setting up a G4 Tower Quicksilver 933 MHz

[Byte Knight]

Sorry I'm late to the party, but it took me a while to look up all the mods I've done to my Quicksilver over the years. It's my goto OS9 machine! Here's what I've done to mine:

-Added 128MB ATI Radeon 9250 PCI card (Mac version) - Quake Arena and Unreal Tournament really fly!
-Added 2.5in 128GB IDE SSD from DosLabs - boots into OS9 in about 45 seconds and SATA was too buggy for me
-Added Tango 2.0 Firewire 400/USB 2.0 Combo Card - mainly to use USB thumb drives
-Added Adaptic 2906 SCSI Card - for playing around with PiSCSI
-Added CircuitTalk G4 - for a serial port instead of the built-in modem so I can use a wifi modem with it
-Upgraded the CPU to 1.27GHz from 800 MHz
-Upgraded the CD RW drive to a DVD/CD RW drive.

With this setup, I can hook up just about any peripheral to it.

 

[bigmessowires]

@Byte Knight that all sounds awesome. I love your avatar. I'll be ending with many similar upgrades to yours: SSD, USB 2.0, SCSI.

Added CircuitTalk G4 - for a serial port instead of the built-in modem so I can use a wifi modem with it

That looks interesting, but there's not much info in the linked post, and the original post has lost all its images. What kind of serial port is it? Where is it mounted? How do you connect a WiFi modem? LocalTalk?? It sounds like maybe it's a two-part system, with different options for the external part?

Upgraded the CPU to 1.27GHz from 800 MHz

What should I be looking for if I want to explore a CPU upgrade? Like this Dual G4 867 MHz card? It seems suspiciously cheap, so I'm probably missing something. https://www.ebay.com/itm/166386283242 Can the CPU modules from a MDD be used in a Quicksilver?

Upgraded the CD RW drive to a DVD/CD RW drive.

Mine has the SuperDrive. It works, but it's loud and rattles like an old train. I'm trying to decide if it annoys me enough to be worth replacing. I can always use a USB 2.0 DVD drive.

I'm having some problems with sleep and my SATA controller card, which seems to be a common issue with Quicksilvers. I did a little research and ordered a new voltage regulator to replace the one on the card, which is rumored to fix the issue. We'll see.

This afternoon I finally had a chance to try out the replacement graphics card that I'd bought. The original card is a 64 MB GeForce4 MX with ADC and VGA ports, while the new card is a 32 MB GeForce4 MX with ADC and DVI ports. In a way it's a downgrade, except that I mainly wanted a DVI port. Running the Quicksilver at 1920x1080 on a modern monitor is very very nice!

I used XBench to compare the two graphics cards, and surprisingly the new 32 MB card was about 5-10 percent faster in the tests. But I'm not sure XBench's tests are really testing 3D performance - they seem mostly focused on 2D stuff. There was a test with some spinning 3D shapes, but they were untextured and unshaded, plus one other test with textured squares spinning in a 2D plane. There was nothing like a 3D animation benchmark where I would expect the 32 MB card to fall behind the 64 MB one. But since I'm not much of a FPS gamer, I don't really care and I'm happy to have the DVI port.

One minor headache that isn't the Quicksilver's fault: I'm using the same monitor for the Quicksilver and for my main desktop computer, with the QS connected on DVI and the desktop connected on HDMI. Switching between the inputs is a confusing sequence of pushes on a set of six unlabeled multi-function buttons, and I always get it wrong when I'm trying to go fast. Then once I've selected a different input, the display remains black for several seconds until the new image finally appears. It sounds trivial, but it's annoying enough to make me want a second independent monitor just for the QS, but I don't really have desk space for that. I wish the monitor had fast input switching through a set of single-purpose dedicated buttons.

 

[cobalt60]

Can the CPU modules from a MDD be used in a Quicksilver?

No

this Dual G4 867 MHz card? It seems suspiciously cheap

Its for a MDD, and is the slowest CPU module they came with

32 MB card was about 5-10 percent faster in the tests.

VRAM really doesnt make for a faster video card. Similar to how more RAM doesnt make your computer faster if youre not using the quantity you currently have. More VRAM allows you to load larger textures, but when most games textures fit within 32MB, 64MB if of little benefit. More important for performance are GPU speed, VRAM speed, GPU features, etc.

 

[bigmessowires]

I discovered something sad about this 32MB GeForce4 MX with DVI. At the OSX desktop it works perfectly, with a nice image. But at the boot selector menu, or in OS9, it's a sea of noisy pixels with a barely discernible image and the monitor repeatedly loses sync or just goes black. A couple of times I saw "out of range" pop up briefly. It's like the video timings are wrong when you're not in the OSX desktop. I tried both 1920x1080 and 1280x1024 resolutions with the same result. Perhaps it's a limitation of my monitor (a relatively new Asus 2K display), but it makes the graphics card essentially unusable. I'm sad because when it works, the image is lovely.

 

[cobalt60]

What should I be looking for if I want to explore a CPU upgrade?

In your situation (you have a 933MHz G4), the only stock modules you can use as an upgrade are a dual 800MHz and a dual 1GHz, both from QuickSilver (again, MDD modules will not work). The dual 1GHz QS modules are rare, and probably usually somewhat pricey.

However, aftermarket CPU upgrades from companies like PowerLogix, Sonnet, GigaDesigns, etc. are fairly commonly available from 1.3GHz to 1.8GHz. I believe almost all aftermarket CPU upgrades will work for your system. Upgrades for MDD are rare. Most upgrades are designed to be compatible with both 100MHz (Sawtooth, Gigabit Ethernet) and 133MHz (Digital Audio, QuickSilver) systems. For sure, anything that works in a Digital Audio will also work in your QuickSilver.

Here's a 1.8GHz, though it's pricey, but they'll take best offer:

1.8GHz CPU Upgrade Accelerator for Apple PowerMac G4 SpeedStar/ Sonnet Encore ST | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for 1.8GHz CPU Upgrade Accelerator for Apple PowerMac G4 SpeedStar/ Sonnet Encore ST at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!

www.ebay.com

 

[herd]

A 933MHz G4 with L3 cache is a pretty good CPU for a Quicksilver. The top of the line from apple was a Dual 1GHz CPU. So you could look for one of those, otherwise there were many different aftermarket upgrades made; there are modified CPUs, overclocked CPUs, etc. These generally top out around Dual 2GHz.

For the different screens, you could VNC (or similar) from one machine to the other. This is pretty convenient for most things, but it may not be fast enough for games or movies.

I'm glad you are enjoying your new Quicksilver!

 

[cobalt60]

And if you look at full systems, occasionally you can find ones with nice upgrades already installed:

Vintage Apple Power Macintosh G4 Graphite PCI Graphics Tower No HDD Or OS | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for Vintage Apple Power Macintosh G4 Graphite PCI Graphics Tower No HDD Or OS at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!

www.ebay.com

and if you don't want to pay all that shipping, can contact them and possibly buy just the CPU. I am guessing that was a 1.3GHz CPU but really no idea.

 

[Byte Knight]

That looks interesting, but there's not much info in the linked post, and the original post has lost all its images. What kind of serial port is it? Where is it mounted? How do you connect a WiFi modem? LocalTalk?? It sounds like maybe it's a two-part system, with different options for the external part?

The serial port is the standard Mini DIN-8 and can be used for AppleTalk or serial devices. The card is mounted where the modem sits and then a cable runs to the phone jack which is in turn replaced by a serial jack. You can connect a wifi modem via a Mac modem cable (Mini DIN-8 male to DB25 male).

What should I be looking for if I want to explore a CPU upgrade? Like this Dual G4 867 MHz card? It seems suspiciously cheap, so I'm probably missing something. https://www.ebay.com/itm/166386283242 Can the CPU modules from a MDD be used in a Quicksilver?

I got mine from herd here, and he's still selling them. I kept the upgrade simple so it would be compatible with OS9 and also use my existing heatsink. And since I mainly run OS9, I don't really have the need for a dual processor as OS9 doesn't take much advantage of it.

One minor headache that isn't the Quicksilver's fault: I'm using the same monitor for the Quicksilver and for my main desktop computer, with the QS connected on DVI and the desktop connected on HDMI. Switching between the inputs is a confusing sequence of pushes on a set of six unlabeled multi-function buttons, and I always get it wrong when I'm trying to go fast. Then once I've selected a different input, the display remains black for several seconds until the new image finally appears. It sounds trivial, but it's annoying enough to make me want a second independent monitor just for the QS, but I don't really have desk space for that. I wish the monitor had fast input switching through a set of single-purpose dedicated buttons.

I've got an old 23" LCD Apple Cinema Display that my QS shares with my Mac Mini which runs my BBS. I switch between the two DVI outputs with a KVM switcher.

 

[volvo242gt]

Basically, the CircuitTalk is a recreation of the old Griffin gPort. Still need to get one for my G4. Re: monitor, you could probably stuff the 17" Studio Display sideways to get it out of the way when not needed.

 

[Phipli]

Switching between the inputs is a confusing sequence of pushes on a set of six unlabeled multi-function buttons, and I always get it wrong when I'm trying to go fast

Ah, a Dell monitor then. My Dell monitor you can't even see where the buttons /are/.

 

[Phipli]

I tried both 1920x1080 and 1280x1024 resolutions with the same result.

What about the refresh rate? Aim for 60hz. Go to the Monitors control panel, select "All" instead of recommended and pick a 60hz option.

 

[bigmessowires]

The problems with the DVI graphics card may simply be a bad card. Today when I booted the Quicksilver, the OSX desktop showed the same pixel noise and glitchy image that I'd seen in OS9 and the boot menu yesterday. Changing to a lower resolution "fixed" it, then I changed back to 1920x1080 again and it continued working. But after rebooting, it returned to the glitchy image behavior. I tried a different DVI cable and verified the cable was secure at both ends. Looking at the card, I don't see any signs of damage or leaky caps. Darn.

The monitor is a fairly new Asus PB258Q 2560x1440.

I switched back to the original graphics card, and 1920x1080@60 with a 15-pin VGA cable works in OSX, OS9, and the boot menu. The image quality is definitely fuzzier than with DVI, and there's some minor ghosting, but it's acceptable. I can set the monitor for 1:1 display and the image will be sharper, but the ghosting is still present and the 1920x1080 image looks a bit silly when inset on a 2560x1440 monitor. The ghosting is much less evident in OSX than OS9, thanks to OSX's use of shadows around UI elements instead of hard edges with high contrast. 1280x720 gives the sharpest image since it's exactly 1/4 the native resolution of the monitor, but it's a bit too low-res for me.

Along the way I discovered some interesting things about USB device handling at the boot menu. My Razer Basilisk mouse works fine in OSX and OS9, but doesn't really work at this boot menu - it behaves like the mouse speed is set to ultra slow, but a second Apple Pro mouse connected at the same time behaved normally. I also found that the boot menu won't detect USB mice if they're plugged in after reaching the menu. They need to be plugged in first before the menu pops up.

 

[Phipli]

I don't see any signs of damage or leaky caps.

So, that is a point actually. Caps from that era don't tend to leak like 68k macs, but there was an issue in the sort of 2000 to 2005 era where some caps were used that failed early, they just went dry and lost their capacitance. Remove one and check if it is in spec?

I had a Radeon 7000 that none of the electrolytic caps had any capacitance at all. Amazingly it still worked, but the VGA output shimmered. Replacing them fixed it.

 

[Forrest]

The ATI Radeon 8500 and 9000 were the best cards for gaming IMHO. The Radeon 7000 was a low end gaming card. Note the fan on these cards get loud after 3-4 years, so you need to install a new one, which is a simple task. Ball bearing fans tend to last longer.

 

[volvo242gt]

I've also had better luck with ATi cards than the nVidia cards, both on Mac and PC systems. The nVidia card in my original G4 Digital Audio failed within a month of my getting the computer. Bought my second G4 DA off of craigslist, then combined the two into one machine that I then used for another five years. That one had a Rage 128 Pro in it. Near the end of my time with it, I was mainly using it with OS X, rarely booting into 9.2.2, so the Radeon 9700 and 9800 cards I used were fine. Current G4 has the ATi Radeon 9000 Pro that came with my last MDD.

I've had a couple Dell laptops with failed nVidia chips. One was an Inspiron 8600 that worked once I swapped a Radeon 9600 in place of the geForce 5200(?), the other was a Latitude D830 that had its Quadro GPU fail. Replaced that machine with one that had the Intel integrated graphics chip. We have another that's rarely used, but seems ok. Did replace the thermal paste on both the GPU and the CPU when I replaced the 2.2GHz merom C2D chip with a 2.5GHz penryn C2D chip, so it probably will be fine for a bit longer.

 

[bigmessowires]

I enjoyed Quinn, thanks for the recommendation @LaPorta. The gameplay feels very fluid and well-polished, but I'd say the difficulty increases too slowly, and it needs more varied sounds. And music.

I couldn't get Stronghold to run, it kept complaining that I needed the CD in the drive even when the ISO was mounted. I also downloaded the "No CD" addition, which seems like it's just a disk image meant to fool the game into thinking the CD is there, but it doesn't. Do I need to burn a physical disc?

I tried the Call of Duty demo - pretty impressive! Though I worked in the video game industry for decades, I was never into FPS games and haven't really touched one since Quake.

Civilization III was the game I was most excited for. I absolutely played the hell out of Civ 1 during the early 90s, and there were several times when "just one more turn" led me to keep playing all night until dawn. So I started the game, explored a bit, founded my first city, and then realized I had no interest in playing any further. Maybe my interests have changed in 30 years.

Since I'm not really playing anything 3D intensive, I'm going to stick with the 64 MB GeForce4 with slightly-fuzzy VGA output. Or else I'll go back to that Apple Studio Display with ADC connector that I can't seem to give away.

 

[LaPorta]

I enjoyed Quinn, thanks for the recommendation @LaPorta. The gameplay feels very fluid and well-polished, but I'd say the difficulty increases too slowly, and it needs more varied sounds. And music.

I couldn't get Stronghold to run, it kept complaining that I needed the CD in the drive even when the ISO was mounted. I also downloaded the "No CD" addition, which seems like it's just a disk image meant to fool the game into thinking the CD is there, but it doesn't. Do I need to burn a physical disc?

Since I'm not really playing anything 3D intensive, I'm going to stick with the 64 MB GeForce4 with slightly-fuzzy VGA output. Or else I'll go back to that Apple Studio Display with ADC connector that I can't seem to give away.

Quinn never did have the feel of TetrisMax, but then again I didn’t have much choice at that point in time! I happened upon it when I got my 2006 MBP, and by that time Classic was long gone, along with any chance at TetrisMax.

I think you may need the burnt disc. I can check and see. I don’t recall because I actually own the real game and didn’t have a need to mount an image.

Can’t seem to give away?? I thought there were a few interested parties.

 

[LaPorta]

Confirmed: you do indeed need the burned disc. Guess it’s smart like that.

 

[indibil]

Hi!

To have wifi in my older macs with OS 9 i use this adapter. It connects to wifi, but the connection with the computer is with ethernet cable, and it is powered with USB connector. Very easy and compatible.

https://es.aliexpress.com/item/1005...t_main.21.64f9194d9Le95C&gatewayAdapt=glo2esp

 

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

Read the beginning of the thread today and have a suggestion for the QS stuck Zip disk fix. My QS is on the fritz ATM, but when I get it up and running again it'll have had a 1/16" hole drilled in the Zip bezel right over the manual eject button. Dumb ( | ) design over function decision.

Apple dropped Zip support in the MDD series so Iomega made their own with a Zip750. They put a nice hole in the mirror for manual eject. Not JIvesian design correctness, but function trumps hidebound design directions.

On Graphite DA you can stick something down into the slot to push the button, but drilling that tiny hole would be a lot more efficient.

Quick question: what's the key combo for forcing boot from CD of Graphite/QS and MDD?


edit: if you're lucky enough to find the MDD Zip750 kit, leave the Zip750 drive in the box and install Zip250 for full Zip100 compatibility.

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