IIci w/ Supermac Spectrum 24 PDQ - No Video Output

danny.gonzalez.0861@gmai · Jan 22, 2024

Hi everyone,

I am fairly new to the 68k Mac world and I managed to grab a Supermac Spectrum PDQ 24 for my IIci and 13" High Resolution Display. The display works fine with the onboard graphics but nothing from the Supermac. I am having issues sourcing the SuperVideo v2.7.5 that is supposed to be compatible, I tried 2.0.7 and 2.9.7 that was easier to find with no luck. None of the programs see the card. I am running System 7.1 but am willing to do whatever is necessary to make it work.

Some photos in case anyone sees anything I am missing.

The card gets warm but not hot so I feel like it's getting power but I'm not expert on that last part.

Only other thing of note is that my db15 cable is not a legitimate apple one but does work with the onboard video so that's odd.

Any guidance will be greatly appreciated and I would be very grateful.

Thanks

danny.gonzalez.0861@gmai · Jan 22, 2024

Upon further investigation I found that C115 is missing. Looks like it got knocked off somehow. Any advice on a what value the capacitor is?

Phipli · Jan 22, 2024

danny.gonzalez.0861@gmai said:
Upon further investigation I found that C115 is missing. Looks like it got knocked off somehow. Any advice on a what value the capacitor is?View attachment 68520

Before worrying about the capacitor too much (it might not be critically important, capacitors sometimes aren't)...

Plug your monitor into the PDQ. Power on the Mac holding down the option key. If you see a message saying "Press Space" : Press the spacebar immediately.

danny.gonzalez.0861@gmai · Jan 22, 2024

Phipli said:
Before worrying about the capacitor too much (it might not be critically important, capacitors sometimes aren't)...

Plug your monitor into the PDQ. Power on the Mac holding down the option key. If you see a message saying "Press Space" : Press the spacebar immediately.

View attachment PXL_20240122_234237613.mp4
Hello Phipli,

It is a pleasure as I see you are very active from the poking around the site I have done.

I tried your suggestion of holding the option key with the monitor connected to the PDQ. Unfortunately I get nothing but a black screen

What should I try next?

Thanks!

Phipli · Jan 23, 2024

danny.gonzalez.0861@gmai said:
View attachment 68521
Hello Phipli,

It is a pleasure as I see you are very active from the poking around the site I have done.

I tried your suggestion of holding the option key with the monitor connected to the PDQ. Unfortunately I get nothing but a black screen

What should I try next?

Thanks!

How much RAM do you have installed?

Next I'd boot with the monitor connected to internal video (but the card still in the slot), and install "TattleTech" version 2.80 (specifically that version, 2.84 doesn't work sometimes).

Run TattleTech, and select the Nubus option from the drop-down list. Does the computer see the SuperMac Card there?

If not, try another slot. If it does see it, you likely have some repairs to do.

You're in luck regarding the cap. I have the same board so can measure mine.

Sadly mine doesn't work either although I haven't investigated yet. I should do sometime, but was frustrated at the time when it didn't work on arrival.

danny.gonzalez.0861@gmai said:
It is a pleasure as I see you are very active from the poking around the site I have done.

A symptom of too much time on my hands sadly.

Phipli · Jan 23, 2024

OK, make that 2.58.

Looks like I need to upload my copy of 2.80 and my copy of 2.83 sometime

jmacz · Jan 23, 2024

@Phipli has you on the right track.

Later, to answer your question on the driver, you can grab 2.7.5 from download link #1 here: https://macintoshgarden.org/apps/drivers-supermac-video-cards-mostly-nubus.

But theoretically, you should be able to hold the option key when booting like @Phipli mentioned and it should show something on the display letting you cycle through the various modes it supports and press the space bar once you see an image that looks proper for your display.

After checking with TattleTech, you can also test the pins to see if you're getting any video signals coming out. Specifically pins 2 (red), 5 (green), and 9 (blue) on the DB15 port. Check the green F1 fuse on the board.

For the missing capacitor, your card is a slightly newer revision than mine I believe. I think mine was a rev C. But I can try to find time next weekend to pull C115 off my board and measure its capacitance.

danny.gonzalez.0861@gmai · Jan 23, 2024

Phipli said:
How much RAM do you have installed?

Next I'd boot with the monitor connected to internal video (but the card still in the slot), and install "TattleTech" version 2.80 (specifically that version, 2.84 doesn't work sometimes).

Run TattleTech, and select the Nubus option from the drop-down list. Does the computer see the SuperMac Card there?

If not, try another slot. If it does see it, you likely have some repairs to do.

You're in luck regarding the cap. I have the same board so can measure mine.

Sadly mine doesn't work either although I haven't investigated yet. I should do sometime, but was frustrated at the time when it didn't work on arrival.

A symptom of too much time on my hands sadly.

Phipli,

My IIci came with 5MB of RAM, x4 1MB cards and x4 256MB cards. I have ordered x4 16MB cards but they wont be in for a few days.

Please let me know what that capacitor value is so that I can either scavenge around or order some form Mouser or DigiKey.

Phipli said:
OK, make that 2.58.

Looks like I need to upload my copy of 2.80 and my copy of 2.83 sometime

LMAO so I already had/used 2.59 but I used the recommended 2.58 and both versions show the 3 physical slots but nothing connected to them. I will try different slots as well as some contact cleaner in case its my NUBUS slots.

Will keep you posted.

Thanks!

danny.gonzalez.0861@gmai · Jan 23, 2024

jmacz said:
@Phipli has you on the right track.

Later, to answer your question on the driver, you can grab 2.7.5 from download link #1 here: https://macintoshgarden.org/apps/drivers-supermac-video-cards-mostly-nubus.

But theoretically, you should be able to hold the option key when booting like @Phipli mentioned and it should show something on the display letting you cycle through the various modes it supports and press the space bar once you see an image that looks proper for your display.

After checking with TattleTech, you can also test the pins to see if you're getting any video signals coming out. Specifically pins 2 (red), 5 (green), and 9 (blue) on the DB15 port. Check the green F1 fuse on the board.

For the missing capacitor, your card is a slightly newer revision than mine I believe. I think mine was a rev C. But I can try to find time next weekend to pull C115 off my board and measure its capacitance.

Hello jmacz,

I've spent a few hours today going over all your other SuperMac adventures. It is also a pleasure speaking with you.

Unfortunately it seems the card is not being recognized but i have to try a few things before we call that 100 not the issue.

Might even buy a cheap modem and see if that is recognized.

I don't have an oscilloscope just yet to check the signal output so thanks for the last excuse I needed to buy one LMAO

I checked continuity for F1 and it is closed and thus not blown.

Phipli is hopefully going to check for the capacitor value but if you too can help confirm the findings it would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks for the support!

jmacz · Jan 23, 2024

So as I mentioned earlier, my board is revision C whereas you have a revision D. But my guess is the capacitor value should be the same. I pulled C115 off my board and measured it. It's a 100nF capacitor. Hope that helps.

For the RGB signals, well, you could at minimum see if you're getting any voltage on the pins to see if the card is at least trying to output something.

danny.gonzalez.0861@gmai · Jan 24, 2024

I come bearing great news. So Phipli had me thinking why TattleTech wasn't seeing anything on the nubus slots. I had a capacitor to fix the one that was damaged thinking maybe that was the issue but that didn't solve anything.

Again, the lack of nubus information got me think and searching about the possibility of the issue being my IIci and some people had mentioned replacing a 74ALS240 chip so I went looking for continuity issues and sure enough I found a dead trace. It passes right under the capacitor C16 so I took a little solder mask off and put a bodge wire in place. That took care of my issue!!

I wanted to thank you guys for listening to my issue and for guiding me in the correct direction.

Now to figure out why the "SuperMac_Family.sit" that jmacz recommended only has one folder in it. I have to see what software was used to stuff it since I must assume that is the issue.

Thanks!

jmacz · Jan 24, 2024

That's great to hear! Congrats!

That archive I linked has a bunch of folders underneath it including one named "Graphics Card Drivers" and that contains various versions of SuperVideo including the 2.7.5 you're looking for. It also has 3.1 for later cards.

It expanded properly with Stuffit Expander 5.5 for me.

cheesestraws · Jan 24, 2024

danny.gonzalez.0861@gmai said:
I went looking for continuity issues and sure enough I found a dead trace. It passes right under the capacitor C16 so I took a little solder mask off and put a bodge wire in place. That took care of my issue!!

Well done, nice find! :-D

danny.gonzalez.0861@gmai · Jan 24, 2024

jmacz said:
That's great to hear! Congrats!

That archive I linked has a bunch of folders underneath it including one named "Graphics Card Drivers" and that contains various versions of SuperVideo including the 2.7.5 you're looking for. It also has 3.1 for later cards.

It expanded properly with Stuffit Expander 5.5 for me.

Happy Wednesday jmacz,

So maybe I am doing something wrong but you can see from the photo the issue I was describing a few days ago is still happening. I unstuff the "Supermac_family.sit" and it does is too fast for such a large file. All it does is leave a single folder and inside that folder is a file that seems to be a read me. What in the world am I missing here?

As always thanks for the help!

danny.gonzalez.0861@gmai · Jan 24, 2024

I just noticed I didn't post the photo of the bodge wire. Here it is for completeness.

Hope this helps!

Phipli · Jan 24, 2024

danny.gonzalez.0861@gmai said:
Happy Wednesday jmacz,

So maybe I am doing something wrong but you can see from the photo the issue I was describing a few days ago is still happening. I unstuff the "Supermac_family.sit" and it does is too fast for such a large file. All it does is leave a single folder and inside that folder is a file that seems to be a read me. What in the world am I missing here?

View attachment 68606 View attachment 68607

As always thanks for the help!

How did you move the file to the Mac?

danny.gonzalez.0861@gmai · Jan 24, 2024

Phipli said:
How did you move the file to the Mac?

Hello Phipli!!

I have a bluescsi and use the built-in sd transfer tool.

Seems to work most of the time but admittedly this isn't the first time it happens. I've had other .sit files that were unusable.

What are you thinking?

Thanks again!

Phipli · Jan 24, 2024

danny.gonzalez.0861@gmai said:
Hello Phipli!!

I have a bluescsi and use the built-in sd transfer tool.

Seems to work most of the time but admittedly this isn't the first time it happens. I've had other .sit files that were unusable.

What are you thinking?

Thanks again!

I can't really answer without starting yet another argument about file compression / transfer hygiene.

It looks like the file is partially damaged. It is often better to use files that were wrapped as a .hqx or .bin if possible. It also might be worth trying Stuffit 4.

.sit files unprotected by another wrapper can become damaged in transit in specific circumstances, but it is one of the most hotly contested topics.

Use the exact download jmacz used, and don't decompress it in the windows version of Basilisk II or in a modern OS. Don't transfer .sits over FTP...

danny.gonzalez.0861@gmai · Jan 24, 2024

Phipli said:
I can't really answer without starting yet another argument about file compression / transfer hygiene.

It looks like the file is partially damaged. It is often better to use files that were wrapped as a .hqx or .bin if possible. It also might be worth trying Stuffit 4.

.sit files unprotected by another wrapper can become damaged in transit in specific circumstances, but it is one of the most hotly contested topics.

Use the exact download jmacz used, and don't decompress it in the windows version of Basilisk II or in a modern OS. Don't transfer .sits over FTP...

Hey Phipli,

Just got home and saw your replay.

I am simply downloading the file from macgarden (link provided) and what you see on the photos i attached is all I get. For shoots and giggles i tried on Basilisk and got the exact same result. Only thing left to try is an older version of Stuffit but jmacz said he used 5.5 which is the version I use.

Does anyone have just the 2.7.5 version they can just send me? I have found a few dead links on an old site that use to host files.

I am running out of options here.

Thanks!

Phipli · Jan 24, 2024

danny.gonzalez.0861@gmai said:
I am simply downloading the file from macgarden (link provided)

How you download is also of interest, as in, what type of machine, what software, and how files are moved between machines, if applicable. It very much matters with old mac files because they're easy to corrupt in a number of ways sadly.

I know it sounds like the simple bit, but it is a major issue

IIci w/ Supermac Spectrum 24 PDQ - No Video Output

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