SCSI2SD Issues

[maceffects]

So I bought 5 SCSI2SD boards and have had major issues getting them to work.  I am trying on 3 different SE/30 machines.  I followed the instructions on how to flash it to work with Macs, but when installed in an SE/30 it doesn't show up (using Apple Drive software and Lido).  They do sometimes produce a steady but slow flash of the activity LED light.  Am I missing something?

[LaPorta]

I'll tell you: I have had more consternation with these than anything else. I've had to do innumerable things: supply external power while connected to SCSI bus, initialize on another machine first, connect to the external port while a standard HD was connected internally (don't ask me how that worked). The real trick I have found is in partitioning the SD card on a modern machine using Disk Utility so that it has a 2 GB partition (or however many you want if you are using a system that limits it), and then set the SCSI2SD to have that many SCSI drives. What I'll usually do if, say, I don't need more than the 2 GB is I'll make a 2 GB partition under OS X and leave the rest of the drive unallocated. This seems to confuse the hardware less and make it simpler.

 

Just a few suggestions; I haven't found the real magic in these things.

[haemogoblin]

Not pleased to read this, I recently bought one. I really hope I didn’t just waste the better part of £70

 

If mine doesn’t work right it’ll be returned, setting up a hard drive on a Mac shouldn’t require so much messing around.

[LaPorta]

Oh they work alright, I've gotten a bunch to work. I've yet to get a good, standardized approach, however.

[Realitystorm]

4 hours ago, haemogoblin said:

Not pleased to read this, I recently bought one. I really hope I didn’t just waste the better part of £70

 

If mine doesn’t work right it’ll be returned, setting up a hard drive on a Mac shouldn’t require so much messing around.

Have you tried the guide on my site?  http://www.savagetaylor.com/2018/01/05/setting-up-your-vintage-classic-68k-macintosh-using-a-scsi2sd-adapter/

I created it to help myself mainly.... I have a habit of playing with these machines then shelving the hobby for a few years, so wanted a place where I could keep instructions for my future self.

Others have found it useful.   Providing power through the USB connection seems to be a common fix.  The other issue is the settings stored in the SCSI2SD settings program aren't sorted to the SD card, so if you change cards you often have to update your settings again unless the cards are configured identically.

[haemogoblin]

Thanks, I literally ordered mine a few days ago. As my hd is showing its age. I'll check that link out for hints and tips.

[LaPorta]

I actually just had some much easier success. Configure the SCSI2SD to use whatever size HD you want. I have never, ever gotten it to work well with seeing it as multiple SCSI drive IDs, so I simply only use one SCSI ID and then partition that into multiple drives. What I found was the easiest method is just make sure the SD card has NO file system whatsoever. I erased it as all free space on my OS X 10.4 machine. Then, the patched version of HDSC Setup just sees a totally bare HD and will write the driver on it and help create partitions.

 

It was the easiest time I have had yet.

[sfiera]

1 hour ago, Realitystorm said:

Have you tried the guide on my site?  http://www.savagetaylor.com/2018/01/05/setting-up-your-vintage-classic-68k-macintosh-using-a-scsi2sd-adapter/

I created it to help myself mainly.... I have a habit of playing with these machines then shelving the hobby for a few years, so wanted a place where I could keep instructions for my future self.

Others have found it useful.   Providing power through the USB connection seems to be a common fix.  The other issue is the settings stored in the SCSI2SD settings program aren't sorted to the SD card, so if you change cards you often have to update your settings again unless the cards are configured identically.

Using one of the SD images from Realitystorm’s blog and providing USB power would have been my suggestions. Even if you would prefer to build your own image or rely on termination power, I’d start with that to help narrow down what the problem might be.

 

I also elected to run off an older 2GB SD card instead of thinking about partitions. Of course, 2GB SD cards aren’t common these days, so my Plus currently boots off a pink Hello Kitty-branded card.

[pcamen]

I'm very frustrated with mine lately.  I've set up a BUNCH of these and never had an issue, and in the last week I've had nothing but issues. 

 

I have a 5.0 version that I tried to set up for my SE/30.  I can copy all the files off the boot drive to one of the partitions, but the system folder won't become blessed.  I set the new drive to be the startup disk and it still boots from the internal HD. 

 

So I tried to set up a 5.1 version and I can't even get the darn thing initialized.  Harumph. 

 

I set it up with the SCSI2SD util as a single SCSI ID with all 32 GB of the card allocated to that device.  I am using the Vendor, Product ID, and Version

specified here:

 

 

Then I put it in a Mac and attempt to use either the patched (which should work given the Vendor, Product ID and Version I've given it) or the patched version of HD SC Setup).  But now I am getting failures on that.  "The disk could not be initialized.  Unable to mount volume".  I am just trying to initialize the drive before partitioning it.  The partition option is greyed out so I assume I need to partition it first. 

 

Furthermore, recently I put two SCSI2SD devices on the same Mac, tried it on a Lombard and a 540c, and tried to copy drive images from one to the other.  I keep getting "disk error occurred" messages.  WTF? 

 

Ug. 

[pcamen]

[pcamen]

10 minutes ago, pcamen said:

Then I put it in a Mac and attempt to use either the patched (which should work given the Vendor, Product ID and Version I've given it) or the patched version of HD SC Setup).  But now I am getting failures on that.  "The disk could not be initialized.  Unable to mount volume".  I am just trying to initialize the drive before partitioning it.  The partition option is greyed out so I assume I need to partition it first. 

Okay, well I figured out that one.  The 5.1 has SCSI termination controllable by the SCSI2SD utility.  I had it turned on and was using it in an external SCSI case.  The Lombard didn't like this.  So at least that problem is solved.

 

Can anyone point to a SCSI termination guide - when you need it and when you don't?  For example, does an internal drive on a system need it? 

[techknight]

Termination is REQUIRED on a SCSI bus. Period. 

 

At the end of the chain. 

 

So if there is a SCSI HDD in a Mac, you must terminate this drive. If you plug a drive externally, you MUST terminate that drive too! 

 

But if you insert a drive in the middle of the chain, you do NOT need to terminate those drives. 

 

only the END OF THE CHAIN needs terminated. If there is only one drive in the chain, That is your termination point. 

 

Terminators are there to impedance match the "transmission lines" to prevent reflections, or bus errors. 

Edited November 12, 2019 by techknight

[just.in.time]

@techknight if I’m not mistaken (though I may be), the SCSI2SD v5.x boards have on board termination and I want to say it is enabled out of the box (physically on older red boards, via firmware on newer green boards)

 

I’ve had great luck setting up ~5 of these (SE/30, SE FDHD, CC, LC520/50, and a PM6100), all bus powered with only one of which I tried to play with the config settings on. Usually I just pop in a new SD card, plug into the Mac, and use Lido to partition the SD into ~2gb partitions (except the pm6100, let it have all the space on OS 9.1). I give 4 partitions and leave the rest blank. I imagine the starting format of the SD card is fat/exfat or whatever would be PC compatible. Lido reformats it to Mac HFS. On the pm6100 after Lido I think I reformatted from finder to HFS+ prior to OS install iirc. But it’s been about a year since I set one up, maybe newer firmware has a bug or something.

[pcamen]

Holy crap why haven't I been using LIDO?

[techknight]

Yea, Lido is awesome. I use it for everything. 

 

I have 2, maybe 3 of these things and I have not had an issue yet setting any of them up. 

[pcamen]

Hmm.  4 gigabytes is 4194304 kilobytes according to this converter:

 

https://convertlive.com/u/convert/gigabytes/to/kilobytes#4

 

I must be a few k high, as my SE/30 running 7.5.5 rejected the partitions of that size. 

[LaPorta]

Only thing I don’t like about Lido is those awful HD icons it makes you choose from.

[pcamen]

ha ha ha ha. I actually thought they were kinda novel when I saw them.  Is there a better alternative for setting the HD icons? 

[dcr]

Was it System 7.5 or earlier that allowed you to change icons with cut and paste?  I seem to recall you could download files that contained blank folders with custom icons.  You clicked a folder with an icon you liked, did a "Get Info" on it, selected the icon in the info window, copied, then clicked your hard drive icon, did a "Get Info" on that, selected its icon in the info window and pasted.

[LaPorta]

You can do that with I believe 7 and later...but under 6 (which most systems that have my SCSI2SDs run) you cannot. I am sure if I was ambitious, those icons are just resources I could swap out with ResEdit.

[dcr]

10 minutes ago, LaPorta said:

You can do that with I believe 7 and later...but under 6 (which most systems that have my SCSI2SDs run) you cannot. I am sure if I was ambitious, those icons are just resources I could swap out with ResEdit.

They are.  I was just looking at it with ResEdit.  Not sure if you'd be limited to swapping out what's in there now or if it would be possible to add additional icons to choose from.

[pcamen]

Man, I am having the hardest time with a SCSI2SD in an SE/30.  I originally tried a 5.0a version, and struggled to get it to work, and then the system folder wouldn't bless.

 

So then I took a brand new 5.0 version with a 32GB card and set it up on my Lombard.  First a 2GB boot partition, then a bunch of 4GB partitions for data.  I am running 7.5.5 on the SE/30.

 

I managed to get the system drive copied over to the boot partition fine.  But the SE/30 won't recognize the other partitions.

 

At first I was getting an error that there was a problem when the system booted.

 

 

Then I switched over the SE/30 to boot from the SCSI2SD and I got a message for each drive that the it needed to be formatted, and it gave me the option to format.  But each time the format failed.

 

When I bring up HD SC Disk Utility, it won't let me do anything to any of the existing partitions as they are all locked. 

 

Lido doesn't seem to run on an SE/30 under 7.5.5.  Is it supposed to?

 

I've set up at least 6 SCSI2SD units and I've never had any issues like this before.  What gives?

 

 

[just.in.time]

I generally just stick to 1.99gb partitions (except for my pm6100 that I let utilize the whole sd card), just to be safe.

[pcamen]

Hmm.  Could it be because I don't have Mode32 installed and running?  What are the implications of that?  The strange thing is that I have other previously configured SCSI2SD devices with a bunch of 2GB and 4GB drives and the SE/30 sees them all. 

[just.in.time]

If you have others working just fine, I’d try taking one of their SD cards, put it in the problematic unit, and see if that rules out the issue. If yes, formatting issue. If issue persists, firmware configuration issue on the SCSI2SD itself. If that’s the case, I’d download the firmware from the web, reflash it, then make sure config matches a known good unit.