My question is. . .what is the preffered way to do massive server backups? Is there some perl I could write to automate all of these backups? Is tape backup the way to go? I am asking to see what others out there too. Not too concerned with workstation backup, just server stuff (about 200GB to back up on each file server every week).

Any opinions on backups are welcome. . .and yes, I know microsoft will discontinue support for NT Jan 2004. The plan is to upgrade these servers to 2003 server by January and add 4 more hard drives to each (they are Dell PowerEdge 4400 servers). And yes, I know in a perfect world, these servers would NOT be windows server. I inherited a bad situation, and now I am trying to better it. Thanks!

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I have a problem with vintage electronics. . .I am working on it.

I'm not sure what yours are, but the last several ones that i saw basically maxed out at 4 Pentium Pro 200MHz processors (which will be slow, but not so entirely slow that it'll be unuseable, seeing as how I've run 2k3 enterprise server on a P200 (non pro)

umm, as far as backing up goes, is there already a "sytem" in place as far as what happens and when?

If I were just now inheriting the job of adminning a snotload of servers, I might leave them the way they are (if you know what that is, mind ye) until (next january?)

The only real advice I can offer on the topic of backups is that there probably is some perl or CGI or whatever you can write to do most of it for you, and that there should be an accessory called "backup" or something...

Logan

Quadra 950, Workgroup Server 9150, Performa 6400, Powerbook 2300c, 4x Quadra 700's, iBook

I am no expert but generally you do a full backup every month and those get dated and saved forever. Then every week you backup the files that changed (3 backup sets 1 used every week and recycled over again). This way if all hell broke loose you just restore the monthly full backup and then the partials to date. you need to have a full backup somewhere in case some idiot deletes a file he shouldnt have and needs to be restored at a later date. Incremental backups wont help you in that case.

It all depends on what the data is your backing up and how fast you need to restore it. If your running an online store then you basically have 2 complete systems mirroed in different locations so one dies other comes online asap while the old one gets fixed and restored.

If it just production diagrams that dont get used often a standard backup works nicely. The tapes should be stored offsite.

What kind of drives do you have now? And how often is data updated on the server? If you have finacial files there you need to talk to the cfo as to how that needs to be kept because there are laws specifically for that that have to be followed.

A daily complete dump to a external 200+gb hd drive after hours would probably be a good idea also.

So your the new server guy and dont have training on how to manage a server? Nice company.

Of course there will be varying opinions on DVD-RAM but the speed of recovery/backup could be quite fast compared to some tape backups and indeed fully bootable.

Even though many companies do a good job on technology in tapes it's still a format that is subject to enviromental factors which I don't like. I like the extra confidence that if say a flood happened my DV-RAM discs just need to dry off at room tempature for a day or so and they are good to go...whereas a tape mechanism would most likely be ruined. Mold and other factors like heat, magnetism also affect tapes whreas CD's are a different matter. (DVD-RAM discs come in a caddy based tray, so you can leave them in, no taking them out, less chance of damage.)

If you can swing the extra hard disks and make a small RAID, then this might alleviate the need for backup so often. (You still need a Master Backup which has all files) Incremental backups are not as large as the Master Backups since it only records files that have changed. I would recommend iether way you do it NOT to rely on the backup applications provided with NT. Purchase a proper backup software which can schedule backups and audit files so that incremental backups are accurate. Many backup packages come with advanced features that are a lifesaver.

But, like tBoJ said, they dont' suffer from some of the same problems as tapes do, but, usually the tapes come with plastic cases that save them from most of the above described problems, and any additional problems with magnetism should be OK, because in your server room, there shouldn't be too much of that... and I'm sure that there's magnet-proof tape holding cases somewhere that you could get ahold of, for while the tapes are in transport.

If you need to backup 200gb on each server, a nice solution might be to get a huge-rear FireWire RAID, and backup all the files to that from your mac, or one of the servers that might have firewire, or can have it added.

-cory, the PE4400s we have are dark grey. One has 2 x pentium 800mhz, and one has a pentium 600Mhz.
-the tape drives we have are a seagate python that takes DDS-3 4mm data cartridges for the smaller server, and a DLT tape drive for the larger student file server. we use Fuji 40GBnative/80gbcompressed tapes.
-Backups are running like unknown said. . .a monthly backup that gets saved, and then weekly backups on a few different disk rotations.
-these servers are part of a college network. one is the student file server that gets used intensely, and the other is the staff/faculty file server that doesn't get used as much.

I like what q950 said about tape magazines. Right now we are thinking about automating. Either automating the tapes ot automating a dedicated back up server. Just don't know which way to go. . .stick with tapes or go the HD route? I appreciate the feedback thus far. thanks. . .

by the way. . .anyone need a job in Boulder CO? Looking for a server admin who will bring us into the new year with new os. . haha

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I have a problem with vintage electronics. . .I am working on it.

Something like this will work now and keep working when you expand your storage need. Its also perfect for automating the process.

I say stick with proven tape backup

666th poster and 666th thread-creator
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Ever think of a simple network storage server or an actual NAS Ethernet Disc?

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foetoid, that's (fee-toy-duh)
http://www.foetoid.doesntexist.com
da band: http://www.burningabbey.com

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offsite storage seems like it would be pretty damn pertinent.

foetoid. . .what do you mean by a "simple network storage?" Do you mean a dedicated server for backups? Well thats the question, tape, hd, combination, etc, etc. . .NAS systems look rad. . .32TB!!! Damn

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I have a problem with vintage electronics. . .I am working on it.

There are cheaper non-industry standards for everything but if its your ass when that system fails go with what has proven to work. This not only means picking the correct media and drive but also making sure that the media itself is stored in the apropriate manner (offsite secure location in a sealed safe or vault that has environmental controls in place). Also document each step of how the process works and where everything is stored. Code the tapes so some idiot doesnt overwrite the permanent storage tapes. Have a backup for the drive itself incase that breaks (this is very important in deciding what type of drive to use since some older DDS date drives had problems reading tapes from other drives because of slight head alignment).

A good idea is to send your system specs out to maybe a dozen places to get a system quote for the hardware and see what is recommended. You will notice a trend just from that, along with having hard data on what it will cost.

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good to know. . .

offsite storage seems like it would be pretty damn pertinent.

foetoid. . .what do you mean by a "simple network storage?" Do you mean a dedicated server for backups? Well thats the question, tape, hd, combination, etc, etc. . .NAS systems look rad. . .32TB!!! Damn

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________________
foetoid, that's (fee-toy-duh)
http://www.foetoid.doesntexist.com
da band: http://www.burningabbey.com

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