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Topic |
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Trash80toG-4
NIGHT STALKER
USA
2899 Posts |
 Posted - 30 Jan 2003 : 14:53:56
I've got a BUNCH of dead bats for my Duos and I think I'll finally do the dirty deed.  I just cut open one of the ugly High Capacity BTI MC-T4's (the kind that protrude from the front a lil' bit) and discovered it was full of popsicle stick shims and Purple Toshiba 4/5A 1.2v NIMH batteries, which is why the pack sticks out the front. I'd wondered why they had stickers on both sides of the case, 2.5mm extra in diameter for each cell translates into NO CASE, the plastic ends and the nice thick sticker IS the case at the high spots!  Panasonic and others now make 1900-2100 mAh rated AA cells and 2000-2200 mAh rated 4/5A cells. I wondered if the charger chip on the little PCB between the two Battery Packs would handle the higher capacity cells? I think it mught JUST fit using full lenghth A cells in there! Is there a PCB/chip inside the standard packs that use AA cells? I don't feel like cutting another pack apart yet just to find out!  Here is all I could find on the 2200mAh cell: GO2200A - 1.2V- 2200mAh 17x49 mm - NiMh - G.Power Mark Panasonic lists the HHR210A as 2100mAh "nominal" with an average of 2200, maybe the other listing is a little "optimistic" as a non-mfr! Panasonic has great PDF info on these bats:
http://www.panasonic.com/industrial/battery/oem/chem/nicmet/ Interesting info (haven't read it yet, dunno if it IS good.) here:
http://members.aol.com/davthacker/nimhfaq.htm whatcha think?
jt  ™.
Trash Hauler: call sign: eight-ball
C.O. AC-130H SpecOps 68kMLAAF
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G4from128k
Full Member
USA
873 Posts |
Posted - 30 Jan 2003 : 15:34:26
The charger chip should be alright. Whether it ever fully charges higher capacity cells is another matter.Also, if you have a bunch of "dead" battery packs, you might be able to disassemble them, weed out the bad cells, and make some decent packs out of the remaining cells. In high drain applications, one bad cell can make the whole pack look dead, so many of the cells may have life left in them. Just be careful mixing cells of radically different capacities.
Happy charging,
G4From128k
by Day: Mild-Mannered Engineer and Trapeze(tm) Artist
by Night: Colonel of Truth, Justice, and the Macintosh Way
Reserve Officer in 68kMLA Cantankerous Coot Contingent
& User of the Hockey Puck Mouse of Radial Symmetry |
Trash80toG-4
NIGHT STALKER
USA
2899 Posts |
Posted - 30 Jan 2003 : 16:25:34
quote:
The charger chip should be alright. Whether it ever fully charges higher capacity cells is another matter.
Since they're "tagged" cells, I'll bet either:a) the chip doesn't care about the capacity variable and reads it from the bat tags in order to do whatever diagnostic indicated that the proper levels have been reached, or: b) the chip IS the "tag" and might not be necessary, dunno. Check out the fritter edition of this project, some more links popped up! BTW, I see you've started hangin' out over on the 'fritter too!
quote:
Also, if you have a bunch of "dead" battery packs, you might be able to disassemble them, weed out the bad cells, and make some decent packs out of the remaining cells. In high drain applications, one bad cell can make the whole pack look dead, so many of the cells may have life left in them. Just be careful mixing cells of radically different capacities.
Now THAT is one EXCELLENT suggestion!  ACK! %#%#%#%$#^#  . . . now to figure out how to test NIMH cells!?!! :rolleyes: jt ™.
Trash Hauler: call sign: eight-ball
C.O. AC-130H SpecOps 68kMLAAF |
G4from128k
Full Member
USA
873 Posts |
Posted - 30 Jan 2003 : 18:16:35
quote:
. . . now to figure out how to test NIMH cells!?!! :rolleyes:
That's not that hard. Just charge up the battery pack, then discharge it in your Duo, then place a modest resistive load on the battery pack (a couple of small 12V light bulbs in series or a 5 watt, 100 ohm resistor should do it ) and start checking the voltages of the individual cells. Bad cells will have a low or negative voltage as the good cells continue to push juice through them. quote:
BTW, I see you've started hangin' out over on the 'fritter too!
Yes, I have been doing a wee bit'o Frittering of late. Good luck repacking the batteries, G4From128k by Day: Mild-Mannered Engineer and Trapeze(tm) Artist
by Night: Colonel of Truth, Justice, and the Macintosh Way
Reserve Officer in 68kMLA Cantankerous Coot Contingent
& User of the Hockey Puck Mouse of Radial Symmetry |
jruschme
Junior Member
USA
196 Posts |
Posted - 31 Jan 2003 : 09:38:45
quote:
I've got a BUNCH of dead bats for my Duos and I think I'll finally do the dirty deed.
If any of those are Type 3's, I'd be willing to try running them through the SuperCharger. A lot easier than the rebuild.
<<<john>>>
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Trash80toG-4
NIGHT STALKER
USA
2899 Posts |
Posted - 31 Jan 2003 : 11:34:13
quote:
If any of those are Type 3's, I'd be willing to try running them through the SuperCharger. A lot easier than the rebuild.
Thanks for the offer, everal are, what kind of improvement are you seeing using the MiracleWorker(tm)?jt ™.
Trash Hauler: call sign: eight-ball
C.O. AC-130H SpecOps 68kMLAAF |
jruschme
Junior Member
USA
196 Posts |
Posted - 03 Feb 2003 : 13:26:58
quote:
quote:
If any of those are Type 3's, I'd be willing to try running them through the SuperCharger. A lot easier than the rebuild.
Thanks for the offer, everal are, what kind of improvement are you seeing using the MiracleWorker(tm)?
Hard to say... I don't have any real data on batteries which were alread working, only on ones which were totally dead to start with. <<<john>>> |
Trash80toG-4
NIGHT STALKER
USA
2899 Posts |
Posted - 03 Feb 2003 : 13:45:59
quote:
Hard to say... I don't have any real data on batteries which were alread working, only on ones which were totally dead to start with.
somehow . . . dead as a doornail->any length of time at all kinda improvement statistics seem like they might be exactly the kind of info I was looking for!   
jt ™.
Trash Hauler: call sign: eight-ball
C.O. AC-130H SpecOps 68kMLAAF edit: found the old thread to look for results:
topic.asp.TOPIC_ID=2590.html I had forgotten about the Apple external charger add-on I nabbed from Shreve's clearance. Didn't do much when I tried it at firse, then I remembered to check and I swapped the 1AMP 68k AC Adapter for the 1.5A 2300c model. The BTI Type 4 (the one that I hadn't yet disemboweled ) gave me a yellow flicker and went off so I kept inserting and removing it and I got a double on-of-on-off . . . so, hoping to build up enough of a charge cumulatively during the periods the circuitry was deciding to puke . . . . . . just I kept inserting and removing it.
and it worked! I got some flashes and then on-a-bit-off-four flickers-on-a-bit-off-fou . . . etc. for a bit and then a solid yellow charge indicator now for almost an hour! we'll see! Edited by - Trash80toG-4 on 03 Feb 2003 15:19:18 |
jruschme
Junior Member
USA
196 Posts |
Posted - 04 Feb 2003 : 08:23:57
quote:
somehow . . . dead as a doornail->any length of time at all kinda improvement statistics seem like they might be exactly the kind of info I was looking for!
Yeah, but if you graph it, you get all these asymptotic(sp?) lines that are just no fun to draw.IIRC, I've run 10 or 12 through the SuperCharger. All but two returned to life, averaging just under an hour under BatteryAmnesia. The other two did not treturn to usefullness after 4 or 5 days of trying, but could then be left in a Duo with no ill effect (no shutdown), so something did happen to them also.
quote:
I had forgotten about the Apple external charger add-on I nabbed from Shreve's clearance. Didn't do much when I tried it at firse, then I remembered to check and I swapped the 1AMP 68k AC Adapter for the 1.5A 2300c model.The BTI Type 4 (the one that I hadn't yet disemboweled ) gave me a yellow flicker and went off so I kept inserting and removing it and I got a double on-of-on-off . . . so, hoping to build up enough of a charge cumulatively during the periods the circuitry was deciding to puke . . . . . . just I kept inserting and removing it.
and it worked! I got some flashes and then on-a-bit-off-four flickers-on-a-bit-off-fou . . . etc. for a bit and then a solid yellow charge indicator now for almost an hour!
That sounds a lot like the one non-Apple "Type 3" which I got from somewhere. It has no visible manufacturer name, a Type 1 slider, and Apple's utility thinks it is a Type 1. (I suspect that it is more of a Type 1 with higher capacity cells.) From what I can tell, it has some real form and fit problems with the Apple external charger as I also get the flickering lights. I'm curious to see how your BTI goes, my noname never achieves a "full" charge in the Duo or charger. They both just keep trying to charge forever. <<<john>>> |
Trash80toG-4
NIGHT STALKER
USA
2899 Posts |
Posted - 04 Feb 2003 : 10:18:53
quote:
That sounds a lot like the one non-Apple "Type 3" which I got from somewhere. It has no visible manufacturer name, a Type 1 slider, and Apple's utility thinks it is a Type 1. (I suspect that it is more of a Type 1 with higher capacity cells.) From what I can tell, it has some real form and fit problems with the Apple external charger as I also get the flickering lights.
I've got another BTI that's JUST LIKE THAT! Terrible size match, Type 1 slide with the long button, breakaway tab and evrything! Besites the big BTI sticker, it has a 2-line barcode sticker on one short (button) side reading: MC-DUO2300 (the model number on the big sticker) and what looks like a serial number under the second line of barcode. There's an oval shaped, metallic gold sticker on the opposite side (adjacent to the contacts) reading:"Q.C. Passed 04" . . . if you want to check those features against yours. It yields a red light on the charger if you can shum-it-in-thar-far-nuf!  quote:
I'm curious to see how your BTI goes, my noname never achieves a "full" charge in the Duo or charger. They both just keep trying to charge forever.
The Big Type-4 BTI fits well, but snugly, in the charger. The four flickers (after a longer on-off-on-off) was a definite indication of borderline failure in a diagnostic routine, not any kind of contact problem. It was too regular, repeatable and "had the look!"I bailed on the first test cuz I was learning the routine, got 8 minutes on the first full test with BA.
It wouldn't boot without kick start with the AC Adapter after charging to green, but I pulled the plug immediately and got at least 16 minutes. But charging it overnight yielded a red light this morning and it shut down during boot. Green light after a few minutes and now it's discharging, but it thinks it only took 7 minutes when I read 16 on the meter before it conked out . . . =8-/ I don't think I'll bother soldering the cell back into the other pack I ripped apart, I think I'll just get some of the 2700mAh AF MONSTER CELLS and see what happens. It's a shame to have a pair of these UGLY@$$ ProtrudingGoiterPacks(tm) that aren't crammed to the gills with cells too big to fit into a standard (conformal) pack. I don't think I've EVER gotten 90 minutes, even out of a Duo bat purchased NIB, it's time to try a MaxiPack(tm) config. jt ™.
Trash Hauler: call sign: eight-ball
C.O. AC-130H SpecOps 68kMLAAF p.s. you mentioned an Apple utility that tells bat type??? Edited by - Trash80toG-4 on 04 Feb 2003 10:20:46 |
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Battery Time! Duo redux?
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