Radius Lemans GT or Radius Thunder IV/GT?

[kissmyash933]

Hey all,

I've got the opportunity to purchase a Radius Lemans GT or a Radius Thunder IV/GT (1152)

I really can't find much information on the Lemans other than what I can find here on the MLA.

If I were to purchase the Thunder, it would come with a PhotoEngine card, but not the daughtercard version. The person I would be buying it from says the photoengine card is a separate NuBus Card. I had no Idea that they made those. My question is, if I were able to source the daughtercard version of the PhotoEngine, would it work on the Thunder, thus turning it into a IV GX 1152? Where would I go about sourcing a daughtercard? I'd love to keep a Nubus slot free if I can.

Thoughts or opinions? I have no experience with NuBus Video Cards (yet.)

B.

 

[Unknown_K]

The odds of finding the correct DSP daughter card for a Thunder IV is pretty low these days. I think Radius did make a 4 DSP Nubus card which few apps really use. The major differences in the Thunder IV cards is RAM for resolution and color depth. People pay crazy money for the top end 1600, the lower end 1152 with no DSP card is much cheaper.

 

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

Yep, just checked, PhotoEngine has the same four AT&T DSPs as the 1600's Daughtercard.

Since the DSPs support Photoshop filters running on the CPU over NuBus, there's probably no difference in performance between the two configurations, just the freed up slot as mentioned.

PhotEngine is a NuBus 90 card, BTW.

 

[kissmyash933]

Thanks for the help! Now I know. I would ideally, like to find the 1360 IV GX. that way i could push 1280x1024 @24bit. I feel like $75 might be a bit much for the 1152, I can do 1152 with the 24XK. That and the fact that i'll have to use a second nubus slot in my Q950 for photoshop acceleration makes me think i should look around for a little longer.

B.

 

[Unknown_K]

You can wait around for a better card, but it will take time and they are not getting any cheaper or easier to find.

 

[kissmyash933]

I suppose that is a good point. Since you and Trash80 seem to be the authority on NuBus Video Cards around here, do you think that the IV/GT would be faster than the Lemans or a 24xk?

I suppose that for ProTools experimentation, a bit of AutoCAD and some word processing, running 1280x1024 @ whatever bit depth would be fine. but does the 24xk do 1280x1024 at any bit depth?

 

[Unknown_K]

http://lowendmac.com/video/index.html

The above link should have the information you are looking for. Very few Nubus cards do 1280x1024 or better, most high end ones do 24 bit at 1024x768 and 1152x870. I have a Supermac Thunder II GX 1600 that is supposed to do 1600x1200 @ 24 bit if I can find the correct 13w3 cable to use it (not sure about refresh rates either).

 

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

I don't think you'll be able to tell much difference in "speed" between any of the QuickDraw accelerated cards you've mentioned. Gaming is about the only application I know of offhand where the differences between Built-in Video, NuBus and PDS cards become noticeable IRL, as opposed to the netherworld of benchmarking. At the relatively low resolutions supported by games, MoBo and PDS bandwidth is reputed to be noticeably faster than graphics running across the 10MHz limitation of NuBus. I've not seen any info on how performance of the faster NuBus_90 implementation of cards like the GX series on your Q950 compare, but that's not really the realm of high end VidCard designs, which would be vast arrays of pixels in the deepness of true color.

. . . NuBus 90, increased the clock rate to 20 MHz for better throughput, burst increasing to about 70 MB/s, and average to about 30 MB/s.

In your case, I'd make sure to hold out for a NuBus 90 VidCard that will do the resolution you desire at a refresh rate compatible with your display of choice. (1280x1024@60Hz for native VGA LCD output?) If you desire on board DSP support for Photoshop, the GX 1360 is likely the only game in town, assuming you don't luck into a GX1600 at a reasonable price the way I did.

Take the info on LowemdMac with a grain of salt. Most of it is correct, but I've spotted a few errors when checking Mac specs against info on EveryMac, which seems to be a bit more accurate, but there are errors there as well. When it comes to VidCards, LowendMac is pretty much the only game in town for quick reference. The errors there seem to have been those of omission in terms of resolutions supported and especially specs on refresh rates supported. I've not checked for NuBus_90 info.

The other source of data would be the tables on gamba2, which are a much clearer representation IMHO.

http://home.earthlink.net/~gamba2/vid-mon-matrix.html

 

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

I just checked, the PhotoEngine card is NuBus 90, so that should equal the performance of the GX daughtercard in Photoshop, but having eight of those DSPs working across NuBus_90 in unison would likely be a joy to behold. Dunno about the "SuperMac" Storm Technology DSP card, does anyone know if it's NuBus_90 compliant?

I've gotta load Photoshop and give that config a try in the 81/110! :approve:

 

[Unknown_K]

You would need a Nubus 90 capable card and nubus slot (machine) to get better speeds.

viewtopic.php?f=16&t=19999

 

[kissmyash933]

In your case, I'd make sure to hold out for a NuBus 90 VidCard that will do the resolution you desire at a refresh rate compatible with your display of choice. (1280x1024@60Hz for native VGA LCD output?) If you desire on board DSP support for Photoshop, the GX 1360 is likely the only game in town, assuming you don't luck into a GX1600 at a reasonable price the way I did.

Thanks for all the links and help!

I think that waiting around for a 1360 might be what I do, unless I can find some other card that will give me 1280@24. W/ QuickDraw acceleration. My preferred Display for old macs continues to be a CRT. I don't have any Square LCD Panels any more, and found them to either A: not play well with macs of this vintage and B: Not make System 7 look very flattering. I feel that for the right feel of System 7, a CRT is required. Besides, I don't think old macs look very great with an LCD panel since they were never intended to be used with them.

While PhotoShop acceleration with DSP would be pretty cool, It's not mandatory, especially if I have to use a second slot to do so.

If I can't find a card that will do 1280@24, I'll probably just buy a 24xk.

B.

 

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

Quadra 950 and 81/110/8100 are all NuBus 90 machines, IIRC. That's what LEMspec says about the 950 anyway. :