Quadra 950 PPC + VideoVision = Madness!

[CelGen]

So I finally sourced the break-out box for the Nubus version fo the Radius VideoVision (because apparently the PCI one is different).

I plugged it into my specced Quadra 950 and powered the box on, got the chime...then it blew chimes. I'm thinking "Oh no, I must of killed the VideoVision somehow." so I remove the VideoVision and try again and it boots fine but I then try another VideoVision card and it too does the same thing and blows chimes.

Puzzled, I unplug the VideoVision and try again. It boots fine. :?:

Okay, that's...odd. So I think of what could be the problem as I assume the break-out box is nothing special and inside of it, there isn't anything special.

I then start to wonder if the NuBus VideoVision is PowerPC compatible but then realize that it does work with the 8100 so I wonder what might be funny. Seeing as how he Quadra 950 was originally a 33mhz 68040, as a last ditch effort, I disable the PowerPC card. I then power back up in 68K mode. It boots.

This completely blows me off my chair. What the hell?! :-/

I let the system boot and the Radius software works fine. It's at this point it hits me that either there's a loopback somewhere in the breakout box that acts as a security dongle....or if Radius was REALLY dirty, they put a software security dongle in the moulded plastic connector that the break-out box uses to connect to the VideoVision board with.

Still, how on earth would this make the Radius VideoVision incompatible with a PowerPC equipped Quarda 950? It should not be messing around with the system this early in the boot.

 

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

The VideoVision's Drivers need to be one of the first loaded because it's a Video Card at heart. IIRC, whenever a Radius Video Card is installed, the Radius/RadiusWare Logo is displayed in the lower left corner preceding the appearance of the Happy/Sad Mac . . .

. . . or even the: :?:

What kind of PPC Upgrade Card are you using, Apple's? If so, no wonder it doesn't work! BLECH!!!!

If you've got one, hack an 8100 MoBo into your 950 and get one of the remaining Crescendo NuBus G3/400/1MB Accelerator's from Sonnet's Online Store . . .

. . . that should very handily blow the doors off any PPC upgrade Apple EVER provided! :lol:

Did I mention that it gets along swimmingly with the VideoVision Studio Card. :?:

Then again, it might just be an extension load order problem, but I doubt it. Shutting down a 68040 to start up an early PPC Proc on a conversion card was likely done in the most ugly way imaginable, and all ways were likely very ugly to begin with!

 

[CelGen]

If I'm to go with a full-fledged G3, I'm better off using the Media100 or Avid Truevision sets (yes, multiples of both) I have for my G3/450 9600.

The Quadra 950 is a nice box (with some upgrades). I guess this just means that I will have to put the card in my Quadra 700 and see if any of my Avid capture cards will work instead as this isn't anything that a patch or a replacement extension can fix unless different revisions of the boards had different levels of compatibility.

What kind of PPC Upgrade Card are you using, Apple's? If so, no wonder it doesn't work! BLECH!!!!

Are they that poor?

 

[Unknown_K]

Yes, the breakout box is different for the PCI and Nubus versions of the Videovision.

What software revision are you using? There are a few versions out there that work on the Videovision (68k only), Videovision Studio (the add-on board stuck in the middle of the card plus the smaller board with RAM I think), and the final version that has a new ROM so it works with the Telecast Nubus card.

 

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

What kind of PPC Upgrade Card are you using, Apple's? If so, no wonder it doesn't work! BLECH!!!!

Are they that poor?

Of course, they're as rudimentary an implementation of PPC as Apple could get away with/manage to kluge together! Apple had a near zero incentive to provide them at all and did so only because their established user base was up in arms about being left out in the cold when it came to running PPC ONLY Apps as they became available.

Apple, naturally, wanted its user base to buy new machines with beaucoups profit margins, NOT rinky-dink little upgrade cards with incremental $ involved.

Back on topic for a change:

ISTR that the Videovision/VideoVision Studio dates back to the IIfx era. I think that's where I'll wind up setting up my NuBus VidCap. I don't know which has the edge, VVStudio or the 8100 AVP Card, so I'll be testing that out in my Radius 81/110 before moving my VVStudio Card backwards through the time machine present in my menagerie of Macs..

 

[beachycove]

No experience at this end of these video systems, but here goes:

1. The 040-PDS PPC upgrade card came with a disk/ driver. Is there anything in the ReadMe for that Control Panel?

2. Have you tried turning off the PPC card in the Control Panel that accompanies it rather than simply removing the card? In other words, is the problem more likely in software or hardware?

3. Further to #2, I seem to recall that video applications and Nubus peripherals originally designed for the Quadra AV machines really did not work at all well in the early PPC machines, and that the problem lay in the System software; here we may have something akin to that going on. What System software are you running?

4. A fresh System (7.6.1, or 8.1, say)? Maybe pop in a spare hard disk, do the business, and see what happens. It would be telling if you could not get the thing to boot with all the cards installed from an Install Me First floppy that is dated later than the hardware.

5. Zap yer PRAM. Actually, that should have been #1.

 

[CelGen]

My VideoVision software appears to be version 2.0

I did not have the installation diskette for the PPC card when I got it however the installer for System 7.6 included a compatible control panel (called "Power Macintoch Card"). To turn the card on or off you have to switch it on or off in the control panel, then completely turn the computer off and then back on to switch between modes. Restarting does not switch modes. As stated above, I currently run system 7.6.1.

I can not to a PRAM zap (CMD + Option + P + R) in PowerPC mode with the box pugged in at all. The system will blow chimes before it ever registers the keystrokes. With the box unplugged it will zap and then drop back down to 68K mode.

I guess what I can do is waht the card was initially designed for: Do a clean install of my system and software in 68K mode and then if anything I have either works better in or only supports PPC mode, I can switch to the card and install and run it from there.

Normally I don't have this problem as I have a 9600 to handle everything under 9.2.2 but space is premium right now.

 

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

From the better late than never peanut gallery: from the VideoVision 2 Upgrade Notes August 1994

"This release does NOT support the Power Macintosh PDS upgrade card."

Supported CPUs:

8100

8100AV

WorkGroup Server 9150

"Using VideoVision Studio in the PowerMacintosh 7100 or 7100AV is not recommended."

Now that's a strange one! I don't remember anything at all about that incompaibility. It's likely another lily-livered Apple PSU kinda deal, like IIsi/Rocket incompatibility, as well as olePigeon's longstanding problems with even a 7100 PSU being underpowered for IIci Rocketization.

I was going to hang my own tales of VideoVision Studio Madness off the end of this topic, but decided to prep a new thread. Documenting the long overdue TLC infusion for the, much neglected, pet Radius 81/100 will wait for a later day.

To stave off a bit of the madness, does anyone have docs on the last OS supported by VideoVision Studio. I'm limiting my own experimentation to OS 7.5.1, the last OS for the NuBus Architecture Macs, unadulterated by PCI Support. The above quoted 1984 version of this 1993 ReadME is most unhelpful in this regard.

The TidBit about OS 7.5.1 and NuBus Card optimization came from the Radius Q&A regarding the Thunder IV GX 1600, which will be housed in the Radius 81/110/G3/400/1M.

 

[CelGen]

Oh, this old thread.

I ended up swapping out the VideoVision with a Media100 the moment I got my hands on it. Seemed to behave better.