High performance processor card

[mac2geezer]

I just acquired a card labeled "Apple High Performance Processor Card Model 1100" and on the side of the card is 820-0823-A. Supposedly for a 9500. I tried to find some info on the Apple site but no luck, so does anyone out there know anything about this card?

 

[Temetka]

It's a 250MHz 604e card.

1MB L2 cache.

Good proc. Always liked the 604e's. I'd find a 400MHz one if I were you though.

Well maybe not. Maybe we just forgot what 250MHz can actually do.

250 million instructions per second that just sounds bad ass.

 

[Unknown_K]

Not sure, I have seen it referenced as a 300 or 350 Mhz processor on the net. If so it would be one with 512K cache built onto the CPU card and would be from an 8600/9600 since a 9500 topped off at 200Mhz.

 

[mac2geezer]

There are 4 places on the card that are labeled 250,300,350,400 with R249 - R252 associated. Should be a resistor or jumper there??

The info that I got before acquiring this card was that it was for the 8500/9500 not the 8600/9600, but that may be wrong.

It would be nice to find some real Apple info.

 

[Quadraman]

That is a Mach V CPU and only usable on a Kansas motherboard, which were only used in the 8600 and 9600 250, 300, and 350 mhz models. The resistor you are probably looking at is the one in the lower left on the backside of the board. If you look closely you should see a tiny resistor next to the 250. These are really just identifiers and not the actual resistors that set the clock speed.

Temetka,

There were no 400mhz Mach V's. Some people have them because you can sometimes overclock the 350mhz models by relocating a resistor. Not all 350's can do it, though, and it is risky as the soldering requires a very steady hand and good eyes to prevent destroying the board.

 

[Franklinstein]

I may have to look through some of my tech service manuals for specifics, but...

The Apple High Performance Processor module is exactly what the name implies: a high-performance processor module. It comes equipped with a PowerPC 604ev (or 604ev Mach 5), running at a minimum of 250MHz, with a max of 350MHz in the last versions. These boards also feature integrated high-speed caches, from 512k up to 1MB in the 300/350MHz variants.

These boards were virtually identical to one another - clock frequencies were set by setting the resistor matrix on the back of the card that you noted previously (a single resistor selects the speed - if you have a resistor soldered in the 250MHz spot, for example, your card runs a 250MHz processor). Though 400MHz was an option, Apple didn't ship any cards that ran at that speed, probably because they didn't want to compete with the PPC 750 in their newest machines.

These cards definitely work in the 86/9600-series machines (these boxes shipped with them), and should work in older models such as the 85/9500s with a similar 50MHz system bus (no guarantees, though).

 

[Quadraman]

I may have to look through some of my tech service manuals for specifics, but...
The Apple High Performance Processor module is exactly what the name implies: a high-performance processor module. It comes equipped with a PowerPC 604ev (or 604ev Mach 5), running at a minimum of 250MHz, with a max of 350MHz in the last versions. These boards also feature integrated high-speed caches, from 512k up to 1MB in the 300/350MHz variants.

These boards were virtually identical to one another - clock frequencies were set by setting the resistor matrix on the back of the card that you noted previously (a single resistor selects the speed - if you have a resistor soldered in the 250MHz spot, for example, your card runs a 250MHz processor). Though 400MHz was an option, Apple didn't ship any cards that ran at that speed, probably because they didn't want to compete with the PPC 750 in their newest machines.

These cards definitely work in the 86/9600-series machines (these boxes shipped with them), and should work in older models such as the 85/9500s with a similar 50MHz system bus (no guarantees, though).

No, that's wrong. The Mach V's will ONLY work with a Kansas motherboard. They will not work in a Tsunami motherboard. The Mach V CPU cards are not electrically compatible with the Tsunami CPU slot. I dug up an ancient thread from another forum where one of the users asks whether he can put the Mach V CPU in his 9600/200MP and the consensus is no.

http://www.macgurus.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14342

 

[alk]

Quadraman is right. The card is only compatible with the Kansas motherboards and certainly not with the 8500/9500 or any 8600/9600 with an original speed lower than 250 MHz.

Also, the resistor beside the 250 MHz label is an indicator only as already explained above. If you examine the board more closely, you'll see that those solder pads are completely isolated and receive no current whatsoever. To change the speed of the card, you have to change a resistor located elsewhere. The hack is explained here: http://www.bekkoame.ne.jp/~t-imai/ilcpce1.html

Here's another great page about these systems: http://www.xlr8yourmac.com/tips/mach5.html

I've got a pair of 300 MHz cards and one 350 MHz card. I overclocked one 300 MHz card to 350 MHz, and I overclocked the 350 MHz card to 400 MHz. They are all quite stable, but they do run hotter than stock, of course.

Peace,

Drew

 

[Bunsen]

250 million instructions per second that just sounds bad ass.

A clock sync rate of 250MHz doesn't mean 250 MIPS necessarily. Some instructions take more than one clock cycle.

 

[mac2geezer]

Thanks to all for the info; especially ALK for the links. The spaces labeled 250....400 have nothing soldered in, but the speed resistor matrix elsewhere indicates this is a 300Mhz board. I got this to install in the 9500 I'm hopefully getting from Orion, but maybe a 8600 or 9600 will come this way one of these months. Sigh! Only paid $11 for it, so no big deal at this point.

 

[Dan 7.1]

actually the Mach-V 604 was only available in 300 and 350MHz variants, everything else was just 604e's, and should be usable in the 85/9500's.

also, iirc the 86/9600's have essentially the same motherboard as the 85/9500's. i'm unaware of any specific differences.

 

[Temetka]

250 million instructions per second that just sounds bad ass.

A clock sync rate of 250MHz doesn't mean 250 MIPS necessarily. Some instructions take more than one clock cycle.

yeah, yeah, yeah....

Temetka,
There were no 400mhz Mach V's. Some people have them because you can sometimes overclock the 350mhz models by relocating a resistor. Not all 350's can do it, though, and it is risky as the soldering requires a very steady hand and good eyes to prevent destroying the board.

/slaps self.

Forgot I overclocked mine a long time ago. I installed a small fan on it to help cool. Myabe I'll take it apart and re-apply some thermal paste also. Those 604's sure are spritely little chips.

 

[Unknown_K]

My 8600/300 is pretty snappy, not sure looking for a 350 would be worth the effort.

Are the 604EV faster then a G3 w/512k cach of the same speed? Seems like you needed 1MB cache to get the G3s going well.

 

[Quadraman]

actually the Mach-V 604 was only available in 300 and 350MHz variants, everything else was just 604e's, and should be usable in the 85/9500's.
also, iirc the 86/9600's have essentially the same motherboard as the 85/9500's. i'm unaware of any specific differences.

Not true. The 8600/250 is a Mach V/Kansas machine. I have the CPU card in front of me now.

 

[Unknown_K]

The last 604E was a 200 (made by apple) and a 225 (made by a cloner). The 604EV would be 250 and above.

 

[tmtomh]

The last 604E was a 200 (made by apple) and a 225 (made by a cloner). The 604EV would be 250 and above.

Actually, Apple put out a 233MHz 604E (in a 9600) as well. But other than that, Unknown_K is exactly right.

M

 

[beachycove]

I got this to install in the 9500 I'm hopefully getting from Orion, but maybe a 8600 or 9600 will come this way one of these months. Sigh! Only paid $11 for it, so no big deal at this point.

It's slightly more complicated than just getting an 8600 or a 9600. Both of these models were produced with different logic boards in separate revisions of the model, one accommodating the 604e processor and the other accommodating the 604ev "Mach V" processor (which is what you have). As has been said, you need a machine with the "Kansas" logic board, and not one of the earlier, 604e-specific, 8600s or 9600s.

Now these "Mach V" machines are not especially rare, so what you might do if/when you get one is to experiment with the resistors on the spare card, and keep a processor card stock.

I run an ASIP web/fileserver on an 8600/300 604ev and it is very snappy and able. I noticed a big difference, especially for fileserving, between it and a 9500/200 604e that I had otherwise configured identically earlier along life's way. The 604ev really is an excellent processor, which gave the early G3s a run for their money in many processor-intensive tasks (e.g., better FPU scores).

 

[Unknown_K]

Apple bumped up the cache sizze on the 604ev so that sped things up (I think it is also faster bus speed then the cache that used to be on the motherboard on the 604e as well).

Either way a 604ev equipped Mac is very nice to have.

 

[alk]

Mach V/Kansas uses a 100 MHz "inline" L2 cache resident on the daughtercard instead of the 50 MHz look-aside cache of the PowerSurge/Tsunami/TNT boards. This probably helps. If the L2 cache were arranged like the G3 and operated at speeds like the G3 (1/2 to 1/3 the processor speed), there is no doubt that 604ev (also sometimes labeled as 604er if you listen to IBM) CPUs would have been serious competitors for years to come after introduction.

Peace,

Drew