On switches for a Mac Mini G4 gaming LAN

[ArmorAlley]

I'm setting up a gaming LAN for up to 6 Mac Mini G4s (running 9.2.2 & 10.3). It won't (necessarily) be online and will have its own little NAS. A secondhand 8-port 10/100 switch from someone like NetGear or LevelOne is what I'm looking at getting.

The thought occurred to me that the choice of switch might make a difference. I have a functional knowledge of switches. They work for me. Some are manageable and least two of mine are (they have PC-style serial ports). I know that I don't (yet) know about Jumbo Frames, QoS or why the big Cisco switches have slots for RAM inside them.

Mac Mini G4s have 10/100 ethernet, so a gigabit switch doesn't seem to bring much to the party.

My questions are:

 1. Will any old 10/100 8-port switch be up to the job?

 2. Are there any options on a managed switch that would noticeably improve gameplay?

 3. Since the no. of combinations within a 4-port switch is fewer than that of an 8-port switch. Since most of the time, there will be 4 people or fewer playing, would a 4-port switch be faster than an 8-port switch?

 4. Aside from the fact that modern switches has gigabit (or higher) ethernet packet-switching, do they perform better than older 10/100 switches?

 5. What specific attributes of a switch should I pay attention to?

 6. Are there any manufacturers that make good quality switches whom I should look out for?

I have just read of the Wikipedia entry on switches [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Network_switch] and this entry on gaming switches [https://gadgetsenthusiast.com/gaming/accessories/best-ethernet-switch-for-gaming/] but I am really not much wiser afterwards.

Thanks for your help.

 

[cheesestraws]

I usually spend my life fiddling with the other end of the switch spectrum, but most of the knowledge transfers.  I think it's important to note that you're not asking for a lot from this switch.  Even now, gaming doesn't really stress networks out very much, and the "gamer" attitude towards switches and network equipment has a certain resemblence to the audiophile attitude.  So, here's my twopenn'orth:

 1. Will any old 10/100 8-port switch be up to the job?

Pretty much any reasonably reputable office switch should do what you want, honestly.  I'd suggest aiming for one designed for an office type environment, they tend to be slightly better physically built. 

 2. Are there any options on a managed switch that would noticeably improve gameplay?

Not meaningfully, and there's more to go wrong.

 3. Since the no. of combinations within a 4-port switch is fewer than that of an 8-port switch. Since most of the time, there will be 4 people or fewer playing, would a 4-port switch be faster than an 8-port switch?

Not meaningfully, no.  You can pick number of ports for convenience, generally.  I personally tend to find 8 ports is a nicely convenient size.  That's 4 machines, an uplink, a laptop for temporary mucking about (or a wireless AP), a server of some description and one port left over because I've inevitably forgotten something because I'm disorganised.

 4. Aside from the fact that modern switches has gigabit (or higher) ethernet packet-switching, do they perform better than older 10/100 switches?

Mostly reliability wins here, plus you can then use it for gig networking if you decide you want to later.  Though personally I feel that there's very little reason not to go for gigabit these days, and their general quality is better simply due to the onward march of technology and them being newer.  Ethernet's backwards-compatibility is generally excellent, and by the 100mbit era you probably won't have to worry about complications with what switch you plug into.  My personal feeling on this is that new gig switches are so cheap now—in the UK, one can get a perfectly decent 8-port one, of a model that I've used and was completely solid for me, for under £30—and a 5-port gig switch (though I haven't used this) for under £20—that unless you can pick one up nearly for free, it's not worth going second hand.  At those prices, for me, at least, the warranty and the assurance of getting something that works is worth the extra over a second-hand one.

 5. What specific attributes of a switch should I pay attention to? 

For what you're doing, honestly, "is it likely to fall to bits" and "is it made by someone reputable".

 6. Are there any manufacturers that make good quality switches whom I should look out for? 

For the kind of stuff you're talking about here, I've tended to use NetGear small office switches, and I've found those generally to be really solid.  I've had less luck with linksys ones, but I'm fairly sure that you could find someone else that has had exactly the inverse experience. 

An affordable model I have had very good experiences with is the NetGear GS108, which is still available new but has been around long enough to be available second-hand too: one of these was the central switch in my home network for probably 3 or 4 years, and I've only just decommissioned it (to replace it with something overengineered and ill-advisable, but hey, fun is fun, right? ).  There's a smaller switch in that range, the GS105, that I remember having decent experiences with, but I can't remember where I actually used one.

this entry on gaming switches

This basically doesn't say anything useful and is confusingly written .  So don't worry about it .

 

[ArmorAlley]

Thank you very much @cheesestraws.

I've been using hubs & switches for the last 20 years, it never occurred to me to think about what performance difference there was between the different models of the switches out there.

At the SoHo level, there was the speed of the switch, the number of ports as well as finding a few hubs that were 10base only.

An 8-port office-type gigabit switch is what I should look for then.

 

[cheesestraws]

I've been using hubs & switches for the last 20 years

Oh, hope I didn't sound patronising then, it's hard to tell people's experience from posts so I tend to err towards over-explaining...

An 8-port office-type gigabit switch is what I should look for then.

If you don't get this sorted by the end of lockdown in the UK let me know and I can send you one of my spares.  I really don't need 4 spare gig ethernet switches (I replaced 3 small switches with one big switch recently), it would be nice if one could go somewhere it's actually going to be used .

 

[ArmorAlley]

Oh, hope I didn't sound patronising then, it's hard to tell people's experience from posts so I tend to err towards over-explaining...

If you don't get this sorted by the end of lockdown in the UK let me know and I can send you one of my spares.  I really don't need 4 spare gig ethernet switches (I replaced 3 small switches with one big switch recently), it would be nice if one could go somewhere it's actually going to be used .

No, you gave me exactly the info that I had been looking for. You were not patronising in the slightest.

Switches were always a simple tool. I have used them for 20 years in so far as I plugged them cables into them and networks happened (well, once I had gotten the various computers configured and figured out which cables need replacing).

With the exception of my Performa 475 on 10/100 switch, switches have never been a problem. With the Performa 475, I learnt that I needed a 10base-hub.

It only occurred to me today that there might more to them than I realised, hence the basic questions.

As for your offer, I'm watching two switches on a local auction site:

 1. HPE ProCurve Switch 1410-8G: https://www.ricardo.ch/de/a/hpe-procurve-switch-1410-8g-1113148470/

 2. Netgear 8 Port Gigabit Switch GS108: https://www.ricardo.ch/de/a/netgear-8-port-gigabit-switch-gs108-1114164556/

The former has a starting bid of CHF5 (+7 postage), the latter CHF10 (+ 7 postage). If either of these start to get pricey, I may take you up on your offer.

 

[cheesestraws]

As for your offer, I'm watching two switches on a local auction site:

Both of those sound like totally sensible switches for your use case to me

 

[trag]

Second the suggestions for the GS108.   I have found them to be reliable.  The ones I have are older, so I will qualify that with, assuming they haven't done some cost cutting in their components since then.    

In my experience, when these "desktop" switches "fail" it is almost always the AC adapter which has failed, not the switch.  There's just not much to go wrong with the switch.   Although I do have one older failed D-link switch that failed, but it's full of electrolytic capacitors, so I bet a recap would set it right.

Looking at Newegg, the GS108 is kind of pricey at ~$50.   They have a GS308 which looks the same except its grey instead of blue and costs about $30.  I wonder what the difference is.   

Switch knowledge is definitely a rabbit hole in which one could get lost.

But as a friend pointed out a couple of years ago, it's pretty mature technology.  You really can't go wrong easily.  Almost any switch with the needed number of ports and speed will work fine.

The last two home wiring closets I set up, the choice of switch had more to do with configuration/position of ports and indicators, than with brand.    Put a Netgear 24 port in one closet, because having the ports and lights on the same side worked with the direction to the outgoing connections.    Put a D-Link 24 port in another closet, because the cables came from behind, and they had a model with the ports on the back and the lights on the front.  Both have been working great for more than 3 years.  

 

[cheesestraws]

I wonder what the difference is.   

I was wondering this as well; apparently it's got a plastic case and "has a lower MTBF", whatever that means in terms of actual construction