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joshc

LC475 / Power Macintosh 8200 / Performa 630

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Today's haul included a LC 475, a Power Macintosh 8200 (a Europe only model) and a Performa 630 (Quadra 630 elsewhere?).

 

The LC 475 powers on but the PSU crackles when I flip the power switch - very unassuring - and it doesn't chime and the hard drive struggles to power on and I didn't get any video output. I have an LC II which does power on so I could swap the PSU / HD  and retest, not had time to try this yet.

 

The 8200 was...interesting. As soon as I plugged it in, the PSU started sparking (I am not exaggerating, I am talking about real bright yellow sparks...) from the back and it smelled like something had exploded.  :-OI pulled the power cord immediately and had what felt like a small heart attack...unfortunately my Apple watch's battery had run out so I can't check what my heart rate was. :sadmac:

 

Needless to say, the 8200 I will be leaving for a while to ensure that any components that store energy have had a chance to drain before I open up the PSU and investigate WTF happened to it.

 

P.S. That case design is horrid, before testing it I opened it up to try and remove the PRAM battery and you have to remove about 5 different things just to get to the logicboard, it really says a lot about what was going on at Apple at the time...I believe this is a Spindler era design?

 

The third, the Performa 630, DOES power on and chimes, and gives video output (after an hour of messing with the dip switches on my VGA adapter...), and is very lovely even though the hard drive is very noisy. It's front panel doesn't like to stay on though.....:lol:

 

The 630 is running System 7.5 with 36MB RAM and has one of my favourite programs ever, Mavis Beacon 2.0, which I still credit my fast typing skills to this day. :-)

 

The LC 475 was £1, the Power Mac 8200 was £34 and the Performa 630 was £23 - I feel I overpaid a little for the Power Mac, but maybe I can get it working once the power supply is repaired.

 

More updates/pics to follow...

Edited by joshc

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2 hours ago, joshc said:

 

The LC 475 was £1, the Power Mac 8200 was £34 and the Performa 630 was £23 - I feel I overpaid a little for the Power Mac, but maybe I can get it working once the power supply is repaired.

 

More updates/pics to follow...

I think you got a pretty good deal overall, especially for the LC475 :)

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Here's the beast before it started causing me trouble and a small heart attack...

 

IMG_8642.thumb.jpg.789ea799012004a66e6aebc04c4880da.jpg

 

The LC 475 is clean inside, I swapped the PSU from my working LC II and it still powers on but I am not getting video output yet and I can tell that the hard drive spins initially but then spins down.

 

IMG_8640.thumb.jpg.9b1e2e07bd60873770b328add25cfad5.jpg

 

IMG_8639.thumb.jpg.05d968cc81c59f2928a38c19d8f308da.jpg

 

I opened up the Power Mac's PSU to find something a little different than I expected - a completely blown IC...

 

IMG_8646.thumb.jpg.8ae1e7c2dd0d9aed4f2f3d6733e56dbb.jpg

 

IMG_8647.thumb.jpg.965af2a561f2d23404cfc78bb73dee12.jpg

 

Since this looks irrepairable, and its made a bit of a mess and taken a few other components with it, has anyone got experience replacing these with an ATX style PSU?

 

Wondering what my options are for this machine really, I'm happy to part with it if anyone is interested in it for parts...

 

The Performa is the happiest machine, despite its front cover not staying on...

 

IMG_8641.thumb.jpg.b234355dbb9d17445582a7b41d74dbb2.jpg

 

IMG_8644.thumb.jpg.ac5f09be05aa10a49ece80924d54bb6d.jpg

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Quote

 

The LC 475 is clean inside, I swapped the PSU from my working LC II and it still powers on but I am not getting video output

The LC 475 requires a new/fresh batterie to output video, probably your issue here.

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47 minutes ago, bibilit said:

The LC 475 requires a new/fresh batterie to output video, probably your issue here.

Thanks for the tip - this rings a bell. It's funny because the LC II works fine without one. I'll give this a go & report back.

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Your photo of the 8200's PSU looks like it could be the photo of my Q840AV's PSU. I turned it on one evening while a friend was visiting, and it was acting a bit wacky. Shut down the 840, and went to bed. In the middle of the night the PSU let out this godawful loud *crack* and stank up the room.

 

It looked like this inside. 

840psu.jpg

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4 minutes ago, Danamania said:

Your photo of the 8200's PSU looks like it could be the photo of my Q840AV's PSU. I turned it on one evening while a friend was visiting, and it was acting a bit wacky. Shut down the 840, and went to bed. In the middle of the night the PSU let out this godawful loud *crack* and stank up the room.

 

It looked like this inside. 

840psu.jpg

@Danamania Wow, it looks the same ! What did you end up doing with it?

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Nice finds!

 

Bummer about the 8200's power supply, especially if I'm reading this right and it's a /120 - making it one of the faster 601s that shipped. It should if configurations were comparable to the 7200 come with a healthy-for-the-platform complement of cache. Plus, having one of the fastest 601 systems is pretty neat.

 

I've seen some rumblings about the start of an ATX to powermac power adapter, and 7200 would probably be in that group, so it may be worth holding onto it to see what comes of that.

 

19 hours ago, joshc said:

a Performa 630 (Quadra 630 elsewhere?).

think that the 630 family were available under LC, Performa, and Quadra labels globally.

 

In the US, configuration details largely went as such:

Performa models: home market, in-person retailers, often big-box stores and consumer electronics stores (sold next to washing machines and TVs instead of other computers), software/game/printer/modem/monitor bundle.

LC: Education primarily, keyboard/mouse and maybe ClarisWorks only.

Quadra: Normal Mac sales channel, full 040 with FPU. No software/monitor/printer bundled.

 

In the US, the Quadra was announced a few days before the Performa/LC were, but I still tend to classify it as an LC/Performa, because it shares its architecture and expansion with that family more than with most of the Quadras.

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1 hour ago, Cory5412 said:

 

think that the 630 family were available under LC, Performa, and Quadra labels globally.

 

In the US, configuration details largely went as such:

Performa models: home market, in-person retailers, often big-box stores and consumer electronics stores (sold next to washing machines and TVs instead of other computers), software/game/printer/modem/monitor bundle.

LC: Education primarily, keyboard/mouse and maybe ClarisWorks only.

 Quadra: Normal Mac sales channel, full 040 with FPU. No software/monitor/printer bundled.

 

In the US, the Quadra was announced a few days before the Performa/LC were, but I still tend to classify it as an LC/Performa, because it shares its architecture and expansion with that family more than with most of the Quadras.

Yep - we in Australia never got Quadra or Performa 630, it was just LC630.

Cheers

AP

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I just recapped an Astec PSU from a Quadra 605/Performa 475 this week! It was about $7. It came from a friend so I'm not sure what the behavior was before I recapped it but he said it didn't work. I've attached the BOM from DigiKey in .csv format if you decide that it's bad caps.

Astec Quadra 605:475 PSU Capacitors.csv

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The LC475 probably works OK, just to the old on-off-on in quick succession to get it to boot

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So far no luck with the LC 475 - it powers on fine but no chime even with a new PRAM battery, I suspect bad caps on the motherboard have killed the sound and video so that will be a project for a little later.

 

I am leaning towards re-selling the Power Macintosh 8200 to someone more keen on doing a custom PSU project with it - I have enough systems already that require repairs - if anyone in the UK wants to pick up the 8200 I'm happy to sell it for what I paid for it (I am in Bracknell, near London), otherwise I might consider selling individual parts if anyone is interested (the logicboard looks very clean).

 

The Performa 630 is a happy chap (apart from that front bezel) and might be worth keeping, it seems pretty speedy and once I get it connected to my network it should be a pretty handy machine.

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Current status of my 475...

 

Recapped logicboard

Recapped PSU

 

Still no video/chime, it is not POSTing because the floppy drive does not initialise and nothing happens if I insert a disk. PSU is known good as it works in my LC II.

 

Tried a PRAM reset, no good.

Tried removing the RAM, no good.

 

Possible things to investigate

 

Reclean logicboard

Try a different 040 CPU

Test the PRAM battery is giving 3.6v

Test every solder pad's continuity

Try with VRAM from my LC II

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Would it be helpful to meet up (once lockdown is over, of course) and I'll bring my working LC475 and we can swap out parts until we find the culpit? I'll take that Power Mac off your hands too...

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On 3/17/2020 at 2:25 PM, Cory5412 said:

In the US, the Quadra was announced a few days before the Performa/LC were, but I still tend to classify it as an LC/Performa, because it shares its architecture and expansion with that family more than with most of the Quadras.

A Quadra is a Quadra is a Quadra. You wanna try that same line of reasoning and start calling the venerable Quadra 605 an LC and then face the wrath of the maniac? Quadra 605 didn't even have a CoPro and it's still all Quadra. My Quadra 630 did and that set it apart from all its offspring. I'll now rest my case or do I have to get @Danamania involved in this long running bit of nonsense? :o)

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13 minutes ago, Trash80toHP_Mini said:

 Quadra 605 didn't even have a CoPro and it's still all Quadra. 

No it's not, it's a badge engineered LC at best :p

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I bought one when they first came out (it was the first Mac I bought on my own).

It was so a Quadra - it said so right there on front!

 

Apple wouldn't put it on there if it weren't so!

:-)

 

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1 hour ago, Paulie said:
1 hour ago, Trash80toHP_Mini said:

 Quadra 605 didn't even have a CoPro and it's still all Quadra. 

No it's not, it's a badge engineered LC at best 

The 605 is all Quadra, the LC475 is Quadra beaten unmercifully with an ugly stick and then marketed to the unwashed masses, right dana? :approve:

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So, I am pretty certain there are broken traces or a faulty IC on the logicboard of my 475, unfortunately.

 

I've tried all methods of diagnosis, swapping things, with no luck.

 

I've removed C128 and C127 at the suggestion of techknight (on my separate reddit thread about this same machine) but so far I cannot see any trace damage there. Everything is pretty tiny so I'm at the point where I could really do with a microscope to see where the problem lies...

 

5 hours ago, Paulie said:

Would it be helpful to meet up (once lockdown is over, of course) and I'll bring my working LC475 and we can swap out parts until we find the culpit? I'll take that Power Mac off your hands too...

 

Absolutely, sounds like a great idea, hopefully that will be this year and not next year! I am certain my LC 475 will boot with a different logicboard in there, I have no reason to believe it could be any other part unless its faulty VRAM but I can't see how faulty VRAM would cause no chime at all ?

 

Infact, as I say that, I am pretty sure it is chiming, the sound is just garbled/non working because of a problem with a dead trace or faulty IC I think.

Edited by joshc

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35 minutes ago, joshc said:

Infact, as I say that, I am pretty sure it is chiming, the sound is just garbled/non working because of a problem with a dead trace or faulty IC I think.

May be an obvious question, but does it chime if you plug headphones into it? Mine doesn't chime (I think the speaker is dying/dead), although occasionally it makes a weird garbled sound. The chime comes through fine through the headphone socket, though.

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12 hours ago, Trash80toHP_Mini said:

Quadra 605 didn't even have a CoPro and it's still all Quadra.

Thought: When we discuss the Quadra-label version of the 630, I'm sure at least once you've said that the presence of the Full 040 is what makes something a Quadra. If that were true, and we were going to be internally consistent about this, then the Quadra 605 would be discontinued from being "A Quadra" for its lack of an FPU.

 

(Notably, the 610 also has this going on.)

 

I would say you could define Quadra (or at least non-AV quadras) by A/UX compatibility, which disqualifies the 630 and 605 as being True Quadras because of their [drumroll] chipset and video differences.

 

It's all badge engineering regardless, and the 630/605 are particularly low-rent Lexuses, in this context. Like, if Lexus badged up a Yaris.

 

In that "these designations aren't real, except when I want them to be" the 630 and 605 should probably have been Centrises. Centris was a model name sold to the same channels as Quadra, but it implied small-medium-business and small-office-home-office kinds of computers, which is where the 605/630 really fit. (Much more than the 650 and 800, for example.) The Centris line also inconsistently had Ethernet (And, you could argue onboard Ethernet is the sign of a True Quadra, but) and inconsistently had full/LC040s.

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Any picture of the Logic Board ?

 

can be related to the Egret chip, U29 in your board, causing a lot of issues. 

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4 hours ago, Cory5412 said:

Thought: When we discuss the Quadra-label version of the 630, I'm sure at least once you've said that the presence of the Full 040 is what makes something a Quadra. If that were true, and we were going to be internally consistent about this, then the Quadra 605 would be discontinued from being "A Quadra" for its lack of an FPU.

 

(Notably, the 610 also has this going on.)

 

I would say you could define Quadra (or at least non-AV quadras) by A/UX compatibility, which disqualifies the 630 and 605 as being True Quadras because of their [drumroll] chipset and video differences.

 

It's all badge engineering regardless, and the 630/605 are particularly low-rent Lexuses, in this context. Like, if Lexus badged up a Yaris.

 

In that "these designations aren't real, except when I want them to be" the 630 and 605 should probably have been Centrises. Centris was a model name sold to the same channels as Quadra, but it implied small-medium-business and small-office-home-office kinds of computers, which is where the 605/630 really fit. (Much more than the 650 and 800, for example.) The Centris line also inconsistently had Ethernet (And, you could argue onboard Ethernet is the sign of a True Quadra, but) and inconsistently had full/LC040s.

 

And add to the mix that the LC630 *did* come with a full 040 (at least in Australia), then it's... all whatever is defined as whatever. The only bit of internal consistency I think any company ever did was between equivalent releases at the same time.  I'd be happy with "Quadra" to mean "040" which brings the Powerbook 500s and 190 into the fold, and a bunch of LCs and Performas too.

 

Worked for Apple later with the G3/G4/G5 biz, which was a little more consistent.

 

Besides, it's a quarter century past when any of it mattered, I say the 605 stays a Quadra because it's too ace a little box to not get that ace name. :)

 

 

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