"Power Macintosh Card" and "601 Processor Upgrade" - What is the difference?

[Phipli]

So the Apple System installers include two PPC upgrade control panels, "Power Macintosh Card" and "601 Processor Upgrade". My card in my C650 and the one in my IIci are only recognises by one of them I believe, the "Power Macintosh Card" one.

Does anyone definitively know what the difference between these two control panel is? When is each needed?

My provisional understanding is that the Power Macintosh Card control panel :

Is for the upgrade for the Quadra/Centris and Mac II family upgraded :


And that the 601 Processor Upgrade Control Panel :

Is for the LC (475, 575, 630, 580 etc etc) upgrade :

 

[lobust]

I know nothing of the LC/II upgrades, but I can confirm that my 040 PDS (PowerPC Power Macintosh Upgrade Card) one only works with the "Power Macintosh Card" control panel.

Edit: Name of the card.

 

[Phipli]

I should additionally add that you need the Daystar control panels for the near identical looking Daystar Turbo 601 and Daystar PowerPro cards for the Mac II family and Quadra / Centris PDS cards. There is one for each type of card.

The Turbo 601 control panel also enables you to skip the memory test and enable SCSI Manager 4.3 if you have a compatible SCSI card.

 

[Unbounded_Villain]

Apple sold several 68k Macs with the promised ability to upgrade to PowerPC when their cards became available in an effort to both avoid the Osborne effect and to encourage people to buy higher-margin 68k machines. Their upgrade cards never materialised. To avoid another lawsuit as Apple was involved in several (that's what happens when you put a marketing guy in charge of a tech company), they licensed DayStar's designs. The Power Macintosh Card is Apple's version, the 601 Processor Upgrade is DayStar's version.

When Apple finally released their version of the card, it cost almost as much as buying a new Mac. Shady.

To my knowledge the cards are identical, but I think only Apple's version has the new warbling chime in it that was used in the 62XX/52XX machines, which are essentially Performa 630 Macs with the upgrade card cobbled into the system.

 

[bigmessowires]

But sir, it clearly says ready for PowerPC upgrade!

 

[Phipli]

Apple sold several 68k Macs with the promised ability to upgrade to PowerPC when their cards became available in an effort to both avoid the Osborne effect and to encourage people to buy higher-margin 68k machines. Their upgrade cards never materialised. To avoid another lawsuit as Apple was involved in several (that's what happens when you put a marketing guy in charge of a tech company), they licensed DayStar's designs. The Power Macintosh Card is Apple's version, the 601 Processor Upgrade is DayStar's version.

When Apple finally released their version of the card, it cost almost as much as buying a new Mac. Shady.

To my knowledge the cards are identical, but I think only Apple's version has the new warbling chime in it that was used in the 62XX/52XX machines, which are essentially Performa 630 Macs with the upgrade card cobbled into the system.

I'm not sure this is 100% true regarding Apple's cards never materialising. The PPC platform was developed on Apple (and other completely different third party) PPC cards, first 88000, then 88100 then 601 based ones. Possibly one other type as well...

But, for whatever reason, they went with the ones that were developed with/by DayStar. Not sure why. Perhaps they wanted to concentrate on building the new machines and not cards for old machines. Perhaps their internal cards cost too much. No idea.

 

[MrFahrenheit]

Apple sold several 68k Macs with the promised ability to upgrade to PowerPC when their cards became available in an effort to both avoid the Osborne effect and to encourage people to buy higher-margin 68k machines. Their upgrade cards never materialised. To avoid another lawsuit as Apple was involved in several (that's what happens when you put a marketing guy in charge of a tech company), they licensed DayStar's designs. The Power Macintosh Card is Apple's version, the 601 Processor Upgrade is DayStar's version.

When Apple finally released their version of the card, it cost almost as much as buying a new Mac. Shady.

To my knowledge the cards are identical, but I think only Apple's version has the new warbling chime in it that was used in the 62XX/52XX machines, which are essentially Performa 630 Macs with the upgrade card cobbled into the system.

I worked at a computer reseller in 1994 and part way through 1995, and we had the Apple 601 upgrade kits (brown box like the Apple mouse) on-hand in fall of 1994. I remember this specifically because a salesperson had one in their personal locker which they needed to keep from being inventoried at end-of-year, because it was prepaid by the customer and waiting to be picked up.

 

[Unbounded_Villain]

I worked at a computer reseller in 1994 and part way through 1995, and we had the Apple 601 upgrade kits (brown box like the Apple mouse) on-hand in fall of 1994. I remember this specifically because a salesperson had one in their personal locker which they needed to keep from being inventoried at end-of-year, because it was prepaid by the customer and waiting to be

I'm not sure this is 100% true regarding Apple's cards never materialising. The PPC platform was developed on Apple (and other completely different third party) PPC cards, first 88000, then 88100 then 601 based ones. Possibly one other type as well...

But, for whatever reason, they went with the ones that were developed with/by DayStar. Not sure why. Perhaps they wanted to concentrate on building the new machines and not cards for old machines. Perhaps their internal cards cost too much. No idea.

Boom.

In the Matter of Apple Computer, Inc. - C3763 - Complaint

This is just one of several. No need to insinuate I’m a liar just because you don’t have the knowledge I do. That’s not being a good forum member.

 

[Phipli]

Boom.

In the Matter of Apple Computer, Inc. - C3763 - Complaint

This is just one of several. No need to insinuate I’m a liar just because you don’t have the knowledge I do. That’s not being a good forum member.

Someone got out on the wrong side of bed this morning.

Want to re-read our posts? Perhaps how they reacted to you saying...

Their upgrade cards never materialised.

I just said "they had cards internally, I don't know why they went with Daystar cards".

And @MrFahrenheit just detailed when he first saw them for sale.

Neither of us called you a liar, or insinuated that you were.

Relax, we're not out to get you. And I bow to your incredible knowledge of all things Mac. I'll crawl back into my cave of ignorance.

 

[GRudolf94]

That’s not being a good forum member.

I don't think you, with your completely acrid attitude across several posts, should get to tell anyone, especially people who are generally regarded to be polite and helpful, what's being a good forum member or not. Not the first time you land on a thread with that accusatory tone. Rethink your attitude.

 

[MrFahrenheit]

Boom.

In the Matter of Apple Computer, Inc. - C3763 - Complaint

This is just one of several. No need to insinuate I’m a liar just because you don’t have the knowledge I do. That’s not being a good forum member.

So you quote a lawsuit from 1995 to base your claim that no upgrades existed?

And that lawsuit specifically mentions the 68030 based Performa 550?

You do realize there were a lot of models besides the ones mentioned in that lawsuit, right? The machine I remember seeing an upgrade card for was the Quadra 650. Why wasn't that mentioned in the lawsuit? Because it existed.

Now, please, don't come on here with that kind of attitude, and specifically that kind of reply towards me, insinuating with your specific language, that others are liars. "No need to insinuate I'm a liar just because you don't have the knowledge I do" is a statement made to say "I know a lot more than you, and you are lying". Please. Check this attitude at the door.

Are you, perhaps, a dark alter-ego of another forum member, with a secondary account?

 

[dougg3]

Anyway, that lawsuit is a pretty interesting read. Sounds like Apple misled people when they said the Performa 550 was PowerPC-ready, and people were in for sticker shock when they realized they also had to buy a 575 logic board in order to use the upgrade card.

Here's another link from the FTC about it where Apple would be required to offer the entire upgrade kit (including the logic board) for $599, and would refund $776 of the original $1375 to people who had already purchased the new logic board + upgrade card.

 

[Fizzbinn]

I wonder if Apple did have a plan to offer a direct PPC upgrade card for the 68030 based 550, perhaps using the 32-bit LC PDS slot? Something like the DayStar Turbo 601 that works for the 68030 based IIci/si/vx/vi (Performa 600) via their PDS slots.

I think DayStar made adapters that let you use a Turbo 040 on 68030 Macs with 32-bit LC PDS slots, perhaps they underestimated the cost to build out multiple upgrades. Wonder if the lawsuit payouts could have ended up better financially for them. …then again this is 90s Apple!

 

[Phipli]

Anyway, that lawsuit is a pretty interesting read. Sounds like Apple misled people when they said the Performa 550 was PowerPC-ready, and people were in for sticker shock when they realized they also had to buy a 575 logic board in order to use the upgrade card.

Here's another link from the FTC about it where Apple would be required to offer the entire upgrade kit (including the logic board) for $599, and would refund $776 of the original $1375 to people who had already purchased the new logic board + upgrade card.

I wonder if Apple did have a plan to offer a direct PPC upgrade card for the 68030 based 550, perhaps using the 32-bit LC PDS slot? Something like the DayStar Turbo 601 that works for the 68030 based IIci/si/vx/vi (Performa 600) via their PDS slots.

I think DayStar made adapters that let you use a Turbo 040 on 68030 Macs with 32-bit LC PDS slots, perhaps they underestimated the cost to build out multiple upgrades. Wonder if the lawsuit payouts could have ended up better financially for them. …then again this is 90s Apple!

There was trouble later about the 7200 as well if I remember. The upgrade path was logic boards at most of the price of a new machine? I've only heard it second hand. I'm confused why they kept promising upgrade paths and then not offering viable solutions.

 

[tafkar]

This thread reminded me of one of my best eBay scores. It was back in around the year 2000 when I was using eBay quite a lot to feed my Mac habit. I found an offering of 601 upgrade cards for $50 apiece but I knew that they Usually went for about $100-$150. He had 10 available and I bought all 10 then sold them at auction for an average of about $125. I kept one for my Quadra 650.

 

[Phipli]

This thread reminded me of one of my best eBay scores. It was back in around the year 2000 when I was using eBay quite a lot to feed my Mac habit. I found an offering of 601 upgrade cards for $50 apiece but I knew that they Usually went for about $100-$150. He had 10 available and I bought all 10 then sold them at auction for an average of about $125. I kept one for my Quadra 650.

The ones that fit an 030 PDS have gone hard to find. A few years ago they were easy to find, but I think everyone is hanging onto them now.

 

[Melkhior]

I always wondered how they implemented the '030 and '040 PDS PPC acceleration. I wonder if anyone has tried to create schematics from those cards? Interfacing between the '030/'040 bus and the PPC is probably not obvious.
There's currently no suitable re-implementation of '030/'040 (with the required MMU) to create accelerators using a softcore instead of a real 68k, but there is microwatt.which may or may not be suitable for a PPC accelerator... probably a pipe dream at this stage, but you never know what the future holds.

 

[Phipli]

I always wondered how they implemented the '030 and '040 PDS PPC acceleration. I wonder if anyone has tried to create schematics from those cards? Interfacing between the '030/'040 bus and the PPC is probably not obvious.
There's currently no suitable re-implementation of '030/'040 (with the required MMU) to create accelerators using a softcore instead of a real 68k, but there is microwatt.which may or may not be suitable for a PPC accelerator... probably a pipe dream at this stage, but you never know what the future holds.

It's difficult to work out what they did - there is an embedded ARM processor on the board that I've never seen any detailed information / leaks about what exactly it does. That "helper" CPU is going to be a good few MIPS of processing itself.

 

[Melkhior]

It's difficult to work out what they did - there is an embedded ARM processor on the board that I've never seen any detailed information / leaks about what exactly it does. That "helper" CPU is going to be a good few MIPS of processing itself.

Ouch. If that's needed for e.g. initialization or whatever, then that's probably too complex to recreate. Probably easier to work on a fast soft-core 68k with MMU.

 

[MrFahrenheit]

The ones that fit an 030 PDS have gone hard to find. A few years ago they were easy to find, but I think everyone is hanging onto them now.

I have one. I bought it to run benchmark tests on the IIvi and IIvx to see how performance rates.