rplacd Posted October 18 Report Share Posted October 18 (edited) This isn't a recap troubleshooting thread, I know, so I'll make it worth your time. Would someone have the capacity to run Doom on SoftPC on an (extremely tricked out) SE/30? I don't have enough RAM to do so myself, but I do have this morbid curiosity to see how well it would run. I wonder how well it would run with a machine with an '040 accelerator and a Micron Xceed grayscale adapter... Edited October 18 by rplacd Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Byrd Posted October 18 Report Share Posted October 18 Hi, Short of basic DOS applications, anything graphical x86 (be it a VGA game or Windows 3.x) is glacially slow when emulated on an 030 or 040. I recently got quite excited running the 68K version of SoftPC (Windows 3.1 and DOS 6.2 installed) on my Quadra 840AV and it was pretty much unusable. As proof of concept it'll probably run and I'd love to see it displayed but it will be unplayable; I think the 68K version of Doom is also pretty unimpressive. JB Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ymk Posted October 18 Report Share Posted October 18 Why not run native 68K Doom? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Daniël Oosterhuis Posted October 18 Report Share Posted October 18 19 hours ago, ymk said: Why not run native 68K Doom? It's a fairly unoptimized port in my experience. Both Wolf3D and Doom seem to need far more powerful hardware on the Mac, than compared to PC. Doom even edges towards needing a PPC for good performance, and Wolf3D at least a fast '030, though I find it still struggles a bit on an '040. That said, emulating the PC port won't help much, I'm afraid. The only real solution would simply be a new, more optimized port, and the 68k Mac platform is probably too niche to receive such attention from Wolf3D/Doom community port programmers. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
LaPorta Posted October 18 Report Share Posted October 18 Wolf 3D on an 040 is awful. I remember hating to play it on my dad's Quadra 660 back when. No good until it was on a Power Mac. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Daniël Oosterhuis Posted October 18 Report Share Posted October 18 (edited) 16 hours ago, LaPorta said: Wolf 3D on an 040 is awful. I remember hating to play it on my dad's Quadra 660 back when. No good until it was on a Power Mac. Yeah, the box does mention it's optimized for PowerPC hardware, and it sure feels that way. But it shows how badly optimized the port is for the 68k platform, given on the PC side, Wolf3D ran fine on 386 class machines. I know comparing 68k and x86 CPUs is not an apples to apples comparison (pun not intended), but you'd figure an optimized port would run better on 040s, if not fast 030s. Edited October 18 by Daniël Oosterhuis Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bolle Posted October 18 Report Share Posted October 18 (edited) 22 hours ago, rplacd said: I wonder how well it would run with a machine with an '040 accelerator and a Micron Xceed grayscale adapter Yeah, well, no... https://imgur.com/a/3vjBnxY That's a 40MHz 040 and a Micron card. Edited October 18 by Bolle Quote Link to post Share on other sites
LaPorta Posted October 18 Report Share Posted October 18 I’m amazed it actually runs. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bolle Posted October 18 Report Share Posted October 18 Should have said that in the first place, this is the native 68k Mac version. I don't see the DOS version running at all in SoftPC. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rplacd Posted October 19 Author Report Share Posted October 19 (edited) On 10/18/2020 at 1:38 PM, LaPorta said: I’m amazed it actually runs. Not only that, I'm amazed that it can even keep up a smooth audio experience while struggling to render more than 1 FPS... (I stole a little screenshot from that for my avatar, if that's alright @Bolle?) Edited October 19 by rplacd Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bolle Posted October 19 Report Share Posted October 19 (edited) 16 hours ago, rplacd said: (I stole a little screenshot from that for my avatar, if that's alright @Bolle?) I can get you a nicer one as well if you want Doom title screen in grayscale on the SE/30? Just let me know what you're looking for. Edited October 19 by Bolle Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rplacd Posted October 20 Author Report Share Posted October 20 On 10/19/2020 at 6:57 AM, Bolle said: I can get you a nicer one as well if you want Doom title screen in grayscale on the SE/30? Just let me know what you're looking for. Haha, yes to the Doom title screen! I'm sure many other people would enjoy it as well. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Chopsticks Posted October 21 Report Share Posted October 21 Doom was actually coded on C on a 68k NeXT station computer, why it runs so poorly on the Mac 68k machines has always been something I've wondered about, like was it just a bad port or was there a technical reason as to why the Mac port is so terrible? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ymk Posted October 21 Report Share Posted October 21 It's not exactly a fair comparison. Macs couldn't paint the entire screen with 320x200 like PCs could. Slow Macs had to either play in a tiny 320x240 window or use pixel doubling, which still had a cost. Unlike pixel doubling, the every-other-row rendering in Duke Nukem 3D actually reduced video bandwidth, speeding up the game significantly. On the other hand, 640x480 meant when Macs got Command & Conquer, four times the battlefield area was visible, making it a far better experience. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
johnklos Posted October 22 Report Share Posted October 22 SoftPC / SoftWindows for m68k only emulates an 80286 and 80287. Doom requires an 80386. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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