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Need help connecting PowerBook 230 to a LAN and to the Web

D

Doctor Dave

Active member
I'm beginning to wonder if the problem is either in the AsanteTalk device or in the PowerBook or Duo Dock.

I added "eth0" to my atalkd.conf file and restarted my Linux box. Now I get:

dave@quad:/etc/netatalk$ atalkd

eth0: Operation not permitted

Can't configure multicast.

eth0: multicast may not work correctly.

eth0: disabled.

atalkd: zero interfaces, exiting.

dave@quad:/etc/netatalk$ nbplkup

quad:AFPServer 65280.108:128

quad:netatalk 65280.108:4

quad:Workstation 65280.108:4

dave@quad:/etc/netatalk$ aecho quad:Workstation

22 bytes from 65280.108: aep_seq=0. time=0. ms

22 bytes from 65280.108: aep_seq=1. time=0. ms

22 bytes from 65280.108: aep_seq=2. time=0. ms

^C

----65280.108 AEP Statistics----

3 packets sent, 3 packets received, 0% packet loss

round-trip (ms) min/avg/max = 0/0/0

dave@quad:/etc/netatalk$

Can you help me figure out how to diagnose the LocalTalk portion of my system?

 
porter

porter

Well-known member
Can you help me figure out how to diagnose the LocalTalk portion of my system?
Click to expand...
The best bet is to....

Make sure you are using proper LocalTalk cabling to the AsanteTalk box, not just a serial/printer cable.

Switch off the AsanteTalk box.

Start the linux box with netatalk.

Start the mac with LocalTalk/AppleTalk enabled on the printerport

Then once the machine has started up, powerup the AsanteTalk box.

Try nbplkup from the linux box.

Go the the control panel and select AppleTalk or Network depending on if you are OpenTransport or classic and see if that says anything different.

I've had varying success with the AsanteTalk box, it seems to work best when there is an appletalk router already on the network.

If you already have a Mac with ethernet, the control panel "LocalTalk Bridge" seems to work better than the AsanteTalk box.

 
porter

porter

Well-known member
Here is a good example:

Code: 
$ nbplkup
                       gateway:ADSP                               40215.94:128
                      10.1.3.1:IPADDRESS                          40215.94:72
                      10.1.3.1:IPGATEWAY                          40215.94:72
                       gateway:netatalk                           40215.94:4
                       gateway:Workstation                        40215.94:4
                           EVO:DceDspRpc DynEpt 638.1             41384.136:136
                           EVO:DceDspRpc DynEpt 114.1             41384.136:129
                           EVO:DceDspRpc Endpoint Mapper          41384.136:130
                           EVO:AFPServer                          41384.136:131
083D86B6F0E990040330A5CA083D@EVO:Microsoft¨ Windows 2000ª Prt       44318.148:2
083D86B6F0E990040330A5CA083D@EVO:Microsoft¨ Windows 2000ª Rtr       43497.215:2
           Asant?Talk 94AFE828:AsantTalk                         40000.15:252
                      10.1.3.2:IPADDRESS                          40000.16:72
                        porter:Macintosh Classic                  40000.16:253
Which shows

(a) Macintosh Classic running System 6 on 40000.16

( B) Compaq running W2K server on 41384.136

© gateway running NetBSD on 40215.94

(d) AsanteTalk on 40000.15

Note MacTCP running with gateway as server, and classic allocated an address.

 
porter

porter

Well-known member
I have an interesting catch-22.

I can't use AsanteTalk unless I have an AppleTalk seed/router on the ethernet. I'm using my win2k box to do that.

I can use MacTCP from Classic thru AsanteTalk to NetBSD to my MacIP gateway. (tested with Browser6 of course).

But my Ubuntu box refuses to start netatalk when the win2k box is up claiming

Code: 
Jan 28 19:18:43 saxon kernel: [  992.358470] Too many routes/iface.
when I start atalkd.

Now you may be able to start atalkd on the Linux box as a seed on the network to get the AsanteTalk box to grab an address in a reasonable range. Perhaps I should try that.

 
porter

porter

Well-known member
I shutdown the win2k box and the gateway.

Okay, now I have started up the Linux box first then started up the classic with the AsanteTalk.

I get a weird looking output from nbplkup on linux...

Code: 
root@saxon:/etc/init.d# nbplkup
                         saxon:AFPServer                          65280.249:128
                         saxon:netatalk                           65280.249:4
                         saxon:Workstation                        65280.249:4
          AsantéTalk 94AFE828:                         porter:Macintosh Classic                  65397.152:253
Note, the classic can now see the Linux box in the Chooser.

When I startup the NetBSD one I get

Code: 
bash-3.00# nbplkup
                       gateway:ADSP                               65280.94:128
                      10.1.3.1:IPADDRESS                          65280.94:72
                      10.1.3.1:IPGATEWAY                          65280.94:72
                       gateway:netatalk                           65280.94:4
                       gateway:Workstation                        65280.94:4
                         saxon:AFPServer                          65280.249:128
                         saxon:netatalk                           65280.249:4
                         saxon:Workstation                        65280.249:4
                        porter:Macintosh Classic                  65397.152:253
           Asant?Talk 94AFE828:AsantTalk                         65397.151:252
Which looks alot nicer, and classic can still see Linux box in Chooser.

Now when I fireup the win2k box with the seed the Linux box disappears from the Chooser, and nbplkup fails with

Code: 
nbp_lookup: Cannot assign requested address
Now we can see that the AsanteTalk box has correctly switched address now the network has been seeded. The NetBSD box didn't, and the Linux box has collapsed in a heap.

Code: 
bash-3.00# nbplkup
                       gateway:ADSP                               65280.94:128
                      10.1.3.1:IPADDRESS                          65280.94:72
                      10.1.3.1:IPGATEWAY                          65280.94:72
                       gateway:netatalk                           65280.94:4
                       gateway:Workstation                        65280.94:4
                           EVO:DceDspRpc DynEpt 114.1             41384.136:129
                           EVO:DceDspRpc Endpoint Mapper          41384.136:130
                           EVO:AFPServer                          41384.136:131
083D86B6F0E990040330A5CA083D@EVO:Microsoft¨ Windows 2000ª Prt       44318.148:2
083D86B6F0E990040330A5CA083D@EVO:Microsoft¨ Windows 2000ª Rtr       43497.215:2
                        porter:Macintosh Classic                  40000.112:253
           Asant?Talk 94AFE828:AsantTalk                         40000.111:252
I'm happily able to mount the win2k share from the Chooser.

However now the MacTCP gateway is broken until I reset the gateway box.

So, gateway is reset...

Code: 
bash-3.00# nbplkup
                       gateway:ADSP                               43797.94:128
                      10.1.3.1:IPADDRESS                          43797.94:72
                      10.1.3.1:IPGATEWAY                          43797.94:72
                       gateway:netatalk                           43797.94:4
                       gateway:Workstation                        43797.94:4
                           EVO:DceDspRpc DynEpt 614.1             41384.136:136
                           EVO:DceDspRpc DynEpt 114.1             41384.136:129
                           EVO:DceDspRpc Endpoint Mapper          41384.136:130
                           EVO:AFPServer                          41384.136:131
083D86B6F0E990040330A5CA083D@EVO:Microsoft¨ Windows 2000ª Prt       44318.148:2
083D86B6F0E990040330A5CA083D@EVO:Microsoft¨ Windows 2000ª Rtr       43497.215:2
                        porter:Macintosh Classic                  40000.112:253
           Asant?Talk 94AFE828:AsantTalk                         40000.111:252
And bingo the MacIP gateway works...

Code: 
            Asant?Talk 94AFE828:AsantTalk                         40000.111:252
                        porter:Macintosh Classic                  40000.112:253
                      10.1.3.2:IPADDRESS                          40000.112:72
Upshot is I think the Ubuntu netatalk is shagged.

 
D

Doctor Dave

Active member
See comments below, interspersed in a message porter sent earlier... my text is hopefully in italics.

The best bet is to....

Make sure you are using proper LocalTalk cabling to the AsanteTalk box, not just a serial/printer cable.

I have only one mini-DIN8 cable. I hope it is the correct type. It was given to me along with the PowerBook, and had been used to connect the PowerBook to a LaserWriter printer in the past. I could check continuity of the cable with an ohmmeter, but I suspect it is OK. Note I do not have "terminating resistors" on either the PowerBook end or the AsanteTalk end of this cable, in case that likely matters.

Switch off the AsanteTalk box.

Done

Start the linux box with netatalk.

Done

Start the mac with LocalTalk/AppleTalk enabled on the printerport

Here's where I may need help confirming I have this step done correctly. When I power on the PowerBook, and then click Control Panels | Network, I see only one item, an icon labeled "LocalTalk Built-In". Clicking on this icon does nothing. When I open Chooser, and then click on "AppleShare", on the right hand side of the window I see: "Select a file server:" above a blank rectangle, above an OK button, above a pair of radiobuttons... "AppleTalk" is "Active".

Then once the machine has started up, powerup the AsanteTalk box.

When the AsanteTalk device is powered up, the PWR and Li (link) LEDs immediately turn green, and the TX and RX LEDs begin flashing irregularly, as if the AsanteTalk is communicating with something.

Try nbplkup from the linux box.

nbplkup returns exactly the same response as it did before I powered on the AsanteTalk device:

 

dave@quad:/$ nbplkup

quad:AFPServer 65280.108:128

quad:netatalk 65280.108:4

quad:Workstation 65280.108:4

dave@quad:/$

Go the the control panel and select AppleTalk or Network depending on if you are OpenTransport or classic and see if that says anything different.

Clicking on Control Panels | Network produces the same result as it did before I turned on the AsanteTalk device. I do not see an icon in Control Panels called "AppleTalk".

I've had varying success with the AsanteTalk box, it seems to work best when there is an appletalk router already on the network.

Sadly, I do not have such a thing, unless that's what my Linux box is providing.

If you already have a Mac with ethernet, the control panel "LocalTalk Bridge" seems to work better than the AsanteTalk box.

I do not have any other Macintosh computers, either with or without ethernet. I also do not have any LocalTalk printers.

 
Bunsen

Bunsen

Admin-Witchfinder-General
I unfortunately do not possess any cables that connect to the SCSI port on the Duo Dock.
Click to expand...
Then it might be an idea to get one, no? IIRC, the Dock has the Honda HDI-50 square Powerbook style SCSI port.

Another option is to mount a bare SCSI drive internally in the Dock - there is space for one. Format it using the Duo, pull it, transfer to a SCSI-equipped PC with MacDrive or some other HFS/HFS+ read/write software on it, drag the files you want over, pull it, remount it in the Dock.

Some Duo Docks came with built-in Ethernet, but it may be a socket type that is unfamiliar to you, called AAUI. Symbol: If there is one, you need an Apple AAUI to Cat-5 adapter to use it.

There are also two Nubus expansion card slots in the Dock, and Nubus ethernet cards are readily available on evilbay, as are the Powerbook SCSI cables and AAUI adapters.

Other than that, see first line of sig below.

 
porter

porter

Well-known member
Make sure you are using proper LocalTalk cabling to the AsanteTalk box, not just a serial/printer cable. I have only one mini-DIN8 cable. I hope it is the correct type. It was given to me along with the PowerBook, and had been used to connect the PowerBook to a LaserWriter printer in the past.
Click to expand...
It does have to be a pair of LocalTalk connector boxes with localtalk cabling between them, and ideally terminators on each end. A serial cable alas does not work. The little boxes contain an isolating transformer and turn the cabling into a bus.

I've had varying success with the AsanteTalk box, it seems to work best when there is an appletalk router already on the network. Sadly, I do not have such a thing, unless that's what my Linux box is providing.
Click to expand...
Try changing your atalk.conf to say something like

Code: 
eth0  -phase 2 -seed -net 20000-30000 -addr 20000.10
Although I have had problems trying to seed a net when you only have one network card. You might have to throw another network card into the linux box to fool netatalk into seeding the networks.

Code: 
man atalkd
http://linux.die.net/man/5/atalkd.conf

 
porter

porter

Well-known member
Do you think it would help for me to try to upgrade the OS on the PowerBook 230 from "System 7.1" to something newer?
Click to expand...
I just tested this with a Macintosh Classic running System 6.0.8, but it did have the latest AppleTalk installed.

System 7.5 is a major advance.

System 7.6.1 is the end of the road for System 7 and starts assuming you want OpenTransport.

 
Charlieman

Charlieman

Well-known member
System 7.6.1 is the end of the road for System 7 and starts assuming you want OpenTransport.
Click to expand...
And if you feel the need to use Open Transport, skip all of the early versions and go straight to OT 1.1.1. OT 1.1.1 will run happily on System 7.1 if you have 8MB of system RAM.

 
porter

porter

Well-known member
If you go OpenTransport then the OTPing is a great tool for looking at AppleTalk networks.

 
D

Doctor Dave

Active member
OK... lots to respond to. First of all, the Duo Dock I have is, I believe, the "first generation" Duo Dock. It has 2 NuBus slots (both currently empty). It has a SCSI port with an "HDI-30" connector... nothing is connected to this. It has an Apple Desktop Bus port, to which a keyboard/mouse is attached. It has a "Printer" port (mini-DIN8), which I assume to be an AppleTalk/LocalTalk port. It does not have any kind of ethernet port... neither an RJ-45 jack nor an AAUI socket.

If the mini-DIN8 cable I have is not actually a "LocalTalk" cable, then I do not understand the difference between that and a "serial" cable. The cable is about 2 meters long, and does not appear to have any termination built into it... it is simply a "straight-through" cable connecting the "printer" port of the Duo Dock to the AsanteTalk device I have. As I have indicated in earlier posts, the LEDs on the AsanteTalk device seem to indicate that there is both transmission and reception happening on the line.

I do not know how to determine what version of AppleTalk is running on the PowerBook. "About This Macintosh" indicates:

PowerBook Duo 230

Total memory 4,096K

System Software 7.1

I do not know what Open Transport is.

I see lots of files on this website:

http://download.info.apple.com/Apple_Support_Area/Apple_Software_Updates/English-North_American/Macintosh/System/

but I'm not sure which I might need. My guess is that I can download a file, put it onto a 1.44M FAT-formatted floppy disk, and then somehow install it onto the PowerBook, perhaps with help from experts here.

Where should I start?

 
porter

porter

Well-known member
OK... lots to respond to. First of all, the Duo Dock I have is, I believe, the "first generation" Duo Dock. It has 2 NuBus slots (both currently empty)
.....

Where should I start?
Click to expand...
Get a NuBUS ethernet card, should be able to find one very cheaply!

 
D

Doctor Dave

Active member
Well, although I find trying to get old equipment to work a pleasurable pasttime, I'm not particularly inclined to spend much money on this PowerBook project. If I could find a Nubus ethernet card for $10 or less, I might jump on it, but my experience with eBay in recent months is that shipping alone is usually about $10.

Anyone on this forum have a NuBus ethernet card collecting dust?

 
D

Doctor Dave

Active member
Update... I found for $20 (including shipping) a Daynaport NuBus ethernet card, which hopefully will arrive in the next week or two. Possibly this will work better than the AsanteTalk device.

 
porter

porter

Well-known member
Update... I found for $20 (including shipping) a Daynaport NuBus ethernet card, which hopefully will arrive in the next week or two. Possibly this will work better than the AsanteTalk device.
Click to expand...
Yes, the major advantage is the Mac will use TCP/IP natively on ethernet rather than having to do the MacIP packing-unpacking-gateway.

 
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