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StuffIt Deluxe 4.01 and System 6.0.8/Mac Plus Compatibility?

Tempest

Well-known member
With the help of a friend I finally have my Mac plus up and running. It has 4MB, a 500MB external HD, an CD Drive (an Apple CD150), and is running System 6.0.8. At first everything seemed to be going fine so I started loading some apps and games on the HD. Now suddenly I'm getting Unimplemented Instruction, Unimplemented Trap, and Address Error errors (and even the occasional No CoProcessor Installed error) when starting and exiting certain games and even when going into the Control Panel. Since I had no idea what caused the problem I took my Mac back to a base level and started over again installing everything one at a time and testing. Through trial and error I think I've determined that StuffIt Deluxe 4.01 is the culprit. It seems that after I install it and reboot things start to go wonky. :scrambled: I think it may have something to do with the extensions it's loading (there are two. One I think is for the MAGIC menu and I'm not sure what the other one does).

Does anyone know if StuffIt Deluxe 4.01 has a history of problems with 6.0.8 or maybe with the Mac Plus in general? I think I have a copy of StuffIt 1.5.3 that I can use instead, but obviously I'd like to use the latest version that works on my machine. I'll try and do more tests tonight and see if I can pin point the problem with certainty.

Tempest

 

phreakout

Well-known member
Tempest,

Bear in mind that version 4.01 was written during System 7's era. It wouldn't surprise me much that you may need to upgrade to 7 to fix the problem. Otherwise, try downgrading to version 3.xx or earlier. The error could also be related to the fact that it needs 32-bit addressing in order to work (someone jump in on this thought)? I know I got a similar error trying to run ShufflePuck on my SE/30 with 32-bit addressing turned on. The game doesn't support 32-bit, period.

73s de Phreakout. :rambo:

 

Tempest

Well-known member
I think you're right. Oddly it did work under System 6, it just caused everything else to have errors. :)

Where can I grab the latest 3.x.x version? I assume that they're freeware at this point?

Tempest

 

JDW

Well-known member
I've been using Stuffit Deluxe 3.0.7 under System 6.0.8 on my SE/30 for ages now, although I must admit I don't use it that much at all. I use Stuffit Expander 5.5 more frequently, when running under System 7 or 8 on my SE/30.

Interestingly, this Macintosh Garden page says that Stuffit Deluxe 4.x should work under System 6, but I myself have not tried it. You therefore may wish to post your experiences in the comments section on that page.

 

Tempest

Well-known member
I may have spoke too soon. Booting from a System Disk I still get errors in games. Shuffle Puck Cafe crashes with an illegal Instruction error after the Broderbund Screen (might be a bad copy), Gunshy crashes with an Illegal Instruction error on startup (this program seems very touchy for some reason). In addition when I boot from the HD (with the CD Drivers) The Fools Errand crashes with an Illegal Instruction error after starting The Wheel of Fortune Puzzle and Dark Castle complains about memory (although that's not really a crash, but I do have 4MB with almost no extensions being loaded).

I suppose I can just boot from a System Disk to avoid most of these issues, but I'm really curious as to why they're happening. With Gunshy I wonder if it's not looking for Icons for the tiles in the system somewhere and being blocked? Very odd.

EDIT: It's not just booting from the HD. Fools Errand crashes on Wheel of Fortune even booting from the System Disk. I think this isn't the one I got from the authors website, but another sit. I'll try downloading it directly and see. It could just be a bad version.

Tempest

 

Tempest

Well-known member
Hmm... Just got an Illegal Instruction error in the control panel again. Could just the presence of a bad program in a folder cause the Mac to go wonky or does it have to be 'installed' into the System folder for that to happen? I wiped my System folder and reinstalled System 6.0.8 but I'm still having problems. All I can come up with at this point is that it might be:

1. Bad ROM or Memory (unlikely as those give different errors and stop the system from booting)

2. SCSI conflict of some sort (also unlikely as the HD and CD seem to work just fine)

3. Bad copy of the System 6.0.8 disk (also unlikely)

4. Program conflict

However if it's a program conflict of some sort, why is it still there when I reinstall System 6? I have some applications like Stuffit 3.x and Disk Copy, but they're sitting in a separate folder and not being run. They're not being loaded or anything when I boot. I suppose I could just have some bad games, but then why would the control panel give me an error? I'm really stumped.

Tempest

 

aftermac

Well-known member
Hmm... Just got an Illegal Instruction error in the control panel again. Could just the presence of a bad program in a folder cause the Mac to go wonky or does it have to be 'installed' into the System folder for that to happen? I wiped my System folder and reinstalled System 6.0.8 but I'm still having problems. All I can come up with at this point is that it might be:
1. Bad ROM or Memory (unlikely as those give different errors and stop the system from booting)

2. SCSI conflict of some sort (also unlikely as the HD and CD seem to work just fine)

3. Bad copy of the System 6.0.8 disk (also unlikely)

4. Program conflict

However if it's a program conflict of some sort, why is it still there when I reinstall System 6? I have some applications like Stuffit 3.x and Disk Copy, but they're sitting in a separate folder and not being run. They're not being loaded or anything when I boot. I suppose I could just have some bad games, but then why would the control panel give me an error? I'm really stumped.

Tempest
A "bad" program on the HD that is just in a random folder shouldn't effect it at all. The only programs that get loaded at startup are the OS files and whatever Extensions and Control Panels that you have added to the System Folder. Uninstalling Extensions and Control Panels is as simple as dragging them from the System Folder and placing them in another folder or the Desktop. This allows you to pick and choose what loads at startup.

I'm getting ready to motivate myself to do some testing in the basement. Probably, go sit down in my museum, watch the Wings game, and set my Plus up. :)

 

Tempest

Well-known member
Ok yet another wrinkle. I had the Mac turned off for an hour or so while I did something else, came back, and now everything works. Shufflepuck, Fools Errand, Gunshy, they all work! Could my problem be heat? I had the Mac on for about 3 hours when I was having problems. I need to check and make sure the vents aren't being blocked I guess.

Tempest

 

aftermac

Well-known member
Ok yet another wrinkle. I had the Mac turned off for an hour or so while I did something else, came back, and now everything works. Shufflepuck, Fools Errand, Gunshy, they all work! Could my problem be heat? I had the Mac on for about 3 hours when I was having problems. I need to check and make sure the vents aren't being blocked I guess.
Tempest
After it crashes and you turn it off and back on, do things start crashing immediately after booting, or does it work for a bit?

At this point I'm thinking that it has to be a heat related issue... maybe a bad wire, loose connection, solder joint, or badly seated chip or RAM.

EDIT: Maybe you could add a fan somehow either internally or externally... one sure way to fix the heat issue is to replace the Plus with an SE. ;)

 

Tempest

Well-known member
The games will immediately crash again if I open them. But like I said it's not all the games, just certain ones. I'll crack 'er open and see if there's something loose inside or not fully seated.

I've got my eyes open for a decently priced SE. :)

Tempest

 

Tempest

Well-known member
Something else just occurred to me on the overheating possibility. Could it be the HD that's overheating and not the system?

Tempest

 

phreakout

Well-known member
The following is taken from MacWorld's Mac Secrets, 5th Edition by David Pogue & Joseph Schorr:

In reality, the Mac’s error codes aren’t nearly that enlightening. For one thing, the error definitions themselves provide little information that you can actually use; knowing that your crash was caused by an “unimplemented core routine” (Error 12 or Error -4) doesn’t shed much light on why a program keeps crashing. When something goes wrong deep inside the Mac, it can only report to you that something is wrong. It has no idea which specific series of keystrokes, mouse clicks, and software interactions actually caused the problem. Error messages are of primary value only to programmers—and not very helpful even to them. Furthermore, Mac error messages are often flat-out wrong. The Mac says you had an “illegal instruction” problem (Error 3) when in reality you simply used up all your RAM.
There are two categories of error messages. Those with positive numbers are the so-called DS errors (which originally stood for, well, deep doo-doo—but which Apple, concerned about its younger audiences, eventually redefined as Dire Straits). These are serious system crashes that require you to restart the machine. Errors with negative numbers aren’t so severe; usually you just have to click OK to proceed.

DS Errors

By far the most common positive-numbered error codes are Type 1, Type 3, and Type 11. You can read about them below; for now, note that the primary steps to solving repeated problems of these types are (a) update or turn off your extensions, ( B) update your hard disk driver, and © do a clean reinstall of your System Folder. Fortunately, Type 1, 3, and 11 errors have become nearly extinct in Mac OS 8 and later.

ID=01: Bus Error (Type 1 error)

The Mac has tried to access memory that doesn’t exist—for example, the program you’re using assumed that the Mac has more RAM available than it actually does. This kind of glitch—probably one of the most common—is called a bus error. You can remedy the problem by allocating more memory to the program that crashed, adding more RAM to your system, or by simply restarting your Mac so that the RAM available isn’t fragmented (but is available on contiguous chunks).

ID=02: Address Error

Mac Plus and SE only: Your processor tried to access an odd-numbered RAM address when it should have accessed an even-numbered one.

ID=03: Illegal Instruction

Your software issued an instruction your Mac’s processor model doesn’t understand. The cause may be an out-of-date system extension or hard disk driver.

ID=04: Zero Divide Error

When programmers test their works in progress, they might deliberately instruct the computer to divide a number by zero, to see how well the program handles errors. They occasionally forget to take this instruction out, as you’ve just discovered.

ID=05: Range Check Error

The software checked to see if a number—part of some internal calculation—is within a certain range. It wasn’t.

ID=06: Overflow Error

A number was too large for the space the software allotted for it.

ID=07: Privilege Violation

This only crops up during the writing of a program. The Mac attempted to process a command in User mode instead of Supervisor mode.

ID=08: Trace Mode Error

When debugging newly written software, programmers sometimes walk through it, line by line, using what’s called Trace mode. This message indicates that your Mac’s processor has accidentally switched into Trace mode.

ID=09 and ID=10: Line 1010 & 1111 Trap

Once again, the software has issued an instruction that the processor doesn’t understand.

ID= 11: Miscellaneous Hardware Exception

A Type 11 message is the Power Mac equivalent of a generic Type 1 error. It simply refers to an error that has occurred in the native Power PC code. Technically, Apple calls it a “hardware exception error.” Realistically, it’s an extension conflict, a corrupted font, or a Power Mac-hostile program. Do a clean reinstall, as described earlier in the chapter. And if you’re getting lots of Type 11 errors, remember that Apple has been methodically eliminating them with each successive release of the system software. Keep your Mac’s System Folder current.

ID=12: Unimplemented Core Routine

As with the ID=04 error, an instruction was left over from the debugging process.

ID=13: Uninstalled Interrupt

An interrupt is a moment during the running of a program when an external device, such as the keyboard or the disk drive, asks for attention. If there are no instructions in RAM that tell the Mac how to talk to that device, you get this error.

ID=15: Segment Loader Error

To conserve RAM, a non-Power Mac program is loaded into RAM insegments as needed. A system-software program called thesegment loader oversees this swapping. If, for some reason, the segment loader can’t do its thing, this error results.

ID=17-24: Package Load Error

We’ll pass this along exactly as we heard it, although we make no pretense to understanding it ourselves: The Macintosh OS contains certain “packages” of routines that perform related operations. There are eight of these packages, 0-7. Errors 17 through 24 indicate failures to load the corresponding package. For example, PACK 4 (which would get an error code of 20) is the Standard File Package (the code that handles the Open File and Save File dialog boxes).

ID=25: Memory Full Error

You’ve probably run out of memory, although this message sometimes appears erroneously.

ID=26: Bad Program Launch

Macintosh applications come in two flavors: 68K code (for pre-Power Macs) and PowerPC code. If either of the “closets” where this code is stored is damaged, you get this error message when you try to run the program. (Time to reinstall.)

ID=27: File System Corrupted

Your Mac keeps an internal map that shows it where everything is on each of your drives. If that map gets hosed, this error pops up. Disk First Aid time!

ID=28: Stack Ran into Heap

Fancy way of saying you ran out of memory.

ID=33: Negative ZbcFree Error

The Macintosh Memory Manager software is so confused, it thinks there’s a negative number of available “zone control blocks” from which to allocate memory.

Negative Error Codes

There are many more negative-numbered error messages than positive. Furthermore, they make even less sense to the nonprogrammer. (Helpful example: “Packet too large or first entry of the write-data structure didn’t contain the full 14-byte header.” Sure.)

The table below provides the general categories for each number range, along with a few that actually make sense to human beings. Note that some of the numbers may overlap, since these error messages vary according to the context (what you’re doing at the time).

The Authoritative List of Negative Error Codes

Error Number & What Causes It

0 through –8 General System errors.

–9 through –21 Color Manager errors.

–17 through –61 System errors involving files and disks (input and output).

–34 Disk is full.

–35 No such disk, or the Mac can’t find the disk it’s looking for.

–37 Illegal filename (for example, the name includes a colon).

–39 A corrupted file is on the disk, or the disk is having problems. Often accompanied by the message “end of file” or “no additional data in the format.” It points in the general direction of a corrupt file. It means that the Mac started to process a file, but couldn’t finish reading it—as if the end of the file had been chopped off. If you encounter this particular message at startup, it could mean your Launcher has become corrupt. Drag the Launcher into the Trash and reinstall it.

–41 File is too big to fit in memory.

–42 Too many files open.

–43 File not found—you’re trying to open a file that’s been moved or deleted.

–44 and –46 Disk is locked.

–45 You’re trying to save or copy something to a locked disk.

–53 through –57 Illegal disk request.

–60 Something’s wrong with the disk directory.

–64 through –66 Font problems, or the required disk (or disk drive) isn’t available.

–64 through –90 Problems reading disks (timing and track troubles).

–91 through –99 AppleTalk errors.

–108 through –117 Various memory-allocation errors.

–120 through –127 HFS errors (disks, folders)

–126 through –128 Menu problems.

–130 through –132 More HFS errors.

–147 through –158 Color management problems.

–185 through –199 Resource Manager errors (problems managing data).

–200 through –232 Problems with sound or sound files.

–250 through –261 Problems with the MIDI Manager.
I hope this helps, Tempest.

73s de Phreakout. :rambo:

 

Tempest

Well-known member
I think I've figured it out, and it has nothing to do with Stuffit after all. The system is simply overheating. I turned it on yesterday evening and everything was working just fine (Shufflepuck, Fools Errand, Gunshy, DotC, etc.). I went downstairs and came back a little under two hours later and all those programs were crashing again with Illegal Instruction errors. The upper left corner of the case was really hot, but the HD case was cool. So just to make sure it wasn't the HD I disconnected everything, booted from a System Disk, tried to run Gunshy and BAM! it crashed. I left the Mac off for a few hours and now everything is working again.

I'm surprised the Mac overheats so fast. True I have the brightness turned up all the way, but still. The room its in is pretty chilly (66 degrees) and it's next to a window where its 18 degrees outside, so it's not like the room is a sauna. Maybe I have a defective part on the board? I cracked open the case to see if everything was seated properly (everything was a tight as it could be), and I noticed the the vertical component board had some heat marks on it like it had gotten too hot at one point.

I guess I need to look for a replacement mac. Maybe a nice SE or SE/30. :) In the meantime I guess I can point a fan at the case, but the HD fan is already way too loud and I really don't want to add another.

Tempest

 

tomlee59

Well-known member
The Plus should handle those ambient conditions ok. Perhaps you have poor connections that are particularly sensitive to changes in temperature. Common culprits would be RAM, as well as other socketed items (ROM, IWM, etc.). It may be worthwhile cleaning those contacts and trying again. For the socketed items, just (gently) remove and reinsert the chips. For the RAM, clean the SIMM contacts with a pencil eraser and reinstall. These simple things might restore stable operation.

 

JDW

Well-known member
Ditto Tom Lee's excellent advice. Moreover, it could be iffy fluid-filled capacitors as well. Heat does influence them.

 

Tempest

Well-known member
I checked the fit of all the socketed items and they're all as tight as they can be. The RAM looks brand new and is also in tightly. I guess it's the capacitors then.

I have an SE/30 now so that solved my problem. :)

Tempest

 
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