• Updated 2023-07-12: Hello, Guest! Welcome back, and be sure to check out this follow-up post about our outage a week or so ago.

Help for a nubus Radius PrecisionColor Pro 24X ROM/firmware upgrade

Phipli

Well-known member
Right, the EEPROMs arrived this morning (have yours arrived yet @mg.man? 😆). I have verified that they are the correct part from the chip ID, and I have done a test write and erase to confirm they are writable and erasable. All good.mg

I've put together a combined banked ROM that is both non-pro 24XK and 24X in one chip and flashed it to a chip for testing in my 24XK.
 

Attachments

  • 20230602_124617.jpg
    20230602_124617.jpg
    4.1 MB · Views: 13
  • 20230602_124623.jpg
    20230602_124623.jpg
    3.9 MB · Views: 11
  • 20230602_124558.jpg
    20230602_124558.jpg
    7.3 MB · Views: 10

Phipli

Well-known member
Here is some test results, just XK Pro 1.6 vs XK 2.0. The change made basically no difference in performance, but the card now works with a PPC upgrade as expected. I ran benchmarks on 8, 16 and 24 bit on a IIci stock (25MHz 68030), with a PowerCache (50MHz 68030) and with a DayStar Turbo 601 (66MHz PPC601).

I haven't tested the 24X part of the ROM because I need to solder on the resistor mod first.

While functional, I wouldn't call this a good PowerPC card, performance was worse with the 601 than at 25MHz. The card does way better with the PowerCache, and from memory, even better with a 68040 (I don't have one to hand).

These cards make excellent Quadra cards. Otherwise, if you have an 030, a processor upgrade is probably more worthwhile.

20230602_140752.jpg
 

Phipli

Well-known member
Mod done... now this should Boot as a PC 24X with the jumper completely disconnected, and as a 24XK with the jumper fitter as from the factory.

Ignore the other jumper option, it does something else that Radius wanted.
 

Attachments

  • 20230602_143758.jpg
    20230602_143758.jpg
    2.1 MB · Views: 11
  • 20230602_144017.jpg
    20230602_144017.jpg
    3.3 MB · Views: 13

Phipli

Well-known member
Performance using the 24X (21" card) ROM in my 24XK (19" card) is identical, but doing so does provide the 1152x870 resolution! This is technically overclocking the RAMDAC to be clear as it is running at higher than the 80MHz rating, but nice to know it can do it with no obvious artifacts.

20230602_153000.jpg

I also tried it at 24bit and it worked.

I only did it for a few seconds in case it was getting warm. Perhaps I'll put a heatsink on it.
 

MJ313

Well-known member
Performance using the 24X (21" card) ROM in my 24XK (19" card) is identical, but doing so does provide the 1152x870 resolution! This is technically overclocking the RAMDAC to be clear as it is running at higher than the 80MHz rating, but nice to know it can do it with no obvious artifacts.

Nice! What version radius driver (quickcolor I guess?) are you using in your testing? (does it matter?)
 

Phipli

Well-known member
Nice! What version radius driver (quickcolor I guess?) are you using in your testing? (does it matter?)
QuickColor 1.3.1 running on Mac OS 7.5.5.

It might make some difference, perhaps not as much as ROM versions might. OS versions make a few % difference with some cards.

Too many permutations to try every variant with every control panel and OS though.
 

Phipli

Well-known member
Made another ROM with Apple 24AC v1.1 and Radius 24X v2.0.

Apple 24AC 1.1 is PPC compatible and runs accelerated in 7.5.5 with no additional software. "It just works". As my machine is set up, it doesn't seem to be offering 1152x870... but that might just be jumper settings.

Performance is provisionally identical to the 24X / 24XK.

@pizzigri what combination were you after? My dad has the Radius 24AC and Apple 24AC, but I won't see him for a few more weeks to rip the ROM :

20230602_162522.jpg

20230602_161412.jpg
 

Phipli

Well-known member
Well... that's been most of the day.

All tests done in a IIci, using a Radius PrecisionColor Pro 24XK, with various ROMs. Exceptions are Norton supplied Stock 6100, Stock IIci and Quadra 700. The Norton supplied results are all 8 bit colour, built in video.

Key...
030 : 25MHz 68030
50M 030 : 50MHz PowerCache
601 : 66MHz Daystar Turbo 601
NA : Not Accelerated
Unless specified, OS version is 7.5.5. Some tests were done with 7.6.1, and one with 8.5.1.
8b, 16b or 24b : the bit depth of the screen
The characters and other number are the ROM version fitted.

One more thing to try is that the card ran faster in 8.5.1 without the drivers, so I want to try again with the driver. I assume it is due to 8.5.1 being better PPC optimised.
 

Attachments

  • 20230602_190756.jpg
    20230602_190756.jpg
    1 MB · Views: 13

Phipli

Well-known member
Oh, awesome. Weirdly, the fastest graphics on my IIci is in Mac OS 8.5.1 using the PPC card and the Apple 24AC ROM.

20230602_192344.jpg
 

pizzigri

Well-known member
Apple 24AC 1.1 is PPC compatible and runs accelerated in 7.5.5 with no additional software. "It just works".
which begs the question : what the hell was the 24ac driver disk for? Unfortunately, I cannot read it.
 

Attachments

  • D8F99A95-9950-49B4-8CFC-D394E37C45D4.jpeg
    D8F99A95-9950-49B4-8CFC-D394E37C45D4.jpeg
    412.3 KB · Views: 12
  • 68442AE9-50B2-43B7-83B0-BA9197B7ECA8.jpeg
    68442AE9-50B2-43B7-83B0-BA9197B7ECA8.jpeg
    389.7 KB · Views: 11

Phipli

Well-known member
which begs the question : what the hell was the 24ac driver disk for? Unfortunately, I cannot read it.
I was wrong sorry, it did have a driver. I forgot to clarify. I didn't think it did because the Radius v2.0 ROMs weren't actually accelerated under PPC, and I started that round on PPC.

I saw the same results and assumed they were both working right.
 

pizzigri

Well-known member
And , if I read correctly the benchmarks, the Quadra700 is. like, faster then the 24ac by 30%?????
 

pizzigri

Well-known member
ah!!! You have those driver’s? I could not fond a working version of them anywhere, even the version that is in the Apple CD collection seems to not work!
 

Phipli

Well-known member
And , if I read correctly the benchmarks, the Quadra700 is. like, faster then the 24ac by 30%?????
Running in a IIci specifically - speed really depends on context. It would score better in a quadra.

But... the built in video on macs, quadras onwards especially is really fast. Very few NuBus cards can compete with Quadra video. Remember they are passing data through a 20MHz NuBus interface. Quadra video has a very efficient connection straight to the processor.

Even when a card benchmarks faster than a Quadra overall, you usually find it scores very well on some things, but badly on others.
 

Phipli

Well-known member
ah!!! You have those driver’s? I could not fond a working version of them anywhere, even the version that is in the Apple CD collection seems to not work!
Yeah, there is a driver CD that someone has trashed the resource forks online that is frustrating. It's about 75% dud files :(

But, that said, there is a working copy of version 1.2 on this CD (not the same CD as mentioned above) here :

 
Last edited:

Phipli

Well-known member
Aha, I’ve started to develop a reputation! Great!

I haven’t been following the thread. You guys playing around with Nubus video cards?
Just a bit of ROM ripping and swapping. I figure the only difference between the mid and high cards is the RAMDAC rating, so am going to swap in a faster part.
 
Top