| Author |
Topic |
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shaktiman
Senior Member
United Kingdom
1226 Posts |
 Posted - 04 Jul 2002 : 14:05:38
Now first offI know what accessories are
I know what cpx's are
& I know what a ramdisk is. ask me about these related to any platform other than Atari & I will start to um & erm. I started the ramdisk on my quadra & now use it soley for Netscapes cache! It has not made Netscape perfect but it has helped a great deal at a gues I would say performnance improved by about 45%. Why do they have a cache? Well I know why a cache is supposedly used but with Netscape & internet explorer I think there is somthing sinister afoot. When I click the back button in either of these browsers my computer often takes a while saying that it is looking for the page!! but why is it looking if it has just saved it in the cache? so what has my computer got in this cache? or so why is my computer not accessing this cache? the cache was used as a way of companies storing information on your computer. This is because the big companies are desperate to "control" your life. No there is somthing definitley arye. Virtual(another rant as I am in that mode!) memory is the stupidist idea. Why? Memory is not that expensive and surley ppl spend loads on other stuff bu for me I get a computer I make sure it has the top spec of memory, there really is no substitue. virtual memory is a negative for me because if your computer continually writes & rewrites & deltes data from your drive this has got to cause extra wear. a level 2 cache or somthing like that would be grat. just for tasks laike the cache on a browser somthing dynamic like a ramdisk is recomended by me. shaktiman Quadra 840 av
128meg ram
1.2 gig drive
500 meg drive
os 8.1 |
thelip
Full Member
USA
729 Posts |
Posted - 04 Jul 2002 : 14:53:47
quote:
Why do they have a cache? Well I know why a cache is supposedly used but with Netscape & internet explorer I think there is somthing sinister afoot.
You can adjust how much space your browser allows for cache. If you have a high speed internet connection, i wouldn't bother with the cache. I turn it off. quote:
When I click the back button in either of these browsers my computer often takes a while saying that it is looking for the page!! but why is it looking if it has just saved it in the cache?
The computer still has to read that info. It's not going to be instantaneous. What's the model, what browser version, and what kind of site are you loading? quote:
or so why is my computer not accessing this cache?the cache was used as a way of companies storing information on your computer. This is because the big companies are desperate to "control" your life.
huh?... quote:
No there is somthing definitley arye.Virtual(another rant as I am in that mode!) memory is the stupidist idea. Why? Memory is not that expensive and surley ppl spend loads on other stuff bu for me I get a computer I make sure it has the top spec of memory, there really is no substitue. virtual memory is a negative for me because if your computer continually writes & rewrites & deltes data from your drive this has got to cause extra wear.
First off, ram might be cheap now, but 10-15 years ago it was definitely NOT. Virtual ram was a great substitute for machines with low ram and needing a lot for photoshop and other demanding applications.
Secondly, the drive accesses aren't all that bad as long as you don't fragment your drive to badly. The system is intended to use virtual ram. OSx has a very indepth virtual ram engine that you can't control like you could in previous systems. It self adjusts to the usage and amount of available ram that you have. quote:
a level 2 cache or somthing like that would be grat. just for tasks laike the cache on a browser somthing dynamic like a ramdisk is recomended by me.
You've got L2 cache all wrong. L2 cache is for processor caching. Current L2 backside cache is a direct ram path for the processor to cache commands and such. L2 and the new L3 cache is only for processors. There are no 68ks with l2 cahce that i'm away of, it's only l1. l1 is also intended for processor. the 040s have 8k of l1 cache.
Ramdisks are great solutions for macs with that extra ram, but i tend not to mess with them. The only time I've ever used a ram disk was for seti@home back in the day. As far as your complaints about surfing with your 68k. You need to understand that the web has drastically changed since the 68k was built and designed. Web pages rely on more complicated code. To allow for a more compatible web browser (later version) you're sacrificing speed. If speed is your main concern for you surfing, then i recommend looking into icab. It's a very small and fast browser. Unfortunately my quadras aren't going to fly through pages as quickly as a shiny new g4. _______________________
Sgt. Thelip
Heavy Weapons Specialist
950 division
Liberated Macs: 12 |
thelip
Full Member
USA
729 Posts |
Posted - 04 Jul 2002 : 14:57:19
quote:
I started the ramdisk on my quadra & now use it soley for Netscapes cache! It has not made Netscape perfect but it has helped a great deal at a gues I would say performnance improved by about 45%.
Did you make an alias of the original file and/directory to the ram disk. If you just drug the target over to a ram disk, then the app won't be looking for it. It will either make a new one where it used to be or might not be caching any web files. _______________________
Sgt. Thelip
Heavy Weapons Specialist
950 division
Liberated Macs: 12 |
shaktiman
Senior Member
United Kingdom
1226 Posts |
Posted - 05 Jul 2002 : 06:01:30
lol, I shall remember not to bother wading through one of thelips replys!shaktiman Quadra 840 av
128meg ram
1.2 gig drive
500 meg drive
os 8.1 |
~Coxy
Leader, Tactical Ops Unit
Australia
2822 Posts |
Posted - 05 Jul 2002 : 06:07:36
That's kinda insulting, his post was verbose but it contained good info.
Did you set the cache to the RAM disk within Netscape's prefs?~Coxy - Leader, Tactical Operations Unit
Mayor of NuBus City v3.0
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shaktiman
Senior Member
United Kingdom
1226 Posts |
Posted - 05 Jul 2002 : 06:22:47
Spend £100 on memory or on a drive?I guess you are talking as to what "you believe" to be factual. I talk more politically. as to your suggestion that the cache can be adjusted, that is akin to me telling you that your mouth can be kept shut(or your fingers kept away from the keyboard). It is not nice. Perhaps you search the internet, looking for 68k users just so's you can bag on em. I must learn to either keep my comments to myself(bye bye everybody)
or ignore certain replies. We could have a vote on weather my post was; welcome/unwelcome
worthwhile/worthless
worthy of the response/not warranting such a response. shaktiman Quadra 840 av
128meg ram
1.2 gig drive
500 meg drive
os 8.1 |
jruschme
Junior Member
USA
196 Posts |
Posted - 05 Jul 2002 : 07:15:10
quote:
I started the ramdisk on my quadra & now use it soley for Netscapes cache! It has not made Netscape perfect but it has helped a great deal at a gues I would say performnance improved by about 45%.Why do they have a cache? Well I know why a cache is supposedly used but with Netscape & internet explorer I think there is somthing sinister afoot.
The cache stores local copies of the most recently visited web pages and associated graphics. Nothing sinister... just a way to avoid having to reload an entire page over the network connection every time you return to a previously viwed page. The latter is only practical if you have a high-speed connection (and is, in fact, turning off the cache is recommended in some quarters for people with high speed connections). quote:
When I click the back button in either of these browsers my computer often takes a while saying that it is looking for the page!! but why is it looking if it has just saved it in the cache?
Probably looking for all the various pieces of the page in the cache's internal database/hash table. Also preforming various tasks like validating that the copy in cache is "current" or should be reloaded from the net. Also, don't forget the time to actually render the page. quote:
so what has my computer got in this cache?
HTML and graphics from pages most recently visited.quote:
or so why is my computer not accessing this cache?
It probably is. The whole process, though, is just taking longer than you would like.quote:
the cache was used as a way of companies storing information on your computer. This is because the big companies are desperate to "control" your life.No there is somthing definitley arye.
Okay, I think you need to go to the toolbox, get the wire cutters and cut the modem and network cables to your computer because that is the only way you will ever be truly "safe".quote:
Virtual(another rant as I am in that mode!) memory is the stupidist idea. Why? Memory is not that expensive and surley ppl spend loads on other stuff bu for me I get a computer I make sure it has the top spec of memory, there really is no substitue. virtual memory is a negative for me because if your computer continually writes & rewrites & deltes data from your drive this has got to cause extra wear.Quadra 840 av
128meg ram
1.2 gig drive
500 meg drive
os 8.1
A couple of points. First, memory was not always this cheap. Back when everything was on 30 pin SIMMS, 32mb would have cost you $800, if you wree really lucky. By comparison, a G4 owner probably would have trouble cramming $800 of memory into the box without hitting some limitation of the hardware. Second, with your config, it would make a lots of sense to turn Virtual Memory off, particularly if you are doing any video work. <<<john>>>
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thelip
Full Member
USA
729 Posts |
Posted - 05 Jul 2002 : 07:20:37
Whoa, calm down dude, I wasn't attacking your post. I was just letting you know my thoughts on your situation. You asked questions and i tried to answer them. I was in your shoes a while with trash and i misunderstood his comments to be critical of my post. Things got cleared up. I think you need to understand that nobody is hear to "bag" on anybody. I had free time and I thought I could clear some things up. Just because i don't use      after every phrase, doesn't mean i'm out to get somebody. Notice that there was no cynical comments to be twisted around. No voting is required, just accept our replies as we do your posts and everybody is happy. _______________________
Sgt. Thelip
Heavy Weapons Specialist
950 division
Liberated Macs: 12 |
shaktiman
Senior Member
United Kingdom
1226 Posts |
Posted - 05 Jul 2002 : 14:31:30
Truthfully I should "calm down"(manc accent)I have set my cache correctly, I have experimented setting the cache to both large & small. Personally it dosnt seem to help much. The only time I have found virtual memory to be a good thing(here is the big problem with virtual memory; you have two programs and one thinks you have tem meg and the other thinks you have 20 meg and then they start arguing.) Is when using Positive Image on my Atari ST(st only has two 720k floppies) and PI used ingenious "swap file" strategy(as 68000 st cant really do virtual memory), saving files to one floppy & removing. erm hang on I'm kinda digging a hole for myself here. Hey look lotsa invisible smileys. shaktiman Quadra 840 av
128meg ram
1.2 gig drive
500 meg drive
os 8.1 |
mattminserlg15
New Member
70 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jul 2002 : 15:35:13
i think you need to learn how to speak english a little better before putting down other people's very helpful answers. Personally, i thought "thelip" was very helpful towards you and replied with a detailed, knowledgable answer. In addition, if you don't know something about your computer, ask. Don't just assume you know it all (such as your putting down virtual memory) We are all very helpful and are hear to help you undersand more about your computer. Also - You'tr 68k was not particularily designed for web use. You're best bet is to switch to iCab....but in the end, you will probably find any kind of serious browsing to be a dissapointment. |
Trash80toG-4
NIGHT STALKER
USA
2899 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jul 2002 : 17:41:00
ROTFLMAO!!!!!!!! yo, lip! you're telling somebody from the U.K. to learn to speak english a little better! get a grip! shak, you're right , you DO need to settle down! these guys aren't bagging on you any more than i was! get it straight with them, they're trying to help, talking computers in the same dialect of english in one country is bad enough, with two different dialects and two different cultures that are as similar as ours it's no wonder misinterpretations happen! shakti, have you tried iCab yet? i think that was a very good suggestion, NN 4.73 is ancient/buggy enough that i use iCab half the time on my G4 under 9.1! i think this is the only site that works better with navigator. ars and fritter are both MUCH better with iCab.
jt  ™.
Trash Hauler: call sign: eight-ball
C.O. AC-130H SpecOps 68kMLAAF
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danamania
Official 68k Muse
Australia
1193 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jul 2002 : 18:03:23
quote:
When I click the back button in either of these browsers my computer often takes a while saying that it is looking for the page!! but why is it looking if it has just saved it in the cache?so what has my computer got in this cache?
or so why is my computer not accessing this cache?
I missed this thread back when it started n I wasn't here for a bit... anyhows, when you look up a page, it gets cached if you set it to - which you have... When you go back to that page, the browser doesn't just blindly show the cached page - that'd be daft, cos then you'd end up just looking at the cached version constantly... or until it had timed out (after a few days... or on the next browser load). Instead of just showing the same page, the browser re-requests the page from the webserver, knowing the date of the cached version. If the webserver replies saying that the page is unchanged since the last request - THEN you get the cached page shown... which, on a 68k, can take a bit of time on its own :). For an example, the relevant lines from the logs of my server... Code 200 - OK : 31828
Code 304 - Not Modified : 2592 Thats the basics - there's always a lot more to intelligent caching than that, especially when you get into proxy servers, and multiple levels of proxy servers... but the main bit is your browser isn't just blindly showing you an old page, it's checking to see if the cached page is truly relevant, before showing it to you... dana
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mattminserlg15
New Member
70 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jul 2002 : 23:45:22
uhh jt....i wasn't correcting his english itself as I know in the UK the language is a tid bit different. I was just saying that the lack of spaces between words, words mumble jumbled together, and such is a little bit annoying to mean and tought to find the meaning of. I don't mean to be mean to shakti nor to you jt. All I'm saying is that if things were worded a little more clearly, it would be easier for everyone to pitch in comments and help shatki out a bit. Sorry if I offended anyone with this post anbd I wish everyone a pleasant evening.
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shaktiman
Senior Member
United Kingdom
1226 Posts |
Posted - 19 Jul 2002 : 02:39:43
Hoyes & well "truth" is possibly subjective anyhow I is gettin into trouble alot even before this site. I could word my posts better it has to be said, but then again I have built my mac system frum scratch & had very little prior knowledge of mac. I think some of you would be suprised at how "off-hand" you may take some terms which I had never heard of. When I started I was going what is a .sea file? I dont know what to do, I click download but then dont know where the file is or how to use it. 1 example of a basic problem I've had. Now as for my personality...... I dont mean to "mortaly wound" ppl. I do have a personality & an attitude, & so have great ppl throughout history. Perhaps "y'all" should learn to deal with my personality. I like quite a few of the charachters here. this is to thelip, I offended you on purpose to get a conversation in order that we might interact better in the future. Ya gotta trust me that when I ask a question that I have probably exhausted most variables. I do realise however that there are "obvious" things which I may have missed.
I am here to be friendly & even hope that I may be helpfull, one day.
erm shaktiman Quadra 840av 128MB ram 2MB vram cd drive(caddy),1 caddy!:-)1.44 floppy drive,inject :-(1.2 gig drive
2 monitors 15" & 14" os 8.1 56k modem Stylewriter 1200 Zodiac speakers Umax 1220s scanner
3 year old son! |
shaktiman
Senior Member
United Kingdom
1226 Posts |
Posted - 20 Jul 2002 : 06:05:02
I will probably use icab now that I have a more stable set-up. I am looking for the software side much more so now for my Quadra.Cheers Trash shaktiman Quadra 840av 128MB ram 2MB vram cd drive(caddy),1 caddy!:-)1.44 floppy drive,inject :-(1.2 gig drive
2 monitors 15" & 14" os 8.1 56k modem Stylewriter 1200 Zodiac speakers Umax 1220s scanner
3 year old son! |
Itooktheplunge!
68k of the Week: kastegir's PowerBook 180.