Jump to content
PotatoFi

Awful Macintosh SE FDHD Revival

Recommended Posts

Quote

Do you mean you just mix hot water and Vanish and nothing else? I have a tub of Vanish but found it hard to get peroxide cheap enough.

Yes, nothing else.

 

Vanish has already peroxide in the formula, is easy to get, cheaper and probably less dangerous.

 

The only problem, the magic is only activated in hot water, so mixing it with boiling water will kick the process in action.

 

Sun exposure will keep it going, moreover you can see the reaction when the bubbling takes place.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Not much, a couple of spoonfuls..., it's a bit of trial and error game.

 

But you can have a try with a test item, i did it recently in very yellowed mouse, and it came pretty white in the end.

 

in my opinion, Vanish is also less harmful than pure peroxide, i had troubles with peroxide in my first tests, with some marbling effects.

 

The only advise is to have the item fully submerged to avoid any unexposed area.

 

 

Edited by bibilit

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

Do you include the keys, too, or might that do damage to the letters?

 

You are probably talking about the keyboard ?

 

never had any issue with keys, only the front Apple Logo should be removed, as this is affected by the peroxide.

 

But as i am only using the vanish powder and not any strong peroxide, don't think it will be any problem in the end.

 

stickers and silkscreen letters are not affected in the process.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Completely enjoying this journey and the creative solutions...particularly liked the Hot Sauce approach. ;-). Thank you for sharing.

 

@bibilit thank you for the Vanish recommendation. I believe (but could be mistaken) that in the USA/Canada that powder is called Resolve Oxi Action (in-Wash Powder Stain Remover). I am curious what are the main ingredients in your Vanish powder? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes, probably sold with different names around the world, but in my opinion  the same product. 

 

Resolve name seems to be used in US/Canada while Vanish is used in UK and other parts of the globe... marketing trick probably. 

 

Here some Information found on the site, not much anyway. 

 

http://www.rbeuroinfo.com/index.php?SKU=23018&action=product_details.php&COUNTRY=FR&LANGUAGE=FR

Edited by bibilit

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sorry bibilit, yes I meant the keyboard. I did a test last night with an old "Apple Design Keyboard", Vanish and boiling water. Let all plastic parts of the keyboard in it for three hours after the toothbrush treatment (another 2 hours, gosh, that's really work) and I know, had no sunlight. It all came out very clean and not eroded with the top of the keyboard remaining still a tat yellowish. I am completely satisfied, though, because I think it is not bad, if one can see a little bit of the 30 years, that have passed.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Back with another update! It's a pretty exciting one that even includes some magic smoke! Curious? Read on...

 

Before soldering the shield back onto the logic board, I decided to clean up the I/O ports a little bit. Here's what they looked like before:

 

IMG_0580.thumb.jpg.dce880290f4ae18a0ed67592257b1a9a.jpg

 

And here's after working on them with some 1000-grit sandpaper. Much better!

 

IMG_0581.thumb.jpg.b31679d71370a1a53a8f1e3641d3fac1.jpg

 

Extreme closeup! Whooooaaaahhh!

 

IMG_0582.thumb.jpg.ee513a595478e7a0fd3080e1d752256b.jpg

 

After slotting in the RF shield, I bent the tabs like they were before. It was pretty easy to solder the shield in since it was held in place.

 

IMG_0583.thumb.jpg.c31ff3d3e8801f4c08c89f468dce5d9c.jpg

 

Shield installed!

 

IMG_0584.thumb.jpg.ae473671c2b0f455d841dd7b9f2d1632.jpg

 

Next, it was time to recap the analog board. Normally, I post a link to my DigiKey cart with all of the caps, but unfortunately a couple of the caps are out of stuck, presumably due to supply chain issues. I'll post a link to the shopping cart here when the other parts are available.

 

IMG_0585.thumb.jpg.4ed0b80ee973dcbdf6dc1b11585def76.jpg

 

First, I marked the old caps with a green Sharpie to keep track of what I'd replaced.

 

IMG_0586.thumb.jpg.7378ff4b3bb43e693703bdbfde930225.jpg

 

Then, one at a time, I desoldered caps. Sometimes I heat one leg and rock the cap, sometimes I used the soldering sucker, and sometimes desoldering braid.

 

IMG_0587.thumb.jpg.7b779b5c7efabfd496bbc0cc28000069.jpg

 

New cap installed here! I always solder one leg, and apply gentle pressure from the back while reheating that leg, which seats the cap firmly against the board.

 

IMG_0588.thumb.jpg.5fdcbc19a7f1c9039e3a1ec4fa74e823.jpg

 

Here's a new cap, and an old cap that I couldn't get a replacement part for. I try to find the same diameter and leg spacing, but I don't worry about height. I also try to use Nichicon or Panasonic for electrolytic caps.

 

IMG_0589.thumb.jpg.ad27bcbb32f1d8547e577029c5316324.jpg

 

Analog board done!

 

IMG_0590.thumb.jpg.de1c48368d1b406b200bfa1c0b5274bc.jpg

 

At last, time to reassemble! Good thing too... my office has two torn-apart SE's, a torn-apart SE/30, and torn-apart external floppy drive! First, I hot glued the speaker back in.

 

IMG_0591.thumb.jpg.6698affa399385aad88c2a07294b915e.jpg

 

Next, I reinstalled the chassis. Yikes, it is blue! But I decided that there was no need to spend money on grey or silver paint. I just wanted to stop the rust. I have plenty of Macs that I make "perfect". Most people would have just thrown this one out anyway, I've already put too much effort into it.

 

IMG_0592.thumb.jpg.7b06a9c682ad6818aed37a7b2e85d764.jpg

 

Jumping ahead a bit, I installed the analog board and logic board, but left the floppy drive and hard drive out to do a quick power-on test.

 

IMG_0593.thumb.jpg.d5d9442cd29df1a13a541bf2d1f0b9fd.jpg

 

The ground lug on the CRT was a bit rusty, so I cleaned it up with some sandpaper to ensure a good connection here.

 

IMG_0594.thumb.jpg.573e12b58d9071d2cd157079309df2e2.jpg

 

Time for the power-on test!

 

IMG_0596.thumb.jpg.4c4a791f6ff192ac4fbe6e1aa9e839c8.jpg

 

ERMAGERSH THER MERCERTERSH WERKS! One thing I hadn't tested before now was sound. No problem, it chimed as usual. The CRT is pretty far out of adjustment. I'll need to adjust rotation, width, height, and centering. Basically everything. I don't know if there's a good guide out there on exact picture size, or if there's a program I can run to help calibrate it. If someone has info on that, please let me know.

 

IMG_0595.thumb.jpg.4b8bdbf9c53f45cb6294f91e5850d153.jpg

 

Next up, the floppy drive!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ugh, the floppy drive. I've done a lot of these lately, and I'm not gunna lie: it's become a bit of a chore. I'm just over it. But, it has to be done.

 

Yikes, pretty rusty, but it looks okay. Let's see how the bottom looks.

 

IMG_0597.thumb.jpg.9de9c74131ee2af3ef8ba53c9f353795.jpg

 

Hrm, not great, but the drive motor spins freely, which makes me think that this will be salvageable with a bit of cleaning.

 

IMG_0606-1.thumb.jpg.8d602780d188b57ab2f8dc4b044374c4.jpg

 

My other restoration threads have tons of instructions on how to take these apart, so check those out if you're looking for more details. Here's the top carriage popped off.

 

IMG_0599.thumb.jpg.2fc88c65af0c51045ca016884356c105.jpg

 

Good news, the eject motor gears look okay! I cleaned these out with alcohol and lubricated them with DuPont Teflon Silicone lubricant, which is designed for lubricating plastics.

 

IMG_0604.thumb.jpg.8d3d8f17f8ff11adb4152a9daf461a7c.jpg

 

When that was done, I returned the final gear to this specific position, which as far as I know is supposed to be the "default" position.

 

IMG_0607.thumb.jpg.c804726fbe70cb5e21c7a679df726d5b.jpg

 

The upper and lower carriages got a scrub in the sink, a soak in vinegar, a scrub in vinegar, and a final wash under tap water before getting his with compressed air. No pictures of the vinegar soak, so just imagine these parts soaking in vinegar.

 

IMG_0603.thumb.jpg.e6161f7e77e6d7ec0b4e104406d8ea31.jpg

 

After lubricating everything, reassembling, and inserting/ejecting a floppy disk a few dozen times to make sure everything was working smoothly, I started to assemble the hard drive and floppy drive assembly.

 

IMG_0608.thumb.jpg.6d27e386f14f515e151e3d30ae4dd55b.jpg

 

Hard drive and floppy drive bracket installed.

 

IMG_0609.thumb.jpg.1d4f929f8666e28b5f6a75e28bf30617.jpg

 

At this point, both the hard drive and floppy drive were completely untested. It was finally time for the big moment where I would see if the floppy drive worked, and if the hard drive worked, and if there was anything interesting on it!

 

I flipped on the power, and immediately, very bad things started happening. The machine rapidly went "FLUP FLUP FLUP FLUP FLUP", and by the time I got my hand back around to the power switch, there was a big puff of magic smoke coming from the hard drive and floppy drive area! Oh no!

 

With the power back off, I waved all of the smoke away and took things back apart to find out what burned up. And burn up, something did! My office smelled horrible! I was really hoping that whatever had failed was the hard drive, and not the floppy drive or logic board. The logic board checked out okay, but I quickly discovered this on the hard drive:

 

IMG_0611.thumb.jpg.723d777fd2b3de53a4bdd58d0010e9c8.jpg

 

Looks like a tantalum capacitor gave up! This is one of those old Miniscribe drives. Is this a common failure? Maybe the heads are stuck to the platter, and the motor couldn't spin up which overwhelmed the circuitry? Would love to get some insight on this. 

 

Oh well, I need a hard drive bracket for my SE/30. I guess this is where I'm getting it. Bye-bye hard drive!

 

But after all of that stress put on the machine, would it chime? My daughter and I flipped the switch again to see what would happen...

 

IMG_0613.thumb.jpg.ace68e7540e5ff6ef5163b0632464d85.jpg

 

Yep, all good. Whatever caused the failure must have been in the hard drive itself.

 

IMG_0616.thumb.jpg.7ca84f5beba77849a43cb06238ecb247.jpg

 

But we're not out of the woods yet... what about the floppy drive?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I decided to test the floppy drive outside of the machine. Unfortunately, despite a thorough cleaning and lubrication, there are a couple of problems.

 

IMG_0620.thumb.jpg.a7ed4c75565fa0db7422273006080b64.jpg

 

First off, the eject motor doesn't quite get the job done. It really labors, despite my careful cleaning and lubrication. By hand, disks eject very smoothy. The eject motor on the other hand sounds very labored, and it doesn't complete a 360° trip like I think it should.

 

The second problem is more serious. I noticed that the R/W heads do not actuate. I removed the two socket cap screws that hold the motor in, and discovered some rust.

 

IMG_0617.thumb.jpg.2416091f551783dcab1c755ccb1bff70.jpg

 

After pulling the drive out entirely, I found that the drive was stuck. It popped loose pretty easily, but it feels a bit rough... not good.

 

IMG_0618.thumb.jpg.bae466cd554421f51f465038e7353f7e.jpg

 

Unfortunately, now the motor just buzzes whenever the computer is on. Here's a quick video of what is happening. It's a sealed unit so there's no way to get further into it.

 

So, the sad state of this machine is that it doesn't have a working floppy drive or hard drive. At this point, I think I'll need to find a donor drive that I can pull both an ejection motor and seek motor from to get it working again.

Edited by PotatoFi

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Have you opened and cleaned/lubed the eject motor itself? Meaning all the gears inside?

 

As for the stepper motor, unfortunately that means that, once pulled, you may have to re-align the entire assembly to get it to read disks properly. Unless you have one, I have one or two spare parts drives. I could part the motor out to you if you needed.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yea, time for another floppy drive. Luckily they pop up on ebay from time to time. 

 

About the tantalum cap. Old tantalum caps become unstable and they are known to short like this. It is a known thing, and when they short, they go boom. The drive is probably fine and changing the cap would get it going again. It usually does no harm outside of the cap itself. 

 

But you will need to lubricate the head stepper most likely. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 hours ago, LaPorta said:

Have you opened and cleaned/lubed the eject motor itself? Meaning all the gears inside?

 

As for the stepper motor, unfortunately that means that, once pulled, you may have to re-align the entire assembly to get it to read disks properly. Unless you have one, I have one or two spare parts drives. I could part the motor out to you if you needed.

I popped the plate off, removed the one central gear, swabbed everything out, put a couple drops of teflon lubricant in, and snapped it back together. So I was only in the gearbox, definitely not into the motor itself. If you think I need to tear it further apart, let me know.

 

As for alignment of the drive, can you elaborate? I only removed the motor and leadscrew. The heads are still on their rail that they slide forward and backward on. I've manually turned the leadscrew on other drives for cleaning and haven't had any problems.

9 hours ago, techknight said:

Yea, time for another floppy drive. Luckily they pop up on ebay from time to time. 

 

About the tantalum cap. Old tantalum caps become unstable and they are known to short like this. It is a known thing, and when they short, they go boom. The drive is probably fine and changing the cap would get it going again. It usually does no harm outside of the cap itself. 

 

But you will need to lubricate the head stepper most likely. 

Good to know about the capacitor! I didn't know that tantalum caps would age and go like this. It did seem like something in the machine was shorted out, as the machine powered off-on-off-on-off-on-off-on rapidly until I hit the power switch. 

 

As for the drive... I am not sure I will attempt to repair it right now.

 

If anyone would like to either contribute or sell floppy drive parts to the project, please send me a DM!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Nice work! I'm in the same boat as you, floppy drive wise, on my PowerMac 6100. At some point, that 6100 got fed either pancake syrup or soy sauce, specifically in the floppy drive opening. It had a good few rust spots, that I too tried getting off with vinegar, then I noticed the top head had been slightly knocked out of place, definitely not by me. There were toothpicks in it too, so I'm guessing someone tried shoving a floppy into it when the syrup mixed with the lubricant and it no longer moved freely, which probably caused that damage. So now that drive too is total loss, other than for parts.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Check out my video on cleaning and lubricating the drives. The part relating to the eject motor is near the end to see a more complete breakdown and possibly seeing where you may be having issues. Otherwise, it's totally possible that something otherwise is shot. As for the motor, I had never tried adjusting because there was a warning in Pina to not do so unless you wanted to recalibrate things...or something to that effect. Perhaps I had it wrong.

 

 

Edited by LaPorta

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×