MP3 Player with Apple MPEG Media System

[Phipli]

Does anybody know of a 68k compatible MP3 Player that works with the hardware decoding provided by the Apple MPEG Media System card for the P630/P580 etc. ?

https://web.archive.org/web/20090514040100/http://www.forcedperfect.net/hardware/cards/applempegmediasystem/

The card provides hardware MPEG compatibility and what we call "MP3" is actually technically called "MPEG-1 Layer 3", which is the audio part of the MPEG-1 format.

I'm looking for something that does the decoding specifically in hardware, because that leaves the CPU almost completely free to do other stuff.

 

[Phipli]

I might extend this question to a more general - "What software do people know of that works with the MPEG card?"

Things that I am aware of
* Apple's video player software, which supports playing MPEG-1 files, and VideoCDs.
* A special version of "Return to Zork" with full screen video!!

Does anyone have a copy of the SDK for the Apple MPEG Media System? @MrFahrenheit ?

 

[Phipli]

Another line of investigation, the same chips were fitted to the Pippin and the Apple Interactive Television Box.

Is there an SDK about for these that covers using the MPEG decoder/ DSP?

 

[SophieRose]

Interesting.. Watching this thread cos am curious too.

 

[Phipli]

Here you can see the video cards in a 630, the Philips chip on the AV card, and the DSP and Cube chips from the MPEG board, embedded on the P475 based board that goes into the Interactive Television Box. It's half 475, and half 630 really.



Picture from here

@Mac84 had a disk image of the hard disk from one of these family of machines. I haven't worked out where he got it yet. The stream was 3 and a half hours long, so tricky to use as reference.

 

[Phipli]

Attached are ITB extensions. Apparently text strings in the special version of Quicktime mention MPEG2. It would be interesting if it was possible to use MPEG2 videos with the MPEG Media System card.

 

[Phipli]

Tum the tum...

https://macintoshgarden.org/apps/apple-pippin-sdk

So... That might have stuff for developing code for the MMS card (I'm getting tired of typing MPEG Media System). It almost certainly will.

Excellent!

Edit : Curses. I don't think the Pippin has the MPEG hardware. I misread something. :/

 

[Phipli]

Some documentation attached.

From this, we can see the TMS320AV110 is a dedicated MP3 audio decoder. This is excellent. Hardware MP3 playing software could be written by people smarter than me, meaning a P630 could play MP3s at good stereo quality with minimal CPU overhead. This, combined with the Infrared remote would make for a great setup! Performa Media Centre. Shove a 120GB disk in there, fill it with MPEG films, TV and MP3s, install the MPEG card and the FM/UHF modules, sit back and enjoy radio, MP3s, TV and Film, all from the sofa

The C-Cube 450 is a dedicated MPEG Video (assume MPEG-1 only) decoder.

I really wish I was a better programmer.

@cheesestraws @Crutch @dougg3 - do any of you have a P630 and an MPEG board? Plus lots of enthusiasm for patching hardware support into MpegDec - I know they tried to do that with the 840av DSP, but that is a general purpose DSP, this one is a dedicated MP3 decoder.

 

[cheesestraws]

I have neither the machines nor, currently, the time, alas.

 

[Phipli]

I have neither the machines nor, currently, the time, alas.

Lies. How can this possibly be true. Surely you are sat waiting at your keyboards for oppertunities like this and not, working, having a family, dealing with house stuff etc.?

 

[François]

If that can help, here are some photos of an Apple MPEG Media System card (that I sold recently):

 

[Phipli]

If that can help, here are some photos of an Apple MPEG Media System card (that I sold recently):

View attachment 63514View attachment 63515View attachment 63516

Thank you

Mine hasn't arrived yet. Doesn't look like it was the one you sold because I'll need to make the cable up for mine.

 

[dougg3]

do any of you have a P630 and an MPEG board? Plus lots of enthusiasm for patching hardware support into MpegDec

I have a 630 but not the MPEG board. Unfortunately I don't have the time either though, sorry! Haha. I will definitely be watching this thread with interest though!

The MPEG audio standards are super confusing to me, and this may just be due to my lack of experience with it all, so I'm going to ask a dumb question.

When I open a bunch of MP3 files I have and look at their codecs with VLC, they all claim to be "MPEG audio layer 1/2 (mpga)" which makes it sound like it's totally supported by the TMS320AV110. Wikipedia even says "MPEG Audio Layer II is the core algorithm of the MP3 standards".

Do MP3 files not actually use "MPEG audio layer 3" under the hood? I tried to research it and my brain almost exploded trying to parse all the info out there.

 

[Phipli]

I have a 630 but not the MPEG board. Unfortunately I don't have the time either though, sorry! Haha. I will definitely be watching this thread with interest though!

The MPEG audio standards are super confusing to me, and this may just be due to my lack of experience with it all, so I'm going to ask a dumb question.

When I open a bunch of MP3 files I have and look at their codecs with VLC, they all claim to be "MPEG audio layer 1/2 (mpga)" which makes it sound like it's totally supported by the TMS320AV110. Wikipedia even says "MPEG Audio Layer II is the core algorithm of the MP3 standards".

Do MP3 files not actually use "MPEG audio layer 3" under the hood? I tried to research it and my brain almost exploded trying to parse all the info out there.

I thought they were MPEG-1 Layer 3. Perhaps they mean MPEG-1/2 Audio Layer (which is layer 3)??

Assuming MPEG-2 (SVCD / DVD style) retained the Audio codec from MPEG-1 (VCD)?

 

[Unbounded_Villain]

I thought they were MPEG-1 Layer 3. Perhaps they mean MPEG-1/2 Audio Layer (which is layer 3)??

Assuming MPEG-2 (SVCD / DVD style) retained the Audio codec from MPEG-1 (VCD)?

MP3 is MPEG-1 Audio Layer III
MP3 is also MPEG-2 Audio Layer III, but it has additional bitrates, but they’re lower, so not needed for music.

Anything that can decode MPEG-2 can decode MP3 audio, and almost all MP3 audio can be decoded with MPEG-1.

MP3 decoding isn’t really computationally intensive, it’s just that early chips didn’t have the kind of instructions needed for it, which is why we needed DSPs until SSE/AltiVec.

 

[Mac84]

Here you can see the video cards in a 630, the Philips chip on the AV card, and the DSP and Cube chips from the MPEG board, embedded on the P475 based board that goes into the Interactive Television Box. It's half 475, and half 630 really.

View attachment 63496

Picture from here

@Mac84 had a disk image of the hard disk from one of these family of machines. I haven't worked out where he got it yet. The stream was 3 and a half hours long, so tricky to use as reference.

Sorry for the delay!

Here is a copy of the STB model 1 hard drive image I was given by slorp. I was not successful in getting it to work (and produce video output) on an STB model 3, even with the additional extensions floating around. However, it is likely more complicated than software, based on some of the recent ROM discoveries on that model.

I also have the Apple MPEG Media System card (and the Avid add-on for it) if that'll be on any help.

Best of luck!

 

[Phipli]

Sorry for the delay!

Here is a copy of the STB model 1 hard drive image I was given by slorp. I was not successful in getting it to work (and produce video output) on an STB model 3, even with the additional extensions floating around. However, it is likely more complicated than software, based on some of the recent ROM discoveries on that model.

I also have the Apple MPEG Media System card (and the Avid add-on for it) if that'll be on any help.

Best of luck!

View attachment 63783

Thank you kindly Mac84, much appreciated.

Is the AVID Add-on software or hardware? The only thing that comes to mind (other than the high end commercial Avid kit) is the AVID PCI transcoder board that you could get for PCI machines like the 6500?

 

[Phipli]

Oracle Media Objects Version 1.0 for Macintosh (Oracle) : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive

Oracle Media Objects Version 1.0 for Macintosh (Oracle)

archive.org

Dev kit for the STB (link found via Steve's post elsewhere).

 

[Mac84]

Thank you kindly Mac84, much appreciated.

Is the AVID Add-on software or hardware? The only thing that comes to mind (other than the high end commercial Avid kit) is the AVID PCI transcoder board that you could get for PCI machines like the 6500?

Oops! I'm sorry, I was mistaken! I was thinking of this AVID PCI add-on card that plugged into certain Apple AV / S-Video cards.

Avid Media Composer Cinema Card (P/N: 630-1922)

Apple AVID Media Composer Cinema Card PCI Power Macintosh Composite S Video Out | eBay

Apple AVID Media Composer Cinema Card PCI Power Macintosh Composite S Video Out | Computers/Tablets & Networking, Vintage Computing, Vintage Parts & Accessories | eBay!

www.ebay.com.sg

 

[Phipli]

Oops! I'm sorry, I was mistaken! I was thinking of this AVID PCI add-on card that plugged into certain Apple AV / S-Video cards.

Avid Media Composer Cinema Card (P/N: 630-1922)

Apple AVID Media Composer Cinema Card PCI Power Macintosh Composite S Video Out | eBay

Apple AVID Media Composer Cinema Card PCI Power Macintosh Composite S Video Out | Computers/Tablets & Networking, Vintage Computing, Vintage Parts & Accessories | eBay!

www.ebay.com.sg

That makes sense

I have one of those in the 6500 I was lucky to get that had that, the AV I/O and the combined UHF/FM module.

Have to admit I moved the UHF/FM over to my P630 because I have a soft spot for that machine and have enjoyed listening to the radio on it.

I love that you can power the machine on and off with the IR Remote.