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Software for M0110B UK/British Edition Keyboard


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Would any of you folks in the UK know the exact download URL to either the British edition System software or just to the required Control Panel to get the keys to work properly when using a British keyboard M0110B on a Macintosh 128K?

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Hi @Slomacuser,

 

JDW is kindly asking this on behalf of me as I discovered him on YouTube. The latest OS this Mac will run is 4.1, as I understand it, so that solution is too 'new'. Good info though, as I have another system 7 era Mac that this could help.

 

Thanks for your input!

Leigh

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@slomacuser, @Dog Cow, Et Al.

 

INFO-MAC Digest V4 #109 mentions a Localizer 2.0 from 5/9/86.  

Also, there is mention here of a Localizer from May 1985 residing on "MacStuff Disks."

(Keyword search both above for "localizer" to jump to the right point and see what I mean.)

 

Therefore, the software version appropriate to the needs of @smileymacface did exist in the past and surely exist on somebody's old 3.5" floppy disk collection now.  Sadly, no one has yet posted that software to Macintosh Garden.  Would either of you gentlemen happen to have such old versions of Localizer in your software collections that you could kindly upload?  Alternatively, would either of you have an old software version (capable of working on a Mac 128K) that has the British keyboard resources already installed?

 

Thank you!

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19 hours ago, slomacuser said:

 

Wonderful!  Thank you very much for the IMG!  I see it has Finder 1.1g & System 1.1.  

 

I should also mention that it's hard to know the System version on these old versions of the System software, so to verify, I highly recommend the SysVersion app which is found on both of these System Disks.

 

@smileymacface Please let us know if this fixes your British keyboard issues!

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Thank you @JDW, @slomacuser !

 

This sounds perfect. I will definitely report back here once I have tried it. It may be a few weeks though as I am busy on another project which is taking up all my time. Hope to be back playing with this after Easter sometime.

 

However, the time consuming part is that I am falling at the first hurdle with this 'puddle jumping'. All these downloads are on a Mojave iMac right now and simply moving/copying the 'untouched' .imgs to an older Mac is proving harder than I thought. I'm following this really useful instruction https://siber-sonic.com/mac/newmillfloppy.html

 

I have these old Macs working: Classic (floppy, ext zip! running 6.0.3), Performa 6400 (floppy, zip, CD running 8.1) and a Beige G3 tower (CD, floppy, zip, jaz drive running 9.1). I don't have a copy of Cheetah 10.0 to install as a second partition on it either (the newest it will supposedly run) though I annoyingly have kept a lot of 'other' original OSX disks. It doesn't have a USB port in this (yet) either so am wondering if a CD ROM or something would be easier (I still have an old SCSI Lacie CD writer). I really cannot get my head around the networking from new to old tech either so am not going there again.

 

I have tried using my old Zip drives (as I have both USB and SCSI externals) they read OK but cannot write to the HFS disks on the new Mac, the gap is too big. I do have an older iMac from about 2013 that I haven't tried yet, so will use that as a first step I think to get the files onto it and go backwards from there. It's the getting back to HFS(+) step, after that I think I'll be fine making these disks on the Classic (I have a small stock of DD floppies so OK there). I know JDW mentioned the Emu devices on another thread but I wanted to see if could make the 'real thing' from what I do have first (will not be beaten!). Appreciate the info though, when I have some cash I'll see if I can buy one as they look like a great gadget.

 

Thanks again both of you for taking the trouble and time to help with this. I really appreciate it. I'll get it going soon and report back with a picture or two. [:)]

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19 hours ago, smileymacface said:

I know JDW mentioned the Emu devices on another thread but I wanted to see if could make the 'real thing' from what I do have first (will not be beaten!).

 

The FloppyEMU is not only the single best purchase you can ever make for your vintage Macs, it's also the easiest means of making "the real thing" in terms of writing the contents of a disk image to a real floppy disk.  You just drag-and-drop the image file onto the SD card of the FloppyEMU simply by inserting that SD card into any modern Mac, the put the SD back into the FloppyEMU, connect the FloppyEMU to the floppy port of your vintage Mac, power-on and boot that Mac, then you can mount the image you copied to the FloppyEMU, and finally, you can copy its contents to a real floppy.  I need to make a video on that at some point, but hopefully this text explanation will serve to get you going.

 

Since you don't have time to work on this for a few weeks, I recommend ordering a FloppyEMU now, so that when it finally arrives in your hands, you'll have time to play with it.  It won't be a one-off thing either since you will then be able to move software freely from your modern Mac to your old Mac.

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Ordered one. Says it'll take a couple of weeks to get here. It does sound a LOT easier! Just had a read through, shame the little frosted cases are out of stock as they're quite cool.

Yes, your videos are becoming 'legendary' and this one would be great addition! ;)

Edited by smileymacface
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I have one of the frosted cases, and it really, really is unfortunate they let that run out of stock.  No telling when it will be back in stock either.  Just don't set the circuit board on metal or otherwise let it short on something and you should be fine.

 

I have a video I am working on now at the moment, but perhaps after that is done I can consider showing the method of transferring files via FloppyEMU.

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That's great, I'll be watching that for sure.

 

I had another play with the old G3 last night and managed to get it running again and reformat a Zip disk. I can now get @slomacuser 's files off this iMac, via the G3, then over to the Classic for making a floppy for the 128k. Crazy to think that those old Zip drives have been of use again, I'd buried them in the loft. I'll see if I have time to have another go tonight (the long way round) and I'll keep you posted if I have any success with the KB.

 

I'm determined to solve it soon as it's the final puzzle and what with all these old beige boxes and wires everywhere, my wife is starting to lose patience!

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OK, I have moved the system.sit files from my Mojave iMac via a HFS+ Zip disk, then copied to G3 OS 9.2, copied across to a HFS formatted Zip disk, then copied over to the system 6 Classic HD. All the files are visible in the Finder and appear to be intact/unaltered.

 

I tried to mount the .img file using disk copy 4.2 but all the folders with various .img files in are 'empty'? Not sure what is going wrong but I'll sleep on it and have another go tomorrow evening. I'm wondering at what stage I need to be unstuffing the .sit files (currently doing that on the OS 9 Mac as that's the only one that currently recognises them).

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Hi again,

 

Thanks for the tip @slomacuser. I now understand what I was doing wrong. I've also managed to make a US version system disk 1.1 myself but when I tried to create your alternative one on system 6 this happened (see picture). I've tried opening it on system 9 as well and it's not recognised. I'll have another go at re-downloading the file you sent in case it was damaged via my transfer and maybe finding the original localiser file and to if I can 'implant' it myself. If I do, where would this file need to be placed on the directory/floppy so it works? Or, is it simply something that's run after start up?

 

Also, I am collecting a Mac Plus this weekend that comes with original (British) software disks, so this may prove useful...:beige:

 

As an aside, I also found this tip elsewhere online and it fixed another 'sticky' .img file by using it. Maybe useful for others finding this thread who are downloading old 128k system software image files.

 

"If Disk Copy can’t “see” the image files, it is because the “Type” and “Creator” fields of the image files are blank instead of filled with “dImg” and “dCpy,” respectively. This can be fixed by using a utility such as Finder Info and FileType."

https://www.gryphel.com/c/sw/sysutils/fndrinfo/index.html

https://www.frederikseiffert.de/filetype/

 

@JDW I have received the EMU unit too (that was quick!) So I'll have a go with this too at some point, when I can get some time.

 

Thanks again guys!

 

IMG_5141.thumb.JPG.85c9c25f0a5992e3aa0b875c90a5e478.JPG

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On 4/6/2021 at 12:41 AM, smileymacface said:

 I have received the EMU unit too (that was quick!) So I'll have a go with this too at some point, when I can get some time.

 

The FloppyEMU is the fastest way to success, so I suggest you try that first.  Take out the MicroSD, put it inside a full sized SD adapter, put that in your modern Mac, then copy the disk img to that SD, put the microSD back in FloppyEMU, connect FloppyEMU to your Mac while powered off, then use the buttons and LCD to select the image you saved on SD.

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You can't open System files before System 7. System 7 introduced system suitcase, before that you had to use Font/DA mover and Localizator to change system files. Just boot with the image as JDW wrote above.

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Hi again @slomacuser,

 

Thanks for those tips.

 

I have followed the EMU instructions and @JDW 's method as instructed. The British.img file you kindly made/supplied just will not load/boot, as I said before. I have re-downloaded your file again from here too. Here are the steps I am going through...

 

1. I uncompress your .sit file using Mojave iMac

2. Copy the .img to the micro SD

3. Run EMU direct on the 128k Mac

4. No joy :sad:

 

Am I doing anything wrong here?

Could your .sit file have been damaged in transit?

 

BTW. This old Mac is one with the 512k upgraded board if that has any bearing.

 

One other thing, I can open the Localizer.img on the EMU and use the app direct from there (as it has system 6 on it) but then it says I cannot install the local file on my other system 1 floppy as it's 'damaged' (even though it's not, it is working fine as a start up disk). I'm so close but still unable to solve it and it's starting to do my head in! I have tried both on the 128k and the Classic Macs. Both throwing up the same 'damaged disk' issue.

 

I might wait now until I've got that Mac Plus at the weekend and see if its Brit system disk will work.

Plus now the Mac's screen is intermittently going off, so I have another hardware issue to sort out. Grrr.

 

Thought I should keep you posted, any other ideas would much appreciated.

Thanks again

 

 

IMG_5162.jpg.a1f5ac102c4f9f6513198316b89f38b8.jpgIMG_5161.jpg.f7d1e67bd2ebe5c86832746f823c6236.jpg

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@slomacuser

I just tested that BMOW converter app on the "Mac System British.img" you kindly posted earlier in this thread.  It doesn't work.  It produces an error dialog saying:

 

Mac System British.img is not a DiskCopy 4.2 image file

 

As such, that converter isn't very useful at all.  A lot of disk images I've found are in fact Disk Copy 6.3, which that converter does not support.  Moreover, I've also come across disk images on Macintosh Garden (e.g., HyperCard 2.4.1) much larger than 1.44MB, which won't work with a FloppyEMU even though they work fine in Mini vMac.

 

@smileymacface

The solution I have found is to boot Mini vMac and mount the offending image, then download the Mini vMac BLANKS set. Then pick the right size of BLANK needed and mount that in Mini vMac.  Then manually do a drag-and-drop copy of all the files inside the offending image to the BLANK DSK.  I then put that DSK on the FloppyEMU and it normally works (but see "NOTE!" below).

 

Here's the DSK I made/converted just now for you:

Mac System British JDW.dsk.zip

 

NOTE!  I've often seen an ID=02 System Bomb when I the DSK images I make in Mini vMac are later put on a FloppyEMU and used on a very early Mac like a Mac512.  The bomb always happens when arriving at the Desktop.  If you have that ID=02 bomb, the solution is to reboot while pressing and holding down the Command & Option keys to rebuild the Desktop.  After that, there will be no more bombs on that DSK, but sadly, that often destroys all Folders on the disk, so you have to remember what their names are and rename them.  Other than that, the rebuild solves the ID=2 bomb problem.

 

I don't have time to test the above DSK image on my Mac512 using a FloppyEMU.  It should work on a FloppyEMU for reasons I've just said.  Try it and let me know if it boots your early Mac (Mac 128K thru Plus).

 

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Thanks @JDW 

I have just seen your note, thank you...

 

On 4/8/2021 at 6:18 AM, JDW said:

The solution I have found is to boot Mini vMac and mount the offending image, then download the Mini vMac BLANKS set. Then pick the right size of BLANK needed and mount that in Mini vMac.  Then manually do a drag-and-drop copy of all the files inside the offending image to the BLANK DSK.  I then put that DSK on the FloppyEMU and it normally works (but see "NOTE!" below).

 

Here's the DSK I made/converted just now for you:

Mac System British JDW.dsk.zip 177.59 kB · 0 downloads

 

I will give your DSK a try later tonight and let you know. Maybe @mactjaap could try this too and let you know?

 

Update:

 

I also picked up a pretty good (some still in the plastic wrapping!) collection of Mac Plus (circa 1986) stuff at the weekend including an 800k floppy drive, MacDraw, Write and Project disk sets. Sadly the only original system disk with it was stuck in the drive and when I got it out it was unreadable and disk first aid didn't help it either (maybe one of you knows a trick or two here?).

 

However, the Macwrite disk worked in the 128k and the keyboard responds as it should:beige:. I see a "wastebasket" and all the lower tier keys now type what's printed on them! Only I now seem to have a return key and "/" key not working. Weird, as I am sure they were fine last week. They also don't work with the US system disk but they did a week or so ago so, I'm back to thinking that's just a component issue.

 

I could try to make back ups of these old floppy disks once I get some time, also share images of them if they are of use?

 

Here are some pics showing versions etc.

 

Thanks again.

 

IMG_5169.JPG

IMG_5166.JPG

IMG_5165.JPG

IMG_5170.JPG

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