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Arths

Macintosh SE FDHD

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Hey guys,

My FDHD is going nuts. Scored it yesterday morning and.. on the first power up the screen was waving and I could hear some cracks coming from the inside. Then it started to show a vetical line in the middle of the screen after some minutes.. well.. slapping the side of the Mac bring the image back to normal

Then I got the HDD rescued! But while I was looking at the contents of the HDD in the Finder mouse started to be reaaaaally slow, it was unusable. So I turned it off and rebooted. And BAM!

 

xx(

0000000F

0000000A

 

And it won't start since so I'm really disappointed because it looks really nice from the outside and the screen is awesome, pretty bright. :b&w:

If anybody could help me that would be nice, thanks :o)

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Okay, to break down your problems one at a time:

 

NOTE: Bear in mind that I'm using this web site as a reference, but since the SE/30 and earlier SE models use the same analog boards, power supplies, video board and CRT, it will do for the moment.

 

...on the first power up the screen was waving and I could hear some cracks coming from the inside. Then it started to show a vertical line in the middle of the screen after some minutes.. well.. slapping the side of the Mac bring the image back to normal.

 

Was the "wavy" screen with or without a "herringbone" pattern? If with, then you may have a problem with the flyback transformer (T2) on the analog board. Your best bet will be either to replace the flyback transformer or replace the analog board, your choice. If it's without the "herringbone" pattern, then the problem is in the power supply. It's easier just to replace that and be done with it.

 

Is the vertical line wide or narrow? If wide, then you've got a 3 possibilities: (1) The P1 connector has some cold solder joints, (2) The C15 electrolytic capacitor (3.9uF, 35V, 85degree C, High Frequency, Non-Polar) or (3) The L2 variable inductor on the analog board is the major cause of the problem. If the first 1, simply remove the old solder and apply a new amount. If 2 or 3, then replace the parts.

 

But while I was looking at the contents of the HDD in the Finder mouse started to be really slow, it was unusable. So I turned it off and rebooted. And BAM!

 

xx(

0000000F

0000000A

 

And it won't start since so I'm really disappointed because it looks really nice from the outside and the screen is awesome, pretty bright. :b&w:

 

I'm suspecting due to the symptoms, that the RAM is at fault. What you can try is re-seating the RAM sticks, even cleaning the contacts on both the sticks and slots using a pencil eraser, Q-Tips, Rubbing alcohol and a small brush (wire or old toothbrush). Sometimes corrosion builds up on the RAM stick's contacts after 20 plus years of use. The corrosion is breaking the electrical contact with each part. Cleaning them should return it back to working order. If not, then one or more sticks are faulty and need replacing. I'm not sure how much RAM is installed, so I'll assume you've got 1 or more megabytes total. As a tech note, the original 1 megabyte specification may have used 256 kilobits x 4 spec and when upgrading to more than 1 MB, the service tech had to disconnect a resistor on the logic board, indicating that higher density sticks were installed.

 

Another possibility is the hard drive. Sometimes these old drives can wear out and yours may have kicked the bucket. But then again, it could be working, just has some bad sectors or otherwise. I would try using Disk First Aid from Apple. It should work under System 6 and later. If you have trouble finding a copy, let us know and we'll get you it one way or another.

 

I hope these help!

 

73s de Phreakout. :rambo:

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Wow, thanks for all these answers! :O:D

 

Was the "wavy" screen with or without a "herringbone" pattern?

Well, it was not kind of waving after reflexion but more like showing glitches, artefacts. But slapping it a little bit revives it so I guess it would be cold solder joints. And nope, no pattern at all.

 

Is the vertical line wide or narrow?

It is wide, well I'll check out everything you told me, going to pull appart the beast today. ;)

 

I'm suspecting due to the symptoms, that the RAM is at fault. What you can try is re-seating the RAM sticks
Another possibility is the hard drive. Sometimes these old drives can wear out and yours may have kicked the bucket. But then again, it could be working, just has some bad sectors or otherwise. I would try using Disk First Aid from Apple. It should work under System 6 and later. If you have trouble finding a copy, let us know and we'll get you it one way or another.

Might be the RAM or the HDD, again I'll check this out today.

 

Thanks 73s de Phreakout, you're awesome and very helpful here :-*

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Good and.. bad news :b&w:

Well I actually disassembled the machine, everything seems to look fine.. except the battery exploded and corroded the metal house-case but thanks god logic board is working.

So I removed the battery, unmounted RAMs and ROMs and cleaned them. Yaaaay it's working again! 8-)

But.. ADB ports are not working anymore, I dunno why. They worked fine before the Macintosh shown a Sad Mac.

(And it's not the mouse, tested it on my Powerbook :I )

Any help?

 

As for the screen glitches, I don't really see anything wrong on the analogue board. And anyway I won't have the tools to repair it so.. :-/

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Drat. ADB failure. That happened to me, too. :(

 

Everything but the ADB was working on my SE (dual 800K floppy, 1MB RAM). I went to one site that said you can upgrade an SE to an SE/30 simply by swapping out the logic boards. Which is what I ended up doing; I bought a good used logic board from a 68kmla member and was back in business. I did have to mod the case a bit, since I wanted to trade out the dual 800K floppies for a hard drive and a 1.44MB Superdrive. I had to Dremel tool the front bezel, since the Superdrive floppy sits lower in profile than the original, plus I had to cut and bend/flex one of the floppy drive metal brackets to fit around a standard 3.5" half-height SCSI HDD.

 

If you still want to fix the ADB, I would probably start by seeing if someone on here has a spare SE logic board (Prefer one that has a good ADB, but is dead; never salvage/destroy a good working logic board for the sake of one part.) that they are willing to part with or if they can sell/give you the ADB controller chip. I'm not sure what other parts are associated in that circuit, be they capacitors, resistors, diodes, etc., but I would check them out as well. There's bound to be something else I'm forgetting.

 

There is an initial voltage test you could do to verify first if they truly are dead. There are 4 pins used on those connectors:

 

Pin #1 = Apple Desktop Bus (Macintosh bidirectional data bus; possibly direct to the controller chip)

 

Pin #2 = Power Switch (Switch to startup, reset or interrupt the computer. Only works with the Macintosh II family, Quadra 700, 900, and PowerBook series. Unused on all other models.)

 

Pin #3 = +5 Volts DC

 

Pin #4 = Ground (Earth)

 

Note : Power +5V is 200mA (500mA?); each peripheral should use 100mA max. You can daisy-chain up to 16 possible devices and the maximum length of the ADB is 5 meters. Strange but true, you can use S-Video cables as ADB cables; both type of cables are electrically wired the same way. On the Mac SE, SE FDHD Superdrive and SE FDHD, there are no fuses connected between the ADB jack and the chip, but on the SE/30 and later there is one. Use this site for reference.

 

So, it looks like you'll need to have a digital multimeter handy. What you can do (and this is perfectly safe to do) is to reconnect everything back together. Don't put the back plastic case or the RF shield back on. Place a pillow or a towel (folded up) on your table/workbench and orient the SE, so that the front display is facing down and the back is facing straight up. In front of you, you'll see the bottom of the logic board.

 

Locate the ADB ports. It doesn't matter which port you choose to test with, as long as you test one port at a time. You should see 7 solder points per ADB jack. It will look like this:

 

*(Ground) * (Ground) *(Ground)

* (Pin #2) * (Pin #1)

* (Pin #4) * (Pin #3)

 

Those are solder solder joints for those jacks. Turn on your multimeter and set it for measuring DC volts 1-12 range or equivalent. Turn on the SE. Place the tip of one probe (Red) carefully on Pin #3 and the other (Black) on Pin #4, making sure not to short/bridge across any other connections, since you're working on a "LIVE" circuit. You should see approximately 5 volts DC on the multimeter. This tells you that power is flowing through that jack. Repeat these steps for the other ADB jack. If you get nothing through one jack, then that single one is dead and the other is alive. If nothing on both jacks, then the ADB circuit is dead. Which part is faulty will be the question to ask; my bet could be the chip or another component.

 

Give this a try and report back with your findings. Good luck, mate. Go get 'em!

 

73s de Phreakout. :rambo:

 

PS: "73s" means best regards, "de" means this is, and Phreakout obviously is my username/handle. :beige:

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Drat. ADB failure. That happened to me, too. :(

That's what I thought. :(

 

Sadly I don't have a multimeter so I wont be able to test ADB ports, though I remarked something strange which makes me think that it's more of a "filter" problem. When I press the debugger switch while the machine is turned on, on the desktop. It writes "AAAAAA...." into the window like if I was typing on the keyboard. There is a component that has been completely corroded next to the battery holder, there is FILTER written on the motherboard under it so my guess is that one of these are dead maybe? :?:

 

Thanks for all these informations, I really appreciate it 8-o

As soon as I get my hands on a multimeter I'll test them asap.

 

PS: "73s" means best regards, "de" means this is, and Phreakout obviously is my username/handle.

 

Sorry, didn't know that :lol:

 

:o)

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That's an Amateur Radio thing, isn't it?

Ding! Ding! Ding! You, sir, are correct!

 

I have been a licensed ham since I was 21; 11 years and counting. I've got General class privileges. :rambo:

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Now, it's much easier to become a licensed ham. No more Morse Code requirements, even to get General or Extra class! Just take the written exam and if you pass with 74% or better, you will have your call sign and license in about 2 weeks. The Technician class exam is pretty easy, in my opinion.

 

NOTE: For all of you outside the United States, the above paragraph will make sense. I am not sure what the requirements are to be licensed in other countries, so you'll need to check with your local government representative to get more information.

 

73s de Phreakout. :rambo:

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The only thing I would ever use a license for is Digital stuff.

 

Example being long-range transverted Wi-Fi signals for areas without highspeed like campgrounds. Something i thought about for years, but the govt and others are actually starting to implement it.

 

But I do go the Dayton Hamvention every year. Last year was the score of the century for me, there was a booth that had shelves and shelves of compacts, etc.. Found my hyperdrive compact and the HD20 and macbottom HDD there during setup day. (dealer pass). Plus 2 400k external drives, both with cut cables so they are useless for anything.

 

next day someone bought and walked out with the entire shelving unit.

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I might have seen him, and never knew it was him. lol. You should come up :-) Its in may, and its right around the corner. Would look forward to meeting people. Never know what you will find either.

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Hey guys,

Quite a time wrap from 2012 isn’t it ? :-p

I got my Macintosh SE FDHD back from storage.

 

I really think that the screen glitches and Sad Macs I have from time to time might be caused by the Power Supply.

As of now, I am getting the right voltages from the floppy disk port (+5V and +12V) but the machine is running great so far. I’ll re-measure when it will start acting weird again.

 

I’ve tried to clean the rusty parts with vinegar and it seems the logic board is not as badly damaged as I thought.

ADB ports are still not working and that’s the main issue. :-/

 

You can find a picture of the logic board attached so maybe you can help me out.

Do you think this board is toasted ?

 

Thanks a lot,

Arths

 

PS : Believe it or not but the original hard drive started to spin again and loaded System 7, what a joke ! :grin:
 

C5EFC076-04B4-4CAC-9923-B4ECADBF0C6A.jpeg

A0C657BB-5A7F-4F12-84C4-36A0E8738218.jpeg

Edited by Arths

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Just tested the ADB ports while the computer is turned on, I get +5V for both.

The Dead Mac Scrolls indicates that it might be the Tokin filter, tested it as well, pins (1-8, 2-7..) show 0V which should be correct ?

 

I really don't understand why is the ADB not working. Plugging a keyboard makes its lights turn on but that's it.

Any help ? :-/

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