iMac using burn. and the iMac shows HFS Standard.
Yes

But no.......

Untill now I’ve ruined 25 CD-Rs and not one does work.
And I don’t know what I am doing wrong as a 7.6 CD I’ve burned works without any flaw.


Please tell me how I can burn an old bootable MacOS 8.5 on a CD with some modern Hardware.

I know the problem with HFS. But the 7.6 disc is also HFS and there was no problem.

Do I have to find an old MacMini with 10.4? Or use a virtual Machine and MacOS Tiger?

I have never had so many problems with Macs sine I have started this SSD-journey.

At least the CF Card and SD-Card adapters work.

Does someone have any idea?
Thank you!

 

[chelseayr]

I presume you have already tried the generic (plain or international one on top yeah) 8.5 from here? https://macintoshgarden.org/apps/mac-os-85-851-update
and just curious if do you not have a rewrite disc on hand?
either way I would think that osx version might not be really a problem since you're not using the built-in disc tool but I might be wrong about that tho (having used burn app myself a bit too, next to an old copy of toast on a 10.4-running ibook)

 

[volvo242gt]

I've burned an OS 9 CD on a mid-2010 MBP, running 10.9.5. Used Disk Utility. Had to add .iso to the disk image's filename, then Disk Utility had no problem burning it. I've also burned many discs with utilities and installers that I chose myself that were readable on the CD-ROM drive on my old Centris 650, running System 7.6.1, using the same MacBook.

So, maybe try Disk Utility and see how it goes.

 

[MrFahrenheit]

If you have an ISO file, you can burn it on virtually any operating system or program that supports ISO, all the way back to 1990 and even on present day hardware.

I successfully burned an ISO last week of a 25 year old Mac bootable CD using IngBurn and a BluRay burner on Windows 11.

As long as you’re dealing with pure ISO files it doesn’t matter what you use.

Now, as far as drive compatibility reading the discs you’re writing, that’s another kettle of fish. Make sure they are CDR (not CDRW), and that you burn them on the slowest possible CD burning setting (usually 1x, 2x, or 4x).

I’ve found the best blank media for me are Verbatim AZO CDR. They seem to read in the most players, and often did back in the 90s too.

Additionally, if you are using 700MB blank media, many older CDROM drives won’t read them properly.

 

[Moloko]

MacOS 10.6.8 / disc utility

ISO under 640 MB

right click „burn to CD/DVD“

Select slowest available burn speed (8x)


GETS BURNED AS MacOS Extended!
NO! WHY?

same iso
MacOS 10.6.8 / burn 1.7.21u

same as above

drag iso into copy tab

hit burn

can’t change burning speed

burns as HFS standard

won’t boot from CD

installer works, restart nothing happens!

and I also used the original HDD to eliminate a probable problem with the IDE/SD/CF

Maybe I wasn’t clear enough: I don’t have a G3 or G4 system. It’s a Performa 6400 which used to run MacOS 9.1 some 20 years ago. So it is not a compability issue with the operating system.

I now have 3 CD-Rs left.

Does anybody have a link to a working OS 8.5 or 8.6 which is direct copy (duplicate) of the original CD?

The ones on macos9lives (G3 Disc, although described as universal), macintoshrepository and macintoshgarden (some have OSX files and or folders on them!) don’t work.

My guess is: the system and finder are not blessed because the CDs are data copies and not duplicates.

As I said before: the OS 7.6 (macos9lives)which I burned on my iMacOS with 10.6.8 using burn worked without any problem.

 

[Phipli]

If you have an ISO file, you can burn it on virtually any operating system or program that supports ISO, all the way back to 1990 and even on present day hardware.

There are a small number of programs that apparently meddle with even isos... I've heard that very recent versions of Disk Utility do, or the OS built in burning stuff in MacOS, but I only have other people's word for this and am just mentioning it because others said it.

Additionally, if you are using 700MB blank media, many older CDROM drives won’t read them properly.

I've only heard of this with really old drives. I believe the original Apple external caddy drive, the AppleCD SC, doesn't support 700MB disks, but even the revised, but in the same case, AppleCD SC Plus, does support 700MB disks.

I haven't seen a drive that doesn't work with 700MB disks.

MacOS 10.6.8 / disc utility

ISO under 640 MB

right click „burn to CD/DVD“

Select slowest available burn speed (8x)


GETS BURNED AS MacOS Extended!
NO! WHY?

same iso
MacOS 10.6.8 / burn 1.7.21u

same as above

drag iso into copy tab

hit burn

can’t change burning speed

burns as HFS standard

won’t boot from CD

installer works, restart nothing happens!

and I also used the original HDD to eliminate a probable problem with the IDE/SD/CF

Maybe I wasn’t clear enough: I don’t have a G3 or G4 system. It’s a Performa 6400 which used to run MacOS 9.1 some 20 years ago. So it is not a compability issue with the operating system.

I now have 3 CD-Rs left.

Does anybody have a link to a working OS 8.5 or 8.6 which is direct copy (duplicate) of the original CD?

The ones on macos9lives (G3 Disc, although described as universal), macintoshrepository and macintoshgarden (some have OSX files and or folders on them!) don’t work.

My guess is: the system and finder are not blessed because the CDs are data copies and not duplicates.

As I said before: the OS 7.6 (macos9lives)which I burned on my iMacOS with 10.6.8 using burn worked without any problem.

Install Toast on your 10.6 machine and burn with that. If it doesn't work still, it is probably a bad image.
Edit : Toast link here

GETS BURNED AS MacOS Extended!
NO! WHY?

Apple thinks they know better than you.

 

[Moloko]

Apple thinks they know better than you.

That is why I don't buy Apple products anymore and I also won't recoomend ANY Apple product anymore. Since OS 10.6.8 it is only downhill.

So, now I am down to one CD-R. Burned the images (2 differnet ones) with Toast 11....does not work

It is not the 700MB discs as old backups from this machine which were made in 2002 using 700MB CDs can be read, the data be transfered and they work.

I have the suspicion, that I am not expressing myself clear enough:

I need:

- a working and TESTED on PRE-G3 PowerPC (preferably 603e) Mac OS 8.5 .iso or any other burnable image of the original MacOS 8.5 installer CD.
- a method to burn the CD using the HFS STANDARD format (I still have a HP 8200/XP and a Lenovo T440 Notebook/Linux Mint).

Otherwise I have to look out for a 8.5 original, which are nearly impossible to get.
Maybe I can use my S900 I still have my external SCSI CD Burner

 

[Phipli]

That is why I don't buy Apple products anymore and I also won't recoomend ANY Apple product anymore. Since OS 10.6.8 it is only downhill.

So, now I am down to one CD-R. Burned the images (2 differnet ones) with Toast 11....does not work

It is not the 700MB discs as old backups from this machine which were made in 2002 using 700MB CDs can be read, the data be transfered and they work.

I have the suspicion, that I am not expressing myself clear enough:

I need:

- a working and TESTED on PRE-G3 PowerPC (preferably 603e) Mac OS 8.5 .iso or any other burnable image of the original MacOS 8.5 installer CD.
- a method to burn the CD using the HFS STANDARD format (I still have a HP 8200/XP and a Lenovo T440 Notebook/Linux Mint).

Otherwise I have to look out for a 8.5 original, which are nearly impossible to get.
Maybe I can use my S900 I still have my external SCSI CD Burner

Does the CD mount on the desktop when you boot from something else?

Bear with me.

 

[MrFahrenheit]

That is why I don't buy Apple products anymore and I also won't recoomend ANY Apple product anymore. Since OS 10.6.8 it is only downhill.

So, now I am down to one CD-R. Burned the images (2 differnet ones) with Toast 11....does not work

It is not the 700MB discs as old backups from this machine which were made in 2002 using 700MB CDs can be read, the data be transfered and they work.

I have the suspicion, that I am not expressing myself clear enough:

I need:

- a working and TESTED on PRE-G3 PowerPC (preferably 603e) Mac OS 8.5 .iso or any other burnable image of the original MacOS 8.5 installer CD.
- a method to burn the CD using the HFS STANDARD format (I still have a HP 8200/XP and a Lenovo T440 Notebook/Linux Mint).

Otherwise I have to look out for a 8.5 original, which are nearly impossible to get.
Maybe I can use my S900 I still have my external SCSI CD Burner

I’ll extract my original Mac OS 8.5 CD for you and upload it somewhere for you to try. If it fails, I’ll try to make good duplicates and send them to you without any cost. How does that sound?

 

[volvo242gt]

Remember, I mentioned that I was able to access burned media on my old Centris 650, which was a 68040 machine. A couple generations older than a PowerPC 603 series powered machine. IIRC, I even booted it using a burned disc from my MBP.

 

[Moloko]

Does the CD mount on the desktop when you boot from something else?

Yes.
I can even install from such a CD. But it wont boot, even when using the original Apple HDD.

 

[robin-fo]

That is why I don't buy Apple products anymore and I also won't recoomend ANY Apple product anymore. Since OS 10.6.8 it is only downhill.

I know exactly why I buy and recommend Apple products

Here you go:

Just tested using a M1 Pro MacBook Pro, Mac OS 12 and external Apple USB SuperDrive with empty 700MB EMTEC CD-ROM:

- Using the Image file MacOS85_DE.ZIP from https://macintoshgarden.org/apps/mac-os-85-851-update
- Download & unzip; added .iso as extension to the image file (.toast should be identical to .iso)
- Right click on the image file -> Burn on CD/DVD... (or similar)
- Choose any speed you want (I used 24x)
- Burn it.

Nicely boots my PowerBook 1400cs...

 

[Moloko]

I’ll extract my original Mac OS 8.5 CD for you and upload it somewhere for you to try. If it fails, I’ll try to make good duplicates and send them to you without any cost. How does that sound?

This would be very nice. Is it a working retail CD?
I live in germany, so no need to sent them.

Somewhen between 2002 and 2010 I must have missed something.
I think it would have been cheaper to get a used Macmini, iMac or Macbook with G4/Tiger. Becaue these systems also have working appletalk.

 

[robin-fo]

I can also try with a PPC or Intel Mac mini using the internal drive if you want...

 

[Moloko]

I know exactly why I buy and recommend Apple products

Here you go:

Just tested using a M1 Pro MacBook Pro, Mac OS 12 and external Apple USB SuperDrive with empty 700MB EMTEC CD-ROM:

- Using the Image file MacOS85_DE.ZIP from https://macintoshgarden.org/apps/mac-os-85-851-update
- Download & unzip; added .iso as extension to the image file (.toast should be identical to .iso)
- Right click on the image file -> Burn on CD/DVD... (or similar)
- Choose any speed you want (I used 24x)
- Burn it.

Nicely boots my PowerBook 1400cs...

I am willing to try that exact iso file, which I have used now 5 times. Btw I alwys downloaded it from .de mirror. Maybe there is a corruption with the mirrors? Which mirror did you use?

 

[Moloko]

I can also try with a PPC or Intel Mac mini using the internal drive if you want...

A test with a PPC would be nice.

 

[robin-fo]

ok, which image would you want me to try?

Edit: I only have 10.3 Server on my 2005 PPC Mac mini. On the Intel mini I have 10.5 or alternatively 10.6 on my MacBook Pro 6,2. Which one fits you best? I'm 99.99% sure it will be equally well on all of them...

 

[Moloko]

ok, which image would you want me to try?

Well I alwys used the Mac_OS_8.5.toast_.zip from the .de mirror.

I will burn on a MacBook Pro 11,4 / BigSur. Maybe Apple did add something to the newer OSs?

 

[robin-fo]

Just out of curiosity: Why not the German version (MacOS85_DE.ZIP) if you are from Germany?

 

[Moloko]

Just out of curiosity: Why not the German version (MacOS85_DE.ZIP) if you are from Germany?

typo from my side I meant the MacOS85_DE.ZIP.