Best all-round Apple CRT monitor?

[Byrd]

Hi,

I'm doing an overhaul of my 68K Macs at present, and under the house found an AppleVision 1710 monitor - a notorious model famed for high failure rate. This is the one with the pass-through ADB and can be adjusted under MacOS. I thought it was dead and just about to chuck it, but realised it only turns on ("gonk!") when it receives a video signal - and it works fine! There is a slight purple tinge, but I believe this can be fixed with some resoldering.

So it got me thinking if I should just hold onto the 1710 - which may die, or keep a look out for another good all-rounder that isn't too big, but reliable. I've also a nice white 15" LG LCD which is what I generally perch on top of Macs to use.

What would others recommend - what's your idea of Apple's best CRT monitor for use with various Macs

JB

 

[Concorde1993]

Hi Byrd:

I have an Apple Multiple Scan 17 monitor, which I used with my beige G3 before the motherboard died. Currently, my mom is using it on her HP Pavilion computer.

I have never owned an AppleVision monitor, but I don't see what the difference could be in comparison to my Multiple Scan (besides the physical features; I think the AppleVisions had built-in speakers on the sides), since both were manufactured by Sony.

Either than that, I think one of the most durable monitors ever produced was the Commodore 1701 & 1901. I use a 1701 with my video editing suite, and the picture quality is terrific, considering that the monitor is over 25 years old, and I had a 1901 before my first PC 10-III died.

 

[Unknown_K]

Anything with a Sony Trinitron tube will do, or just get a Sony CRT.

 

[Scott Baret]

For sharpness, nothing beats the Trinitrons. Even the older ones (Hi-Res 13", for example) will be clear and sharp.

I like the color of the 12" RGB. I know it's not the most well-loved monitor, but I prefer the way the colors look on this shadow mask display to those of the Hi-Res. The Macintosh Color Display is pretty good too--it's the Trinitron model that replaced the Hi-Res. I believe the same tube, or one very similar, was used in the LC 500s.

A well-tuned 9" CRT from a compact will always look good too. Most of Apple's monochrome monitors were pretty nice.

The worst Apple CRT, by the way, was probably the Performa Plus. It was basically a low-end PC monitor. Apple had a basic color monitor for a while that was also in this category. Both were vastly inferior to the old 12" RGB, which had been the low-end.

Personally, I prefer LCDs to CRTs and find the best vintage Mac experience to come on an active matrix PowerBook.

 

[Dennis Nedry]

APPLE AUDIOVISION 14

Best Display EVER. It's a shame they only made one size and fixed resolution.

• Sony Trinitron
  
• Harman Kardon (as I remember) Speakers w/ bass chamber
  
• high-quality microphone
  
• 640x480 fixed
  
• ADB ports
  
• Mac OS integration with controls on front, also with control panels
  
• mic/headphone ports
  
• connect directly to 61/71/8100 PowerMacs with that weird port, one fat cable
  
• connect to other Macs with breakout adapter

 

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

Apple Portrait Display (OEM'd by Radius) there's NOTHING like it!

 

[Hrududu]

My AppleVision 1710 died on me some years back. The Apple ColorSync 17" I replaced it with "essentially the exact same display" just died on me about 3 weeks ago too. If you're going for a CRT, find a Trinitron just like everyone is suggesting. Best you're going to get.

 

[Osgeld]

dell (ugh) had a series of trinatron tube monitors (I snagged a 19 inch some twit marked as a 15 inch new back in the 90's for 99 bucks WOOT!) for a while sony was hard to beat for quite a while in that market

 

[Scott Baret]

Osgeld--those old Dell monitors were amazing. I had a 17" Trinitron (1998 model) and it was razor-sharp. (No longer have it due to space constraints--sold it to a Linux die-hard a few years back). What vintage is your 19"?

Another worthy VGA display from the 90s was the NEC MultiSync line. These came out in the mid-90s just as multi-sync displays were really gaining in popularity. I don't believe they used a Trinitron tube, but they did offer the same sort of picture in terms of quality (minus the trademark gray lines).

Also, one for the "lousy" category. I'm not sure if any of you have ever heard of a company called Kingdom Computers, which has been gone now for many years, but they used to offer fairly inexpensive equipment. You only got what you paid for--their 55i 15" display was a complete disaster. The phosphor was shot in most of them after 3-4 years. They had a later 55i that wasn't bad, but the ones they sold circa 1998 were awful. Most of their computer components in general were pretty low-grade--repaired a good many of these in the day.

 

[Osgeld]

What vintage is your 19"?

i think it was around 98-99 but its long gone, I sold it as a gaming machine package to one of my friends, as it was big n heavy (though great picture)

and yes my personal preference was the NEC multisync's, they could usually be found cheaper and the picture was top notch, but I dispute your mid 90's, as I have one (i call the heater, with a failing screen) from the mid 80's, if it didnt give everything a green color it actually has a decent picture, and will do upto 800x600 56hz rgb... though it really does not like that, along with TTL, which is the reason I keep it, you can plug ANYTHING into it

 

[Dog Cow]

I can't really say nice things about any of the Apple CRTs that I have. All of them have something wrong:

Macintosh 12" RGB: loose cables in the cord means that screen is green most of the time

AppleColor RGB: some component (capacitor?) has failed so the screen gets brighter and brighter the longer it's on

Apple Multiple Scan 17 (1994): something is loose on the CRT yoke (I think) meaning that the color changes slightly so often

Apple ColorSync 20" CRT: again, some component failure, so it's only usable at certain res/refresh settings, else the video compresses.

 

[Scott Baret]

Wow, NEC was ahead of the game there! I guess I just didn't see any until around 1996 or so.

Osgeld--is your green tint from a bad pin or phosphor? I've seen plenty of Apple 12" RGBs with loose/bad pins that give them "pink-itis". I believe I saw this in a Color Classic once too. That NEC of yours sounds awesome, any chance you've got the model number for it?

 

[Osgeld]

no its had the green tint since I got it (its also a bit dark), in the early 90's (for really cheap, it was my first color monitor for my then EGA machine) no matter what cable I stick on it or signal into it

I dont have the model number on hand, the monitor is at my parents house (found it online JC-1401P3A), but here is a pic from google of what it looks like

, and mine has a date of 1985

on the back there is a series of piano style dip switches so you can set different signal attributes for the expected incoming signal, an Atari style toggle switch to flip from TTL to RGB and a female 9 pin connector

on top there is a little flip up door which is your usual full set of screen adjustments and a couple switches I cant remember what they do

It is the first monitor to carry the Multisync name from NEC, its heavy as hell and runs hot

currently it still works fine but I need to take it apart and blow it out (its been on a workbench in my parents garage for a decade) and do the usual inspection

 

[Unknown_K]

Could the green tint be from Sync on Green issues?

 

[Osgeld]

it had the green tint when I first got it and had it running on a EGA (ttl signal) card combined with the darkness I always assumed someone left the joker on 24/7

I used it daily for years but turned it of whenever not in use, and far as I can tell the picture quality has not gone noticeably more south

also I dont think I have it setup for SOG, as the dip switches allow you to have 2 seperate sync's while on RGB

I will check it out sometime soon, but I am not dragging the beast into my apartment, I sorta like life and my wife

 

[Bunsen]

Apple Portrait Display (OEM'd by Radius) there's NOTHING like it!

Gotta agree - for reading large quantities of text it's pretty hard to beat that greyscale crispness. The portrait orientation might take a bit of getting used to, but after a while it feels sooo right.

I haven't tried the Apple Two Page Display yet (also greyscale) but I hear good things.

I also *loved* my 17" Applevision when I was on OS 9 (and it still worked). The fact that they're stuck on 640x480 on any other OS (or any machine without ADB) blows pretty hard. But for an ADB, OS 9 or earlier Mac, and *if* it still works, they are gorgeous. The ability to tweak and tune it through software is great, but also the reason why it's stuck in Classic land.

dell (ugh) had a series of trinatron tube monitors

Yep - got a couple of those here too @ 21". Also awesome. Heavy as .. a heavy thing, and massive, but wow are they good displays. And they seem able to sync to just about anything.

I can't really say nice things about any of the Apple CRTs that I have. All of them have something wrong:

Stuff breaks; 'tis the law of the universe, Jim. Everything needs maintenance eventually.

on the back there is a series of piano style dip switches so you can set different signal attributes for the expected incoming signal, an Atari style toggle switch to flip from TTL to RGB

Yep, that sounds pretty versatile. Might have to keep an eye out for one of them.

 

[Gorgonops]

It is the first monitor to carry the Multisync name from NEC, its heavy as hell and runs hot

They made a grayscale version (well, three versions: grayscale, green-scale, and amber-scale) of that monitor called the NEC Multisync GS. I picked up a couple of the amber versions at a surplus sale in the early 90's. They were special, and I abused them in all sorts of unholy ways.

(In terms of "specs" they topped out at 640x480@60hz, but you could push them higher. At the sort-of-standard 800x600@56hz of the first "SuperVGA" monitors the flyback transformer would actually make an ominous growling noise and you'd have to spin the vertical size pot down near the minimum to fit the picture on the screen. The *very first night* I ever played with Linux on a creaky 486 hooked to one of these monsters I used xvidtune to make a custom mode line that ran X11 at 800x600@51 Hz, which lowered the dot clock down to about the same ballpark as 640x480@60hz and made the monitor "happy" again.)

I have to admit I sometimes wonder how many equivalents of a chest X-ray I gave myself mucking around with those things. They would indeed work with just about anything.

 

[QuicksilverMac2001]

Yep, I love the Classic Mac OS, never really have fallen for this "X" thing and the AppleVision 1710AV was the ultimate monitor. I remember in 2001 I was on a school field trip to Nashville, TN and I saw a room full of 8500/120's with AppleVision 1710AV displays and that still has me swooning. (The 1710AV might not hold up, but when it works one is in ABSOLUTE VINTAGE MAC MONITOR HEAVEN... IThat's the feeling the 1710AV still gets out of me...)

 

[Byrd]

Hi all,

updating this thread - as expected, my 17" AppleVision 1710 crapped out with funky colours so it made its way to the skip at work. Since it does the same thing as what my spare LCD does (multiple sync at various refresh rates), I could see myself not using it regularly, even if it did work.

Short of (never) finding an Apple Audiovision 14, I keenly sought something smaller and fixed sync to run on Macs like my IIsi etc. So for my current "all round" Mac monitor setup, I've now:

- Apple 13" Trinitron (the old box one, not the one with the stand - although this has one, some sort of universal Apple mount). Looks good alongside a Quadra 700, or on top of a IIsi/IIfx

- A plain, white, solid 15" LCD - small enough to keep indoors and good for using all other times I don't need the Apple 13"

JB