Anyway to use a PS2 keyboard with my Mac SE Superdrive?

[samalex]

Hi Everyone,

I'm trying to get my SE Superdrive (M5011) running again, but though I have the mouse that came with the system I'm unable to locate the ADB keyboard. I have a slew of PS2 keyboards, so is there any way to manually create a cross connector or maybe find one online that would let a small PS2 keyboard work with the SE Superdrive?

Thanks --

Sam

 

[techknight]

nope you gotta have a protocol translator adapter.

 

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

Long story short . . . ADB KBDs are very easy to find and very inexpensive as compared to finding the equivalent of my KeyStone adapter from Silicon Valley Bus Company.

http://68kmla.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=12214

http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1G1-15319284.html

 

[phreakout]

PS2 keyboards are NOT compatible. If you try to hook one up, you will kill both that keyboard and your Mac SE. Don't do it!

What you can do is buy an ADB keyboard on eBay for cheap. Strange but true, you can use an S-Video cable to link the keyboard to your Mac (try it, if you don''t believe me!). The S-Video cable amazingly is pin compatible to ADB and works without damaging your Mac.

73s de Phreakout. :rambo:

 

[Dennis Nedry]

Is there a remote desktop software that works on the SE? Except for startup hotkeys, you could potentially type on a different computer to the SE through a network connection. It's not a good or permanent method but it might work in a pinch. Also, if you have KeyCaps (System 7+) you can type with the mouse and copy/paste as necessary, but this does not allow you to hold down any modifier keys.

[...]my KeyStone adapter from Silicon Valley Bus Company.[...]

Have you had a peek inside this adapter? Does it look easy to duplicate? I'm sure the firmware is protected... bleh... But maybe not, you never know.

 

[Scott Baret]

Just make sure you get a GOOD ADB keyboard. Don't go for one of the mushy AppleDesigns.

I may have an extra Extended II laying around. I'll check and get back to you on that.

 

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

. . . my KeyStone adapter from Silicon Valley Bus Company. . . .

Have you had a peek inside this adapter? Does it look easy to duplicate? I'm sure the firmware is protected... bleh... But maybe not, you never know.

Yep, I was going to post pics of both sides of the PCB for somebody here and never got around to it. It's a very simple device.

It has a PC KBD Input and a DE-9 PC Serial Mouse input. So it needs a simple PS-2 Adapter for the KBD, dunno how hard it is to get RS-232 <-> PS-2 Mouse Comms up and running, ISTR a simple adapter for that as well. The ADB Power Button is on the side of the box and it's powered by the ADB bus, IIRC.

As far as FirmWare goes . . . can you even copy protect an old school 32 pin DIP EPROM? :?:

Dunno if the Bus Drivers are still out there in the Valley, but they might remember me from back in the day . . . I could just ask . . . )

 

[techknight]

Well if the eeprom is external of the MCU, then no you cant copy protect it that I am aware of.

But if the firmware is masked into the CPU at the factory, or using flash memory thats protected, then yes... it might be a bit hard to get the code out of it.

HOWEVER... Theres always that however. 99% of the time, if its a masked one time program MCU that is identical to its flash counterpart, such as a Pic16F84 and PIC16C84 (hypothetically) then usually the low level utilities are still in the core! its just you cant get to them due to fuses.

So using a glitch technique you could theoretically dump out the code if the device has a flash counterpart because 99% sure they used the same core. I used to mess with this with the AVR series of chips back in the day. you could glitch it during an ISP Erase routine and still retain the code but at the same time resetting the protection fuse. This was tough because the timing had to be dead-on. any drift and you lost the code.

with a masked MCU its much easier. because you cant "erase" it. This is all assuming the low-level functions are still present in a masked ROM or OTP based core.

 

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

Run-o-da-mill 32 pin EPROM with the Quartz window, circa 1990.

 

[Dennis Nedry]

We should copy that thing and make built-in PS/2 style ports.

 

[techknight]

yup. why re-invent the wheel with new hardware and microcontrollers when it already exists? Just copy it. lol.

Now I am starting to wonder what MCU it used.

 

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

I'll document the KeyStone and the CD SC's SCSI-AUDIO controller card tomorrow morning if I can. I don't have to be back at work until two, I've got Sunday off and the grlf is out of town visiting family for a few more days. [] ]'> [] ]'>

Forgot to mention that I've also got the OmniView Mac Adapter and the SwitchBox for their ADB Mac/PS-2 PC KVM Package [}] ]'>

MCU?

MC68L11D0P2

OC17F

QECL9404

Let us not forget that this is, ostensibly, a licensed ADB device. ADB is a proprietary technology held by Big Brother. 8-o

edit: the EPROM is only 28 pins!

 

[zuiko21]

As far as I know, the PS/2 protocol is well documented, and not really hard on CPU/MCU -- within the limits of a 6502 CPU. But the ADB protocol seems rather arcane... :?:

If that's a 68HC11 equivalent and a standard 28-pin EPROM, the whole circuit could be easily reproduced.

 

[techknight]

there are PS/2 libraries already out there for the AVR series microcontroller. Maybe for PIC as well.

 

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

I took the shots this morning, along with starting to document the parts of the CD SC I'm going to start hacking up. Pictures will be up soon, I think I'll start a thread in hacks or transfer this one there, now that it's turning into another Skunkworks project for the 68kMLA technical contingent.

I think it might be better to "clone" the OmniSwitch Mac Converter, as it does VGA as well for KVM setups. I've got a few other notions on the matter we can discuss after I start the Skunkworks.00 Topic in hacks & development. [] ]'>

 

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

Pics are up in the Skunkworks PS-2 <-> ADB Project thread in Hacks & Development.

 

[Von]

FWIW, Belkin made an adapter that allowed use of a PS/2 KB on an ADB Mac. I did a bit of searching and could not find the part number. I grabbed a couple of these off of Ebay a few years back. I will snap a photo when I can lay my hands on these.