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travistouchdown

Major Score! 8600 with Sonnet CPU, 3DFX card, Etc

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So...i'll start this by saying i've wanted a 9600 for years.  The last 6 slot mac and beige powerhouse before the G series took over.   But when this 8600 came up locally on craigslist for peanuts i couldn't say no!  

 

Its a 8600 from Nov 1997 and came with the following upgrades:

 

-500Mhz Sonnet CPU card

-3DFX Voodoo III Mac edition

-USB PCI Card

-Ram Upgraded (though not maxed out)

-Hardrive upgraded much larger than stock

-Second newer CDRW-ROM drive in expansion bay

 

Case has a few scuffs here and there but no cracks or missing panels.  It was mostly just dirty.  I spent hours cleaning it and it looks surprisingly good.  I'll probably individually retrobright the panels to get it to 99%.

 

Also came with:

 

-ADB Keyboard and Mouse

-Toshiba 17" CRT Monitor which is a total tank.

 

Sorry for the no photos, will get some up as soon as possible.

 

Paid $100 even for this whole lot; which i think is a steal! 

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Congrats, and yeah I'd agree you got an absolute steal there.  The Voodoo3 card alone goes for almost as much as you paid for everything.  Assuming you got it from the original owner, sounds like they were a Mac gamer since I wouldn't think people trying to do any sort of graphics work would be springing for a gamer video card.

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Yes they were the second owner and mentioned they had the Marathon Trilogy and some other games on there.   Pics to follow ASAP! 

 

I would have taken some yesterday but didn't want my wife to see them on my phone over the weekend and ask "whats this honey?" haha

 

 

CRT.jpg

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Yes, I am fortunate my entire collection fits into my basement closet for that reason. She doesn't know what is coming or going...

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Congratulations and I am very happy for you.

I have many happy memories of the Voodoo III 2000 card (but on a PC). Half Life, StarCraft, Quake II & Quake III all ran well on it.

With the possible exception of a PCI SATA card (with SIL3112 chipset) and SATA drive, I would not make any changes to this system.

Leave it as it is.

That being said, keep the heat of the system in mind. There is a lot inside that machine that generates heat.

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1 hour ago, ArmorAlley said:

Congratulations and I am very happy for you.

I have many happy memories of the Voodoo III 2000 card (but on a PC). Half Life, StarCraft, Quake II & Quake III all ran well on it.

With the possible exception of a PCI SATA card (with SIL3112 chipset) and SATA drive, I would not make any changes to this system.

Leave it as it is.

That being said, keep the heat of the system in mind. There is a lot inside that machine that generates heat.

Thanks!  I actually had this card in a PC back in the day as well (Macs were too expensive by the late 90s (Pre imac) for my parents to buy me another one.)

 

I have ONE PCI slot left!  Maybe i should look into that PCI SATA card :) Would this one work?

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/PCI-SATA-2Ports-SIL3112/233366061775?hash=item3655b382cf:g:D0kAAOSwHMldn~bg 

 

The only thing i plan to do to it; (besides clean it up as much as possibly cosmetically) is to top off the RAM (why not?) 

 

Also maybe add the last two 1MB VRAM DIMMS?  Would that help any other processing or will it have no impact if i'm using a video card? 

Edited by travistouchdown

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2 hours ago, LaPorta said:

Yes, I am fortunate my entire collection fits into my basement closet for that reason. She doesn't know what is coming or going...

Ah, but what LaPorta isn't telling his wife is that it's like one of those hidden night clubs behind the closet door and is 1000 qft stacked floor to ceiling. ;)

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Congratulations! These are great systems! An 8600/300 is one of my daily vintage Macs for pretty much everything except for some programs I have which need a G3. I'll probably put 7.6.1 on it at some point and just have a 7/9 split.

 

I'm almost afraid to ask, but what speed did it start as, and do you have the original CPU? The 8600 and 9600 /250 and faster are unique among PCI power Macs for having the 604ev "Mach5" processor, which is a slightly update to the baseline 8600 and 9600 design, which itself is nearly identical to 8500 and 9500, which itself is what many of the clones are based on. It's a great system either way, but if you got the original Mach5 CPU, I'd argue it's that much better, if only for the interest factor, because Mach5 didn't save the 8600 and 9600 from being absolutely curbstomped by the Power Macintosh G3 in performance.

 

5 hours ago, travistouchdown said:

So...i'll start this by saying i've wanted a 9600 for years.  The last 6 slot mac and beige powerhouse before the G series took over.

Largely, I think the 9500 and 9600 are overrated. Six-slot PCI PowerMac builds are extremely boring to the point of being literally formulaic. There's a "here's how you build the best PowerMac 9600" post floating around here and some other vintage Mac web sites, and to be perfectly honest, the result of that is that you get a slow Power Macintosh G4 that's less good at running OS X, should the need arise.

 

2 hours ago, ArmorAlley said:

That being said, keep the heat of the system in mind. There is a lot inside that machine that generates heat.

On the Mach5 (/250 and faster) 8600s, and I believe on the 9600s, there's a fairly large side fan. Does the /200 and/or this particular system not have that fan? I'd say that should keep things fine. It was designed with a bunch of '90s-era expansions, icnluding up to one full height 5.25-inch disk or two fast 3.5-inch disks at the bottom of the machine in mind. That, and, a G3 should run cooler than the 604e (even the ev) ever did.

 

(Although, I think it's largely a misnomer that the 604e/ev ever ran "hot" - keep in mind that what we think of as "hot" today is ~10-20x as hot as what was "hot" in the mid-late '90s, in office desktop computers. I suspect that the 604ev is probably a thoroughly bacon-frying 12-15 or so watts of TDP. G3s were known to be a bit less than that, if I'm remembering correctly.)

 

1 hour ago, travistouchdown said:

top off the RAM (why not?) 

How much does it have?

Because system 7/8/9 doesn't use all that much, and because launching enough programs to make use of much more will reduce system stability outside of a few fairly niche workflows, none of which involve gaming in any way.

 

It can't hurt, but to completely fill even an 8600 (whose max ram is 768 megs, IIRC) is largely a point in maxing something out exclusively because you can and not because it's a good idea.

 

1 hour ago, travistouchdown said:

Also maybe add the last two 1MB VRAM DIMMS?  Would that help any other processing or will it have no impact if i'm using a video card? 

Those will only impact the onboard video, so if you're not using it, then it won't help to add those additional pieces. I forget if there's any gotchas to using the a/v hardware with an add-in video card, so you might want to add the VRAM if you intend to do any video capture or output with it, which is absolutely one of the main things an 8500 or 8600 has over any 7000 series machine. (Other than the bigger case.)

 

Even then, it wouldn't really make anything faster, just make more video flows possible and make high color output on big/high resolution displays possible.

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Nice pickup! The 3DFX card is a great card to have for OS 9 gaming, it does get hot but the 8600 side panel fan should keep it cool enough.

 

RAM for these machines is dirt cheap, and you could probably find a decent PCI SATA or faster IDE card for it for some SSD goodness.

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1 hour ago, travistouchdown said:

It was originally an 8600/300.  The original processor is on the MOBO is it not; not on a daughter card that would have been removed?  

Ouch, that's admittedly a bit of a bummer.

 

No, on these the original CPUs were on a card that slotted in where the Sonnet upgrade is.

 

It's fine, in the sense that a G3@500 is a much faster CPU than the 604ev@300 was, and the system obviously works fine, but the Mach5 CPUs are fun and unique.

 

15 minutes ago, travistouchdown said:

Wonder what that is, IDE drive card?

Probably. That looks like around 40 pins. IDE would have been a pretty cheap upgrade for a machine that looks like it probably got daily driven into the early 2000s. Mainstream SCSI disks didn't increase all that much in capacity after Apple stopped using them, so if it was 2001 and you wanted to start using, IDK, iTunes on your 8600, it probably made more sense to pop an IDE card in than to try to buy a big enough SCSI hard disk. 300-gig SCSI disks did exist, but most average desktop uses didn't need that kind of performance and they'd need either adapters or their own card, which would have been more expensive. (I'm guessing iTunes based entirely on the combination of "bigger IDE disk, USB card, and CD-R/RW drive". All those parts can do any number of things, but connecting an iPod or another MP3 player and burning music CDs and having the hard disk space to support those things is a pretty specific set of activities. If the machine's still got its origiinal install or data on it you'd be able to tell pretty easily whether that was what happened.)

 

The other main option would've been a Firewire or USB upgrade, which it looks like the machine does have, but USB 1 is quite slow,  and it's entirely possible that this cost less overall than an FW+USB combo card.

 

 

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Finally got everything setup Friday night and spent about 4 hours on it. Great computer and monitor! Have some Cambridge Sound works beige speakers on the way to complete the look :) May do a flat screen LCD eventually...but this 17" Hitachi (Circa 1995) is actually really solid and looks great.

 

The newer CD-R drive is toast but everything else seems to work, cd rom, floppy drive and USB card.

 

Organized things and played games until 2am last night. 

 

IMG_20200110_231411.jpg

IMG_20200110_231352.jpg

IMG_20200110_235346.jpg

IMG_20200111_001118.jpg

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Thanks, giving the Marathon Trilogy another okay through soon for sure! Some fine early Bungie work right there.

 

Question: this machine is rated for up to OS 9.1, but since I have the G3 processor, there should be no reason I can't update to 9.2.2 right?

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41 minutes ago, travistouchdown said:

Thanks, giving the Marathon Trilogy another okay through soon for sure! Some fine early Bungie work right there.

 

Question: this machine is rated for up to OS 9.1, but since I have the G3 processor, there should be no reason I can't update to 9.2.2 right?

Nope. 9.1 is as far as it goes. It's the ROM that controls that, not the processor.

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No, a utility such as OS 9 Helper will get OS 9.2.2 on there without concern. Unless you’re running OS X alongside it though I’d just stick with 9.1

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9 hours ago, Byrd said:

No, a utility such as OS 9 Helper will get OS 9.2.2 on there without concern. Unless you’re running OS X alongside it though I’d just stick with 9.1

Interesting. This did not exist back when I was running my G4-upgraded 8500.

A long time ago.

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On 1/12/2020 at 1:02 AM, Unknown_K said:

Which model Hitachi is that and what is the max resolution?

 

So it's a Hitachi SuperScan Pro 17, Model #CM1786M-AD

 

Reccomended resolution with my system is 1024 x 786 @75hz, but looks like it will support up to 1600 x 1200 @60hz or 1152 x 870 @75hz  

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