Good & reasonable HDMI scaler: Extron RGB-HDMI 300(A)

[cheesestraws]

Couldn't tell you what the connector itself is called, but I have seen the exact same thing on Epson receipt printers

THAT'S where I've seen it before.  That's been really needling at me.

you'll probably have to do some probing around on the board to see what you can find. 

No need—helpfully, the pinouts for both the power and RS232 are printed on the back of the machine

 

[cheesestraws]

Ended up researching info on the ImageStar HD and came across an interesting output table.

Strongly suggest you spin out discussion on the ImageStar into its own thread.  Random lists of resolutions etc are going to confuse the issue if anyone uses this thread in future for support/reference.

 

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

Good idea, should I keep the Extron TPD results out too? That might be distracting as well. @Cory5412 would you strike that last post about the Imagestar from the record please?

 

[cheesestraws]

I keep the Extron TPD results out too

Dunno, "stuff you can plug into the Extron and make it work" seems like a reasonable fit for this thread given it has the device name in the title up to you.  It's just that nobody's going to look in a thread called "Extron RGB-HDMI 300" for info on the ImageStar

 

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

Yeah, though maybe I should wait to post positive/definitive results and cover experimentation/documentation in a sister thread?

BTW, Electrosonic and Extron were the same company with a name change, a buyout, a merger of two companies or summat? Imagestar must be an earlier generation product from before 1080p and HDMI connections became a thing, given lack support for the former and connector for the latter? Cracking the case today to see what's up, so I'll start another thread with pics etc.

 

[cheesestraws]

Yeah, though maybe I should wait to post positive/definitive results and cover experimentation/documentation in a sister thread?

Good plan  

 

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

Home sick today, so after mentioning this box last night in the Radius Pivot SE/30 BSOD thread i fiddled with it a bit. Can't get anything to display from the IIsi's built-in video, but I noticed something like a 75Hz setting while fiddling around in the onscreen menus, but not in PDF doc reading mood.

Macintosh IIsi

SuperMac Spec/8 SI

17 or 18 year old Olympus D-560 and terrible lighting conditions, but here's what I've got:

Fun pic shows 43" Toshiba 1080p .  .  .



.  .  .  and some tearing of some sort top & right.







The blank corners show, but there's a row or so of blank pixels above the menu bar that look much the same and tearout/whatever to the right. Once I hit the docs we;ll see what I can wring out of this cute lil' box. I had 1024x768 dialed in pretty well, but didn't think to document it. It's all going to depend on the portrait card's refresh rates I think. I've got Color Pivots for SE/30 and IIsi, but I need to fix my cable, oops!

This card appears to want to do a full two pages at 8-bit. But I only got this far with it. I wanted to concentrate on the Portrait/Pivot subject at hand.



I think the banding here is from mismatched input/output settings. No problems apparent when I got 480x870 dialed in, looked like a clean gray background?

1152x870 I can just go ahead and test on the big 21" Radius CRT. []

 

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

I had everything half put away when I went back and read your instructions. Set everything up again and used the 'TOT PIXEL PHS' of 1456 you suggested and got to almost perfect, from this IIsi card no less! This is a vast improvement over the seat of the pants approach got me above. Desktop pattern is perfect with zero banding.

You're undoubtedly right about the inputs being video feed specific. There appear to also be adjustments for widths of front and back porches. With the proper scanline width set and properly divided as front porch + active area + back porch etc, I should be able to get the rounded corners set up correctly and hopefully fix the very slight tearout at the top.



This should work out very nicely for my SE/Radius TPD if this IIsi/SuperMac Spec/8 SI setup is any indication. We can probably nail down Portrait and Pivot scaling as well.

One day I'll read the docs, but not until I'm feeling better, playtime was just about right for today. :approve:

 

[cheesestraws]

One day I'll read the docs, but not until I'm feeling better, playtime was just about right for today. :approve:

Yeah, it ... takes more fiddling-with than a PC-focussed scaler, but the results seem pretty nice.  I've been using it with my Q950's onboard video and it's been rock-solid.  The only thing I've had issues with with it so far are some of the weird older modes on my Acorns that are very low-resolution and have other weird and TV-like characteristics.  The documentation does have a table of PC modes and suggested settings for them, which is a good starting point.

 

[NJRoadfan]

The "beat" pattern you see is typical when you don't have the sampling phase and rate perfectly adjusted. All analog to digital video convertors (including the one in LCD panels) have this problem. Most have an "auto" button to set this, but many rely on standardized VESA modes to look up the optimal settings. The Mac's default checkerboard background is actually the best thing to have on screen when adjusting for the correct timings. You'll know when you get it right because the background becomes pixel perfect. The Acorn likely uses TV-RGB (240p or 252p for 50Hz modes)....those take trial and error since there wasn't one "standard" for horizontal pixel clocks on them.

 

[cheesestraws]

The "beat" pattern you see is typical when you don't have the sampling phase and rate perfectly adjusted

Yeah I certainly had to fiddle with the phase to make the background stop shimmering.  Did get it near-perfect, though.

The Acorn likely uses TV-RGB (240p or 252p for 50Hz modes)....those take trial and error since there wasn't one "standard" for horizontal pixel clocks on them. 

Yup.  Fortunately you can tell them they're not talking to a TV-type monitor, and they get a lot better behaved

 

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

I got the SuperMac Spec/8 SI dialed in about as perfectly as it gets. Tweaking the horizontal and vertical start points I've got rounded corners all around the clock. I think I got it saved as one of three user defaults. Gotta take pics before I tear it down and try to get the Radius TPD in the SE dialed in.

No joy on the SE/30 Pivot card in the IIsi. Gotta test it for function on one of the BigAss CRTs to verify that it's working, but no energy for that today. Old card might not be compatible with the 20MHz IIsi bus, some cards weren't. If so it'll be SE/30 testing one day.

 

[shadoooo]

Hello all,

I bought an Extron 300 A, which is working but appears to have an older firmware.

I would like to employ the PC application to fine setup and save/load of configurations.

I contacted Extron italian representative (I reside in Italy), but they won't give any support for second hand devices...

this is bad news from a big company like Extron, or maybe just from italian support.

Maybe anybody was lucky and has these available for share?

Thanks

Andrea

 

[cheesestraws]

I bought an Extron 300 A, which is working but appears to have an older firmware.

What version of the firmware do you have?  I can check what I have when I get home, but I have no idea how to extract it from the device...

 

[shadoooo]

Hello,

I don't think it's possible to extract the firmware from the device.

The only way is to get update files from Extron, if anybody has access to it.

Andrea

 

[cruff]

Version 1.16 appears to be the latest. I don't know how much of a hassle it would be if you signed up for the "insider program" to access the downloads and release notes.

 

[shadoooo]

I tried, but they answered they only support companies.

 

[gogopuffs]

I'm finding some exciting interest in this device and the price seems reasonable on eBay.  Was anyone successful in getting a modern firmware, and does it work across a variety of Macintosh video-out formats?

Thinking in terms of the built-in video of the Quadra 700, PowerMac 8500/8600, Macintosh LC/LCII.  It seems as though my old Dell Television from 2007 won't sync to the Macintosh LC no matter how I set the Sony MacSync jumpers. 

Thanks!

 

[cheesestraws]

Was anyone successful in getting a modern firmware

I'm just running whatever firmware mine came with; I believe the improvements are mostly about RS232 support, so unless you are trying to automate it, you can probably live without...

and does it work across a variety of Macintosh video-out formats?

I've tried it successfully with onboard video on LC II, LC III, IIsi, Q650, Q700, Q950, PM7100, and at one point a G3, and it worked fine with all of them, as well as with a couple of NuBus video cards.  It won't go down as far as old-school TV-style modes (like some of the older Acorns use) but I've not had issues throwing anything RGB from a Mac at it.

 

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

I've tried it successfully with onboard video on LC II, LC III, IIsi, Q650, Q700, Q950, PM7100, and at one point a G3, and it worked fine with all of them, as well as with a couple of NuBus video cards.  It won't go down as far as old-school TV-style modes (like some of the older Acorns use) but I've not had issues throwing anything RGB from a Mac at it.

I've only dialed in the SuperMac Spec/8 SI setup above to nearly perfect so far, but had some fun with rough setups for several.  May have to start from scratch for my as the box has been sitting unplugged August.

Maybe we should start a sister thread with only the data on on setup info? List the numbers to plug in for specific Macs/other platforms and specific Vidcards? That would leave this thread clear for helping each other developing the results for that table?

I've been busy with other things in the meantime, but will get back to the IIsi Vampire Video setup on a smaller panel combined with the SuperMac card on the TV in the near future. This box will be incredibly useful to me once I've nailed down setups for various Macs the hutch I use for hacking. With the oddball settings positioned at the lower right corner of the big flat panel it can work as a second screen or even a primary, single screen setup.

Thinking about picking up the "A" version which handles audio and will add third screen capability to the setup.