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Macintosh ED FTP server connected with SLIP to the Internet


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#1 mactjaap

mactjaap
  • 6502
  • LocationThe Netherlands

Posted 16 January 2011 - 11:47 AM

In my research on TCP/IP on Classic Macintosh I tried to run NSCA Telnet 2.6 and 2.5 on a minimal system equiped with only 512K. Without any succes…. To run it with System 6 and MacTCP is just to much.

But while trying I found something what triggered my interest. Unlike an older version I have (2.2), or newer version (2.6 and 2.7) NSCA Telnet 2.5 was capable of setting up a SLIP connection (Serial Line Internet Protocol) via a modem or serial cable. The 2.5 version is developed in june ‘92, just before Internet got really big.
SLIP was a well know way of connecting to the Internet until the beginning of the ‘90. It then was replaced by PPP which is ‘better engineered, has more features and does not require its IP address configuration to be set before it is established’.
So SLIP is an old way of setting up an Internet connection. It is very nice that NSCA has a SLIP client to set up a connection in its software.

For a SLIP connection you need:

- A Macintosh with at least 1 MB RAM (Plus, SE or upgraded 512K)
- A serial line; modem or null modem
- NSCA Telnet 2.5
- A SLIP provider, Linux/Unix box or OSX to connect your modem or null modem to

Install sliplogin on your Linux, Unix or OSX box
MacTCP should be in the System map. You should give it the IP address you want and what fits in your normal internal IP range, in my case 192.168.62.32. The gateway is the Linux box, in my case 192.168.62.31.
Maybe it works with NSCA own TCP stack… Didn’t tested it yet…. For that you have to edit the config.tel file in the same directory as the Telnet NSCA 2.5 program. If you don’t edit something it will need MacTCP.

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There is a huge manual available. I make it available in PDF here:

nsca_telnet_25_documentation
http://macintosh.van...cumentation.pdf

In my setup I used a Macintosh Plus ED with 1 MB. The serial line is an null modem cable I made myself.
(see viewtopic.php?f=7&t=14814 for wiring).
I connect this one to a Linux box. On the Linux box I installed sliplogin (sliplogin-2.1.1-3.i386.rpm for Red Hat in my case… but it is available for Mac OSX and other Linux )

Basicly you make a special user which is used to setup the SLIP connect. This user has no default shell but the program sliplogin. My /etc/passwd looks like this. Give this user a passwd and you can login.

stjaap:x:505:506::/home/stjaap:/usr/sbin/sliploginNow only give the correct information about the IP address you will receive. This has to be done in /etc/slip/slip.hosts (or sometimes /etc/slip.hosts)

This is the only line I added:

stjaap 192.168.62.31 192.168.62.32 255.255.255.0 normal 60
It means that when user stjaap logs in, the serial port on the server will get IP adres 192.168.62.31 and the client (the Mac with NCSA 2.5 FTP server) 192.168.11.32. Also correct subnet mask is given and a normal SLIP connection with a 60 seconds time out is set up.

If you login a special network device is setup, sl0. This has the same setup as an Ethernet card on a Linux box. You can route traffic true it, use ifconfig, etc.

See this picture:

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Now we connect our Macintosh to the Linux box. My serial box allows a serial login. I added these line to /etc/inittab

s0:2345:respawn:/sbin/agetty -L 9600 ttyS0 vt100 s1:2345:respawn:/sbin/agetty -L 19200 ttyS1 vt100
I found out that my serial port on the Linux box that works is ttyS1

Start NSCA Telnet 2.5 and fire up your FTP server. That can be done under File / FTP Enable.

Check your serial port settings. You can find them under Network / Serial Port Settings.

They should fit with your serial settings in /etc/inittab. In my case in /etc/inittab speed is 19200. Settings for NSCA Telnet 2.5 Serial Settings:

19200 baud
8 data bits
No parity
1 stop bit
Modem port
No handshaking
SLIP IP # 192.168.62.32

Open a connection under File / Open Connection and don’t fil in the two boxes Session Name and Window name. Only pick /select the little box before Serial/SLIP and click on OK.

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If you are connected to a Linux box and you don’t see any prompt reboot your Linux box.
After a while you will see the login prompt. Now login with your special SLIP user, in my case stjaap.
SLIP will be started and on the Linux box sl0 is setup.

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Now you start an other connection in NSCA Telnet. This time you can enter a Session Name and Window name. Choose whatever you want or leave it empty as with the first connection. However..now don’t pick /select the little box before Serial/SLIP! Click om OK and you will see that the Session menu item is not greyed out any more. Select from this Session menu Switch to SLIP .
Now your FTP server is connected over the serial line with TCP/IP!
You could get a windows which says that it can find a certain server or gatway. Just click on it and it will go away. If you leave it open, no TCP/IP connection is possible and your server seems offline.

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A ping from the Linux box and a FTP session


It means that a Macintosh can be an FTP server without an ethernet card or SCSI to Ethernet solution. It also means that you can do file sharing between other computers indepenant from operating system. If you don’t have any other Mac around you could exchange files like this.

The server is now up and running (at least for today....).
I have a ping going to the IP adres to be sure the connection will be up and running. You can test it for yourself here:

http://192.168.62.7/ftp2.php

Collection: Apple II (ITT 2020), LISA 2, Macintosh 128K, 512K, Plus, ED, SE, Portable, PowerBook 100 and a FastPath5 router.
Looking for TCP/IP over LocalTalk?? I made something very usefull... Look at http://www.macip.net


#2 mactjaap

mactjaap
  • 6502
  • LocationThe Netherlands

Posted 16 January 2011 - 01:35 PM

Sorry! The URL is wrong ...
That is my internal IP address

use http://macplus.vanegten.com/ftp2.php

Collection: Apple II (ITT 2020), LISA 2, Macintosh 128K, 512K, Plus, ED, SE, Portable, PowerBook 100 and a FastPath5 router.
Looking for TCP/IP over LocalTalk?? I made something very usefull... Look at http://www.macip.net


#3 CJ_Miller

CJ_Miller
  • 6502
  • Locationno

Posted 16 January 2011 - 02:06 PM

Thanks for the informative post! I remember hearing about SLIP in the 90s but never used it or learned about it before. Cool to know that there is this way to network our old Macs

#4 CJ_Miller

CJ_Miller
  • 6502
  • Locationno

Posted 16 January 2011 - 02:20 PM

I can see the directory via your link, but when I try clicking on a file or directory I eventually get a message that there was "a problem" with it. This might be due to my browser's passive FTP. I will try it again on another box here which has a real FTP client.

Why the php page instead of a regular FTP address? Such as ftp://macplus.vanegten.com? I would like to hear more about why you chose to implement things this way.

#5 mactjaap

mactjaap
  • 6502
  • LocationThe Netherlands

Posted 16 January 2011 - 02:49 PM

The error you get is because you try to download a directory. This is not supported. The most simple thing is to download a text file (somefile.txt) . If you have an Apple you could try to download other things, but I'm not sure this works... (UPDATE... I check it now and the server hangs.....I will restart it now)

The way I set it up do demonstrate it to the members to the forum is because of two things.

1) The FTP server is for personal use. It means that if you make an error or unexpected command, the server will trow an error. If an error occurs the IP connecting is broken. So thats why I choose to demonstrate it true a web page. The web page logs in to the FTP server and demonstrate how it looks. I use an Linux box with a web server (192.168.62.7) and PHP to do so. The peace of PHP code to connect to the FTP server (192.168.62.32) I use is:


<?php echo "<html>\n<body>\nHere you can see a directory listing of the NSCA 2.5 Telnet FTP server on a Macintosh Plus ED with 1024K memory over a SLIP connection.\n"; echo "<html>\n<body>\nYou can click on a link and download the file. Test it with somefile.txt or maybe on a Mac Screen 0....\n"; $ftpconnect = ftp_connect("192.168.62.32"); $loginResult = ftp_login($ftpconnect, "username", "password"); if ($loginResult) { $dir = "."; $files_array = ftp_nlist($ftpconnect, $dir); print "Files on the 40MB Hard Drive:"; // You can use foreach instead of while in PHP4 while (list(, $this_file) = each ($files_array)) { $urlname = urlencode($this_file); $urlname = str_replace("+","%20",$urlname ); echo "<a href=\"ftpdownload2.php?id=$urlname\">$this_file</a>\n"; } } ftp_quit($ftpconnect); echo "\nYou can edit and upload the file \"sometext.txt\" <a href=\"write2.php\">here</a>\n</body></html>"; ?>
As you can see an empty user name and empty password is enough to login!

On this box I also added some route information to the Macintosh ED

Kernel IP routing table Destination Gateway Genmask Flags Metric Ref Use Iface 192.168.62.32 192.168.62.10 255.255.255.255 UGH 0 0 0 eth0 192.168.62.0 0.0.0.0 255.255.255.0 U 0 0 0 eth0 127.0.0.0 0.0.0.0 255.0.0.0 U 0 0 0 lo 0.0.0.0 192.168.62.1 0.0.0.0 UG 1 0 0 eth0
You see that the Linux box with the serial cable in it know about the route to the Macintosh ED. This box has 192.168.62.10 as ethernet card IP adres (eth0)and 192.168.62.31 as sl0 IP adres. See picture:

Posted Image



2) My connection to the internet. I cann't connect the Macintosh ED directly to the Intrenet so I keep it in the internal network. I have to do some network trick to get you all to my internal network, like using no-ip.com to make my internet IP adres permanent resolvable. I setup DNS for macplus.vanegten.com to a no-ip.com address. I also use protforwarding to get you to my internal web server.
However this picture show how it wil look if you login with a normal Linux ftp client:

Posted Image

Not a simple setup....but I like to work on things like that!
More questions are welcome!

Collection: Apple II (ITT 2020), LISA 2, Macintosh 128K, 512K, Plus, ED, SE, Portable, PowerBook 100 and a FastPath5 router.
Looking for TCP/IP over LocalTalk?? I made something very usefull... Look at http://www.macip.net


#6 mactjaap

mactjaap
  • 6502
  • LocationThe Netherlands

Posted 16 January 2011 - 02:56 PM

Server is up and running again after my test to download Fetch Installer via Basilisk II....

http://macplus.vanegten.com/ftp2.php

Collection: Apple II (ITT 2020), LISA 2, Macintosh 128K, 512K, Plus, ED, SE, Portable, PowerBook 100 and a FastPath5 router.
Looking for TCP/IP over LocalTalk?? I made something very usefull... Look at http://www.macip.net


#7 mactjaap

mactjaap
  • 6502
  • LocationThe Netherlands

Posted 16 January 2011 - 04:24 PM

Forgot the ping..... so server down agian.... :(
Restarted and setup a ping....

Working again!

Collection: Apple II (ITT 2020), LISA 2, Macintosh 128K, 512K, Plus, ED, SE, Portable, PowerBook 100 and a FastPath5 router.
Looking for TCP/IP over LocalTalk?? I made something very usefull... Look at http://www.macip.net


#8 Scott Baret

Scott Baret
  • 68LC040
  • LocationPittsburgh, PA

Posted 16 January 2011 - 05:53 PM

Somewhat unrelated to the discussion, but I did want to ask--are Macintosh EDs still common in the Netherlands? (Many of the EDs I've seen in service seem to be from your part of the world). I noticed you're using one for this application and despite my recent downsizing I'm still looking for one and have been for years--was wondering if Dutch classifieds and auction sites would be the way to go (didn't find any on ebay.nl today though).
"Education is life."

#9 mactjaap

mactjaap
  • 6502
  • LocationThe Netherlands

Posted 16 January 2011 - 06:02 PM

@Scott Baret

Yes they are not really difficult, but transport will cost a lot...
I'll PM you some sites.

Collection: Apple II (ITT 2020), LISA 2, Macintosh 128K, 512K, Plus, ED, SE, Portable, PowerBook 100 and a FastPath5 router.
Looking for TCP/IP over LocalTalk?? I made something very usefull... Look at http://www.macip.net


#10 Scott Baret

Scott Baret
  • 68LC040
  • LocationPittsburgh, PA

Posted 16 January 2011 - 06:46 PM

Sounds good to me--and yes, I'm prepared to pay high shipping costs. Can't wait to check out the sites!
"Education is life."

#11 mactjaap

mactjaap
  • 6502
  • LocationThe Netherlands

Posted 16 January 2011 - 10:21 PM

Server is going offline now. Anyone who want to see it again....just PM me!

Collection: Apple II (ITT 2020), LISA 2, Macintosh 128K, 512K, Plus, ED, SE, Portable, PowerBook 100 and a FastPath5 router.
Looking for TCP/IP over LocalTalk?? I made something very usefull... Look at http://www.macip.net


#12 mactjaap

mactjaap
  • 6502
  • LocationThe Netherlands

Posted 19 January 2011 - 08:05 PM

Small update......

I tried to get it running on the TCP/IP stack of NSCA Telnet...but I don't get it running...

I switched to my DaynaLink SCSI device and...yes then I can get it working without MacTCP.
I use in the config.tel

hardware=EtherSC

Collection: Apple II (ITT 2020), LISA 2, Macintosh 128K, 512K, Plus, ED, SE, Portable, PowerBook 100 and a FastPath5 router.
Looking for TCP/IP over LocalTalk?? I made something very usefull... Look at http://www.macip.net


#13 mactjaap

mactjaap
  • 6502
  • LocationThe Netherlands

Posted 19 January 2011 - 08:08 PM

I have the server agian up and running.....
Test for yourself on:

http://macplus.vanegten.com/ftp.php

Collection: Apple II (ITT 2020), LISA 2, Macintosh 128K, 512K, Plus, ED, SE, Portable, PowerBook 100 and a FastPath5 router.
Looking for TCP/IP over LocalTalk?? I made something very usefull... Look at http://www.macip.net


#14 mactjaap

mactjaap
  • 6502
  • LocationThe Netherlands

Posted 19 January 2011 - 10:19 PM

And...the server is down again...
Will test later if I get NSCA TCP/IP working over serail conection.

I found this parameter in the manual:

hardware=Serial
Maybe that will do the trick.... :-/

Collection: Apple II (ITT 2020), LISA 2, Macintosh 128K, 512K, Plus, ED, SE, Portable, PowerBook 100 and a FastPath5 router.
Looking for TCP/IP over LocalTalk?? I made something very usefull... Look at http://www.macip.net





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