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Gorgonops

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  1. I wonder if it might have had a Rev. A the owner wanted to swap out, and the Yikes board was cheaper than a Rev. B. (It deserves to be, given the lack of ADB.) The 400mhz Yikes ZIF in my B&W I laid hands on when they were practically worthless. (It's complicated, but I actually got it and a 350mhz one for free.) I have no evidence to back this up, but considering how it seemed for a while that Yikes parts were actually more common than complete PCI G4 machines part of me wonders if Apple overproduced parts for them during that period they were ramping up the AGP G4s, which later ended up getting dumped on the grey market. (This was, of course, before Apple had really started turning the screws on independent Mac shops.) I'm all for upgrading machines "just 'cause" when the parts just fall into your hands, but my searches on eBay for affordable G4 ZIFs have been coming up snake eyes, and I also know first hand that the resulting machine isn't much of an improvement. When the upgrade costs more than a whole other *much better* machine the choice is easy.
  2. You can "trick" 10.5 onto an AGP G4 that's too slow to be on the supported list pretty easily, but as I recall at least it's *much* harder to get it on a Yikes or upgraded B&W. I believe that actually requires patching in some drivers/kernel extensions from a beta release, or something to that effect. 10.4 is the practical limit for that HW, and probably the optimal release for a lot of other reasons. The only argument for a lesser version of OS X would be if you wanted it to be an Appleshare server, but running 10.2 would actually render it pretty useless for some of the other tasks you want to do because the selection of compatible web browsers, etc, is much poorer. I still think you're utterly wasting your money on this whole G4 upgrade thing, it's hard to sugar coat it any other way, especially if your only goal for the hardware is a bridge Mac. Adding a G4 won't enable it to do anything it's not already capable of.
  3. When I installed a 400mhz G4 ZIF in my B&W (using the stock board because it's identical and by using it I didn't lose the ADB ports) I used the G3's heatsink and it fit fine. I'm 99.44% sure it's the same part as the Yikes shipped with; I've never been inside of a Yikes but from the pictures I've seen it looks the same. Third party ZIF modules that ran at much higher speeds usually shipped with their own bigger cooler, but for the stock ones the passive B&W sink is fine. Remember, when the case is closed the CPU is right next to the large slow-moving fan built into the case, a design Apple came up with to avoid the need for a whiny high-piched fan on the CPU cooler. A G4 at 400mhz only draws about as much power as a midrange Pentium MMX, you don't need a gigantic slab of metal on it.
  4. It looks like that auction comes with a 350mhz G4, if I'm interpreting the description correctly. As I wasted my time explaining on the other thread this CPU will provide basically *no* improvement over the B&W's stock G3 outside of a few very specific cases involving Altivec. The board takes "ZIF" CPUs, which was a daughterboard form factor used on three Apple computers; the Beige G3, the B&W, and the Yikes. Any CPU that fits the board you just bought will also fit in the board already installed in your computer. Third party vendors like Sonnet and XLR8 made ZIFs in both G3 and G4 flavors up to around 1Ghz, but anything faster than 500mhz tends to be really expensive. And, again, if that's really what you wanted it would have fit the board you have. And no, heatsinks for the later G4s won't fit. Some third party upgrades came with bigger heatsinks, or you can modify some Pentium heatsinks with fans to fit.
  5. It would make sense for the PBX ASIC to be on the motherboard in the 1400, because unlike the "Blackbird" the RAM modules are also connected to separate slots on the motherboard, not hanging off the CPU card. Note that the card also doesn't have the ROM chips on it. So, in short, it looks like there's a lot "less of the computer" on the CPU card in a 1400 vs. a Blackbird. The two connectors on the bottom of the 1400 card are almost certainly little more than a buffered version of the CPU's direct pinout. I'm going to hazard a guess that the mystery chip labeled "PBG3D" on that Sonnet 1400 upgrade are a cache controller for the SRAM chips; the 1400 originally didn't have a L2 cache.
  6. No, that is a "Sawtooth" AGP model. You can tell from both the port layout on the back (which is almost the only way to tell them apart with the case closed) and the brown AGP slot the video card is plugged into, among other things.
  7. That appears to be a "Yikes" (PCI Graphics) motherboard, yes. Which, again, I think is pretty pointless for you to buy unless you want the G4 CPU. If you look at the zoomed-in view of the port area here: in the listing you can see the *one* place where it differs from the motherboard already in your B&W, IE, see those blank solder pads next to the ethernet ports? That's where they omitted the ADB connectors. Also note this motherboard is missing both the modem and firewire module. The modem you probably don't care about but the missing firewire means you'd need to take the module from your B&W if you did a swap. I mean, seriously, I'm not sure why you've latched onto this as a thing you need to look for. It's not going to run any better than your current board. The "Yikes" was literally just a B&W with a G4 upgrade shoved in it which Apple only sold for a few months because they were having problems ramping up production on the AGP model, which is the "Real" Power Mac G4. I guess if you *really* want the G4 ZIF $30 for it isn't terrible, but it's only a 350mhz one; if your B&W happens to be a 400mhz one you'd actually take a little bit of a speed *hit* from swapping it.
  8. Nope. The Firewire module sits on a proprietary connector roughly equivalent to a CompactPCI connector and is just like an add-in card on the PCI bus with no firmware support.
  9. What? That's not how computer busses work.
  10. The "Yikes" was just known as the "Power Macintosh G4 (PCI Graphics)". And, seriously, don't waste your time. Other than lacking ADB ports it is identical to the board you have, it's not going to fix or improve anything about IDE functionality. If you really want a G4 upgrade you can buy the ZIF ala carte and plug it into the board you already have. (But last I looked at what G4 ZIFs were going for on eBay I suspect you'd be better off just getting a whole AGP G4 tower.) Also note that a G4 only really helps for OS X, there is *very* little Classic software that takes advantage of it, and under OS X about all you'll notice is that things like the icon scale and window minimization animations are smoother.
  11. I don't think the "Yikes" motherboard fixes anything about IDE or anything else relative the Rev. 2 B&W board. It omits the ADB ports and is recognized as a different part number but everything else is essentially identical. (The "different part number" is only significant in that Apple released a firmware upgrade for the B&W and Yikes that blocked G4 ZIFs from working in the B&W board; if you want to plug a G4 ZIF into your B&W there's a third-party patch that fixes that, I have a G4 ZIF in my B&W.)
  12. As long as the B&W's firmware doesn't decide to not play nice with your drive/adapter combination that should do fine. (The "decides not to play nice with it" is probably a significant caveat based on my bad luck with those blue plastic Macs, but perhaps I've just had an unusually unfortunate streak at the dice with them.) Back in the day (2005) there were stability issues with those SATA-IDE bridges but I've not heard much bad about them since.(*) Technically speaking OS X 10.4 (or 9 for that matter, I guess) aren't really optimized for SSDs, being they lack things like TRIM support, but assuming you're not going to be pounding on this 24/7 I don't see it being that much of a problem. EDIT: You know, reading the reviews for that bridge board isn't particularly encouraging. I just picked it for a link as it was close to the top of the list (and cheap), but one of the reviews specifically says they tried this (and several others) and none of them worked in a G4 cube. This Startech: https://www.amazon.com/StarTech-com-Drive-Optical-Adapter-Converter/dp/B00EOJNGC2/ has one review where someone says it works great for G4 macs, five stars, and another that's nowhere near as positive, so... I take it back. Apparently they do still involve rolling the dice.
  13. I have a Rev B. motherboard in my B&W and it's strangely picky about hard disks. It's been too long for me to be particularly specific about which drives it had problems with but it basically boiled down to "some work perfectly, some don't work at all, and some worked *seemingly* okay with OS 9 but wouldn't boot OS X". My vague memory is it hated Deskstars, full stop, had a weird issue with the Western Digital I tried where I could install OS X on it off a CD but when the machine tried to boot off the hard disk I got a big "(/)" NO! symbol on the screen, and Maxtor drives worked perfectly. My Bondi iMac had similar issues, which makes me suspect the problem was somewhere higher up in the firmware tree than the controller driver level. (The Bondi used the built-in 16.7Mb/s IDE controller on the Paddington I/O chip while the B&W uses an accessory UDMA/33 chip, so I'd presume there are different low-level drivers in play.) So unless you tried the same hard disks with the Rev. B board that failed on the Rev. A and had them work there's a possibility it wasn't the controller at fault for *that*.
  14. No. The problem with drives larger than 128GB is with the firmware of the computer, not some OS-level thing. ATA revisions lower than ATA-6 (Ultra ATA-100; the B&W's controller is ATA-33, aka, ATA-4 compliant) used 28-bit LBA addressing to access hard disk space, which means the maximum size of a hard disk is 2^28 (268,435,456) 512 byte (2^9) sectors, which makes the total accessible size of a hard disk 2^37 (137,438,953,472) bytes, or 128GB binary gigabytes. This is a *firmware level* limitation. (If you lived through the 1990's in the PC world you might remember various limitations like the 512MB and 2GB barriers; the former was a BIOS limit with CHS addressing, the latter was actually an ATA standard issue as the first revision only allowed 22 bit LBA. This is like that one.) ATA-6 changed to 48 bit addressing, which hypothetically allows disks as large as 144 petabytes; the 2TB limit Cory mentioned is due to another combination of problems largely on the OS side of the fence. Anyway, TL;DR, your machine simply cannot see hard disk space above the 128GB mark because its firmware can't use the alternate addressing mode. There was a company called Intech that sold a skanky driver that replaces the firmware driver and allows you to use larger drives on machines with non-compliant boot ROMs, but even at the time there were a lot of complaints about it. The only reliable way to get around this is buy an ATA-100 (or SATA) controller with a Mac ROM and connect your drives to it instead. (And, again, this sort of thing underlines why I'm not really a fan of the B&W. Sure, the first few revisions of AGP G4 were also handicapped by this limit, but they have bootable Firewire ports so there *is* a workaround already built into them.)
  15. Notice on the product page for that device the B&W is listed under "Computers below only recognize drive space up to 128GB*". That means that without some sort of special driver you can't utilize the space above the 128GB mark for any OS, either Classic or OS X. If you want to avoid wasting space you could go really bottom of the barrel like, say, this 120GB drive for $25: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01N6JQS8C/ And cobble together a SATA/PATA converter: https://www.amazon.com/Parallel-DVD-ROM-Interface-Convert-Adapter/dp/B0089F7KWY/ and mounting bracket and probably come out around $40, which may or may not be a worthwhile price savings over the native PATA SSD. Whether you install 9.x and OS X into separate partitions is pretty much up to you. The main reason *not* to install them in the same partition is mainly if you keep your 9.x stuff separate you're less likely to screw up OS X's files while booted into it. (Which is very much a thing that can happen.) But if you think you'll mostly be getting by in Classic mode you can save a little hassle and disk space by just putting them together. As to which version of OS X to go with, *unless* you're planning to try to leverage the backwards compatible Appletalk in 10.2 (I'd personally recommend NetaTalk on a Linux machine as a better Appletalk server solution for a number of reasons.) I'd go with 10.4. If you disable Spotlight and Dashboard it's no slower than any earlier version and there's a *much* better selection of software for it still floating around. (Including TenFourFox, the only modern and therefore remotely secure browser choice.) Leopard won't run on a B&W anyway, so it's as modern as you can go. (And it still has full Classic support, so you're not missing out on that.) To second regarding "better performance" out of an external floppy disk drive with USB 2.0, I don't think anyone actually made USB 2.0-specific USB floppies and it wouldn't matter anyway because USB 1.1 is still faster by a fair stretch than the interface between a floppy drive and its controller. (Or the data rate of the bits written to the disk. Note that you may well see ads for "USB 2.0 compatible" floppy drives, but I guarantee you that they just run at USB 2.0 "Full Speed", which is the same 12Mb/s as USB 1.1; the only distinction is the USB 2.0 version of it has a few protocol tweaks that allow it to more cleanly share a hub with faster devices than "native 1.1" devices.) Re: Firewire: remember, a B&W does have a Firewire port, but it's not bootable like it is on the AGP generation Macs. That makes it less useful than it might be otherwise.
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