Guide or recommendations for 8.0/8.1?

[bakkus]

Since we live in a post-spinning disk time where hard disk space isn't really a factor anymore, and we can easily swap drive images/SD cards I've put together my own collection of "standard" images.

I am of course standing on the shoulders of giants, so they are all based on various guides found online.

My 6.0.8 image, used mainly for 68000 and 68020 machines has the updates from https://web.archive.org/web/20160520083340/http://home.earthlink.net/~gamba2/system6.html

7.0.1 for "System 7 essentials, but starved for RAM" is based on https://web.archive.org/web/20160117220048/http://www.fenestrated.net/mac/701/ + https://web.archive.org/web/20160117220058/http://www.fenestrated.net/mac/701AddOn/

7.1 for "Practically everything System 7.5.5 can do, but lighter" is based on a combination of http://system7today.com/sys71-on-68k/ and https://erichelgeson.github.io/blog/2021/03/23/ultimate-system-7.1/ (there is some overlap)

7.5.5 for my 68040 machines is based on http://system7today.com/sys75-on-68k

I like to run 7.6.1 on my pre-G3 PowerPCs, so I have an image containing all the updates and recommendations from http://system7today.com/sys76-on-powerpc


But what about 8.0/8.1?
Is it the unloved child, result of a floundering 90s Apple in crisis? The compromise between the need for renewal and the failure of Copland?
The last gasp before the nanokernel rewrite for 8.6/9.x?
My Google-fu either completely fails me, or there is a distinct lack of guides, best-practices and bag-of-tricks blog posts about the early 8.x days.

So I ask you, dear readers: What are your fav QoL updates/tweaks to MacOS 8.0 and/or 8.1?

 

[chelseayr]

bakkus I can't directly help with this but I somewhat suspect 8.0/81 end up this way because it was a little slow for various 68k's and yet even although it was ok with early powermac there was also a reason for to just go to 8.5+ partially due to pci card requirements (if the card didn't work with 7.x then it pretty much expected at least 8.5 right away from what I've so far noticed myself)

I guess the one time 8.0 may unusually be really useful is for the few people that would have a 68k system with the daystar ppc card in it?

anyhow will like to see what others really say to either you and/or me here

 

[Cory5412]

This ultimately comes down to preferences and needs.

8.0 itself was renamed from 7.7 because Apple wanted (correctly) to end the clone program, and the easiest way to do that without getting sued too hard was to release Mac OS 8.0.

I think Apple had already given up on Copland and had been in the process of acquihiring another company with an OS. (NeXT.)

8.1 is said to be significantly faster, but IME 8.0 runs fine on most 040s and even most PPCs, even early ones.

I don't really like 7.5.x because it feels like an awkward inbetweener of fast, efficient 7.1 and 7.6.1 where there's quality of life and reliability boosts. Same for 8.5/6.

Here's my typical loadout:

• 000s, 020s, and slow 030s: 7.1.
• fast/capable 030s, particularly slow 040s: 7.6.1
• fast 040s, first/second-gen PPCs: 7.6.1 or 8.1 depending on the aesthetic needs of the machine
• fast/late second-gen PPCs that need to run newer software: 9.1
• G3s+: 9.2.2
• Highly upgraded G4s such as duallies, over a gig of ram, or late-stage graphics: OS X.

8.0-1 does end up being a bit of an inbetweener on my PPCs, although I'd still consider on, say, my 6100 and 6200 if/when I put new disks/storage in those, to be able to do HFS+ booting and take advantage of the slight boost in PPC code.

My 840 has either 8.0 or 8.1 on it, if it's 8.0 I'd like to upgrade it to 8.1. At some point I might pull out my 7200/90 and play with both 7.6.1 and 8.1 on it to see where things land. If it were a /120 I'd probably go right to 9.1 (at least as much for laughs as because I think it'd work well) but we'll see.

 

[Nixontheknight]

This ultimately comes down to preferences and needs.

8.0 itself was renamed from 7.7 because Apple wanted (correctly) to end the clone program, and the easiest way to do that without getting sued too hard was to release Mac OS 8.0.

I think Apple had already given up on Copland and had been in the process of acquihiring another company with an OS. (NeXT.)

8.1 is said to be significantly faster, but IME 8.0 runs fine on most 040s and even most PPCs, even early ones.

I don't really like 7.5.x because it feels like an awkward inbetweener of fast, efficient 7.1 and 7.6.1 where there's quality of life and reliability boosts. Same for 8.5/6.

Here's my typical loadout:

• 000s, 020s, and slow 030s: 7.1.
• fast/capable 030s, particularly slow 040s: 7.6.1
• fast 040s, first/second-gen PPCs: 7.6.1 or 8.1 depending on the aesthetic needs of the machine
• fast/late second-gen PPCs that need to run newer software: 9.1
• G3s+: 9.2.2
• Highly upgraded G4s such as duallies, over a gig of ram, or late-stage graphics: OS X.

8.0-1 does end up being a bit of an inbetweener on my PPCs, although I'd still consider on, say, my 6100 and 6200 if/when I put new disks/storage in those, to be able to do HFS+ booting and take advantage of the slight boost in PPC code.

My 840 has either 8.0 or 8.1 on it, if it's 8.0 I'd like to upgrade it to 8.1. At some point I might pull out my 7200/90 and play with both 7.6.1 and 8.1 on it to see where things land. If it were a /120 I'd probably go right to 9.1 (at least as much for laughs as because I think it'd work well) but we'll see.

8.1 also runs fine when hacked on my LC III which has its 030 overclocked to 33MHz, and its memory "maxed out" to 36MB, with plans to use a hidden RAS line and replace the 4MB onboard with 16MB to get 80MB total

 

[tecneeq]

For me it's 6.0.8 on anything Classic or smaller. 7.1 if there is a chance for A/UX, dual boot 8.1 if possible.

Everything newer than 8.1? See pic:

 

[bakkus]

@Cory5412 and @tecneeq Do you do anything to your 8.1 install?
Any extra extensions? QoL apps you can't live without?

Or do you run default install?

 

[tecneeq]

I don't, but now that i think about it, i should find something like "SetDate" for MacOS 8.1:

Classic MacOS Software

 

[bakkus]

I don't, but now that i think about it, i should find something like "SetDate" for MacOS 8.1:

Classic MacOS Software

"2020Patch" works for OSes up to 8.6 and is available at https://mactcp.net/macos2020.html

 

[tecneeq]

Cheers.

 

[mikes-macs]

Yes, what used to dictate which OS was practical for which Mac really boiled down to how much hard disk space your Mac had and how much would be left over for programs and documents. Plus printing and fonts.
When space on the HDD was limited like on an SE with a twenty mb hdd, MacOS system 7.5 full install with apple guide didn’t make sense or enough space to enjoy it. Better than swapping floppy disks I suppose.

 

[just.in.time]

Unless you have some specialty hardware (G3 accelerator, non-native supported network card, etc), the only things I’d add to 8.1 are a 2020 date patch of some sort and a screen saver. Otherwise just enjoy it with the software you want to use.

In my experience, 8.1 works great on every PPC that supports it when given enough RAM, even the L2 cache-less PowerBook 5300. Also runs well on every *040 based machine I’ve used it on.

 

[Nixontheknight]

Unless you have some specialty hardware (G3 accelerator, non-native supported network card, etc), the only things I’d add to 8.1 are a 2020 date patch of some sort and a screen saver. Otherwise just enjoy it with the software you want to use.

In my experience, 8.1 works great on every PPC that supports it when given enough RAM, even the L2 cache-less PowerBook 5300. Also runs well on every *040 based machine I’ve used it on.

it also works well on 030 machines if the OS is patched to run on said hardware

 

[Phipli]

it also works well on 030 machines if the OS is patched to run on said hardware

Yeah... but 9.1 works on a 6100/60, doesn't mean that you should do it!

 

[Nixontheknight]

Yeah... but 9.1 works on a 6100/60, doesn't mean that you should do it!

but in my experience (LC III clocked at 33MHz), it runs as good as a 25MHz 040 machine

 

[Phipli]

but in my experience (LC III clocked at 33MHz), it runs as good as a 25MHz 040 machine

Hum. Not sure if that is a little optimistic. In benchmarks a 50MHz 030 scores about equivalent to a 20 or 25MHz 040. And low end 040s aren't great with OS 8.

But its just speed at the end of the day. I run 7.1 on my SE, which is probably just as slow. Thats mainly driven my familiarity and compatibility though. I mostly run the most responsive OSes on each computer, so I often run 7.1.2 on 040s, with the option for booting 7.6.1 and 8.1 on other partitions if needed.

 

[Nixontheknight]

Hum. Not sure if that is a little optimistic. In benchmarks a 50MHz 030 scores about equivalent to a 20 or 25MHz 040. And low end 040s aren't great with OS 8.

But its just speed at the end of the day. I run 7.1 on my SE, which is probably just as slow. Thats mainly driven my familiarity and compatibility though. I mostly run the most responsive OSes on each computer, so I often run 7.1.2 on 040s, with the option for booting 7.6.1 and 8.1 on other partitions if needed.

isn't 7.1.2 PPC only?

 

[Phipli]

isn't 7.1.2 PPC only?

Nope, there is a PowerPC only installer, but there is also a universal installer. Also, weirdly, the PPC only installer actually lets you update 7.1 68k to 7.1.2, but won't let you do a clean install. 7.1.2 is the minimum system version for several Centris/Quadras/Performas, inluding the 630.

Weird, you're the second person to say that to me in the last while.

 

[Apfelklassik.de]

@bakkus did I miss it or did you actually make your images available?

 

[ArbysTPossum]

I've tried a lot of the MacOS versions, but I skipped a lot of them, after some testing.
68030 16/33Mhz: 7.5. 8.1 was possible with my 68LC40 accelerator, but it ran miserably on 10MB of RAM.
68040 33Mhz: 7.5, 8.1 was notably slower.
603ev 180/225Mhz: dual boot 7.6 and 8.6. 9.1 ran slower, DooM ran worse, as did MDK and Shattered Steel.
G3 400Mhz: still 8.6
G4 any: 9.2.2

9.1/9.2 are neat, but I find that they weigh pretty heavily on 603 processors. I don't think there's anything that 9.1 can do that 8.6 can't do with a extension.

 

[Nixontheknight]

I've tried a lot of the MacOS versions, but I skipped a lot of them, after some testing.
68030 16/33Mhz: 7.5. 8.1 was possible with my 68LC40 accelerator, but it ran miserably on 10MB of RAM.
68040 33Mhz: 7.5, 8.1 was notably slower.
603ev 180/225Mhz: dual boot 7.6 and 8.6. 9.1 ran slower, DooM ran worse, as did MDK and Shattered Steel.
G3 400Mhz: still 8.6
G4 any: 9.2.2

9.1/9.2 are neat, but I find that they weigh pretty heavily on 603 processors. I don't think there's anything that 9.1 can do that 8.6 can't do with a extension.

Honestly 8.1 on my LC III overclocked to 33MHz runs like a 25MHz 040, it's still good though