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Topic |
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Trash80toG-4
NIGHT STALKER
USA
2899 Posts |
 Posted - 11 Apr 2002 : 07:34:26
I'm checking the feasibility of a Duo NuBusMiniDock™ hack. the similarity between the chipsets and spec of the DuoDock/Gemini 2 slot adapter components as compared with the IIsi adapter's components seems remarkable. any info pertaining to this kind of hack or info on hacking the DuoDock mobo to allow use of the Duo's onboard KVM (actually Keyboard/LCD/TrackBall-Pad  ) on a lidless DuoDock would be greatly appreciated.also, if somebody has an extra IIsi adapter, i'm interested! if you've got one handy and could take a closeup pic or make a scan showing the chipset numbers and the silk screen legend/traces that would be a big help all by itself, even if you're not ready to part with it. I've got a PAS 16 NuBus Card/Breakout Box coming from eBay and I'd like to be able to hack a SCSI Micro or preferably a MiniDock to interface with the PAS 16 and my PowerCD in order to fab a portable DuoBoomBoxDock™ so the minimum config would be to enable the Duo onboard KVM/Dock mobo combo. If it's possible, a NuBusMiniDock™ hack would be a far more elegant solution and battery friendly and it'd be kinda slick all on its ownsome too! tia
jt jt  ™ |
cinemafia
Guerrilla Recon Leader
USA
2965 Posts |
Posted - 11 Apr 2002 : 08:22:19
Not sure if it would work, but it's worth a try. My PAS-16 Card is going into my project IIci for use within my entertainment center...you gotta love the four stereo inputs!666th poster and 666th thread-creator
Mod of the Mac II series Forums
Total 68K Macs liberated: 7
Regular Disappear! |
Trash80toG-4
NIGHT STALKER
USA
2899 Posts |
Posted - 11 Apr 2002 : 08:54:43
quote:
Not sure if it would work, but it's worth a try. My PAS-16 Card is going into my project IIci for use within my entertainment center...you gotta love the four stereo inputs!
as far as the pas 16/Duo/DuoDock see comapability info:
http://home.att.net/~JBDUOFAQ/duo.htmlthe copro should be and the two bus transceivers are identical part nos. see:
http://abacus.sj.ipixmedia.com/abc/M28/_EBAY_4efe2300ed02b8b6a53d7ad137/i-1.JPG the three yellow ic's look to be the same as the green ones on the dock's 2 card right angle adapter, my guess would be bus driver ic's, dunno, see:
http://members.macconnect.com/~olde-mac-milt/ebaypics/414-iisi-adapterwfpu75.jpg the crystal can looks to be an identical form factor and is 40 Mhz on the dock board. as far as the two small ic's above the crystal can, they're probably the same as two IC's on the bottom of the dock board or the i/o (guessing) transceivers (labeled) adjacent to the serial port connectors on the dock board that appear to be the same form factor. the larger VLSI chip on the far left is probably the NuChip, but there is one other possibility on the dock board. i need better pics, but a hazy function recollection and the look of the lead spacing density on the IIsi adapter poics say NuChip to me. add'l pic:
http://abacus.sj.ipixmedia.com/abc/M28/_EBAY_35535fe1ed0e13341b2be75166/i-1.JPG this is just too much fun! jt ™
Edited by - Trash80toG-4 on 11 Apr 2002 09:00:52
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cee3pee0
Starting Member
USA
31 Posts |
Posted - 11 Apr 2002 : 12:00:03
I have a spare IIsi Nubus adapter that I could donate to the cause. Send me an e-mail if you want it (cee3pee0@hotmail.com)mdh
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cinemafia
Guerrilla Recon Leader
USA
2965 Posts |
Posted - 11 Apr 2002 : 12:20:25
quote:
as far as the pas 16/Duo/DuoDock see comapability info:
http://home.att.net/~JBDUOFAQ/duo.html
Funny, the guy who created that site is an AT&T WorldNet customer! I just looked up his account in our database, and apparently he has a PCI PowerMac with 16MB of RAM, and has only ever called to get his email password. Ahh, the power of being a tech flunkie! 666th poster and 666th thread-creator
Mod of the Mac II series Forums
Total 68K Macs liberated: 7
Regular Disappear! |
MattMinser
Starting Member
4 Posts |
Posted - 11 Apr 2002 : 16:53:44
Actully, im Matt Minser, the guy who hosts that site. I actually even forgot it existed on my account. I didnt creat it, its been passed on to a few people and finally on to me. I havnt updated it however, in a very long time. Do you all think it would be worth it to add some current info to it? The site actually would have dissappeared when I got cable but i must keep my att accoung because Tom Owad is not a nice person and wont let me on applefritter under my cable account. I am stuck dialing up and keeping a dial up account, just to access applefritter.....):
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Marchie
Chaplain
USA
911 Posts |
Posted - 11 Apr 2002 : 17:01:05
wait wait wait...
LIDLESS DUO DOCK?
You mean I can take my DuoDockII, take the lid off (or, take the extra lid I have and CUT it) and use the built in screen, and get advantage of the rest of the dock???!! Please tell me this is true... please please please ~Chaplain Marchie Holder of the Compact Mac -
-Stick of Justice, with Explodeing CRT head
-Wand of Power with Shocking Flyback Transformer Tip
~~"We are all Mad here"~~ |
Trash80toG-4
NIGHT STALKER
USA
2899 Posts |
Posted - 11 Apr 2002 : 20:36:39
quote:
wait wait wait...
LIDLESS DUO DOCK?
You mean I can take my DuoDockII, take the lid off (or, take the extra lid I have and CUT it) and use the built in screen, and get advantage of the rest of the dock???!! Please tell me this is true... please please please
i was hoping someone would tell ME it was true. it just seems like the kind of thing that ought to have been hacked already, i'm looking into all the angles i can think of to do a duo boombox hack. google around, i'll bet there are great photos of the whole process on some japanese site! if there aren't, it's impossible, the hackers over there are mad, if it's possible somebody over there did it! =8-}i got a T6 screwdriver and took my MiniDock apart, grafting something onto the PDS looks doable. has anybody seen info on opening up any of the MicroDocks? i need to take a look at my SCSI MicroDock next. jt ™
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Trash80toG-4
NIGHT STALKER
USA
2899 Posts |
Posted - 11 Apr 2002 : 20:44:55
quote:
I have a spare IIsi Nubus adapter that I could donate to the cause. Send me an e-mail if you want it (cee3pee0@hotmail.com)
i'm sure i will if this is at all possible, thanks for your generous offer! if you could just give me the text on all the IC's it would be a huge help, maybe i'll figure a way to link to a diagram. a selection of chip markings from docks and adapters would probably be a good thing to assemble.is the metal plate on the bottom of the adapter close enough to the solder side of the board that there are no IC's on that side? i'm sure there are lots of little tiny surface mount glue logic components, but any major IC's would be important to get the spec's on. thanks again! jt ™
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Marchie
Chaplain
USA
911 Posts |
Posted - 11 Apr 2002 : 21:32:32
There is ONE thing on the DuoDock lids... the eject button.Well.. if you cut the dock lid so it covers the logic board in the dock, and still clips into the front, sides and back, then it should be no problem. My micro dock will do video mirroring, or dual monitors, so I can only assume that mirroring would work, since you haven;t locked the sleep switch by having the Duo lid down. The way to check... pop your dock's lid off, slide the Duo in and lift the Duo's lid :-) ~Marchie ~Chaplain Marchie Holder of the Compact Mac -
-Stick of Justice, with Explodeing CRT head
-Wand of Power with Shocking Flyback Transformer Tip
~~"We are all Mad here"~~ |
Trash80toG-4
NIGHT STALKER
USA
2899 Posts |
Posted - 11 Apr 2002 : 21:48:57
quote:
There is ONE thing on the DuoDock lids... the eject button.Well.. if you cut the dock lid so it covers the logic board in the dock, and still clips into the front, sides and back, then it should be no problem. My micro dock will do video mirroring, or dual monitors, so I can only assume that mirroring would work, since you haven;t locked the sleep switch by having the Duo lid down. The way to check... pop your dock's lid off, slide the Duo in and lift the Duo's lid :-)
i think i've tried that, i'm pretty sure that it has something to do with the VRAM and video interface on the dock board taking precedence. maybe it's one of those pseudo-slot implementations and there would be an address conflict or maybe they are adding the dock's VRAM to that in the DUO (sys-profiler or tech-tool might run that down). dunno, but i wouldn't be at all surprised if disabling the dock's monitor out circuitry was required to get the lcd to work while docked.
jt ™
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Trash80toG-4
NIGHT STALKER
USA
2899 Posts |
Posted - 13 Apr 2002 : 20:11:26
addendum: the NuChip is confirmed as the larger ic on the IIsi NuBus adapter and is identified as the NuBus controller in the Dock II developer's notes.the block diagram of the Dock II indicates that the NuBus subsystem of the board interfaces independently to the fast and slow i/o buses of the Duo's 030 PDS and therefore might function properly if grafted onto the MiniDock. the traces of the two transceiver chips (?) on the bottom of the dock board lead directly to the right angle, 2 slot adapter card. so other than reading the numbers off an si adapter for final verification and running the part numbers for function, id's are confirmed for those IIsi adapter components as well. anybody got a lead on more info or block diagrams on the DuoDock or MiniDock? info on opening up any of the MicroDocks would also be appreciated. tia
jt ™. . Edited by - Trash80toG-4 on 13 Apr 2002 20:14:27 |
Marchie
Chaplain
USA
911 Posts |
Posted - 14 Apr 2002 : 10:52:01
Note: A LidLess DuoDock 2 does NOT work. The Powerbooks screen won't light.~Marchie ~Chaplain Marchie Holder of the Compact Mac -
-Stick of Justice, with Explodeing CRT head
-Wand of Power with Shocking Flyback Transformer Tip
~~"We are all Mad here"~~ |
Trash80toG-4
NIGHT STALKER
USA
2899 Posts |
Posted - 14 Apr 2002 : 11:35:06
quote:
Note: A LidLess DuoDock 2 does NOT work. The Powerbooks screen won't light.
yup, the pseudo-slot video circuitry on the Dock's Mobo disables the Duo's onboard video, that's why i'm looking for a hack to work around that limitation as a backup plan.i have found the DuoMiniDock.pdf but Tripod won't let me download it. when i look at it onscreen the graphics are missing, can anybody figure out how to nab it and e-mail it to me or tell me how to get the graphics to come up online? http://www.mothership.tripod.com/manuals/PowerBookDuoMiniDock.pdf tia
jt ™. . p.s. marchie, have you had a chance to figure out shipping for the 950 yet?
Edited by - Trash80toG-4 on 14 Apr 2002 11:42:47
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Trash80toG-4
NIGHT STALKER
USA
2899 Posts |
Posted - 20 Apr 2002 : 11:12:12
Update!my backup hack plan is a go! removing the Dock II Config ROM disables all pseudo-slot E functions, but leaves speaker, sound i/o, modem, ADB, Keyboard and internal video LCD operational. i will bet that the onboard appletalk/printer mosem port is also functional, but is physically inaccessible on an unmodified DuoDock. the kicker is that BOTH NuBus slots also remain functional allowing me to use my PAS 16/breakout box for fullblown stereo i/o and a SCSI card to interface with my PowerCd a/o DD-RW for my BoomBoxDock hack. a portable RipMixBurnDock for MP3 field campaigning might be an interesting twist. the NuBusMiniDock hack is looking better and better! which is good because this more battery friendly aproach and the added form factor flexibility makes a much more elegant component arrangement possible. because the NuBus Controller/Bridge Chipset in the Dock II remains fully functional without the help of any other circuit functionality, i am much more confident that they will be fully functional when grafted onto the PDS of the MiniDock. the next step will be to jumper the PDS connections of the MiniDock to an interface connector/adapter for the IIsi NuBus adapter whose chipset is identical to that of the original DuoDock. worst case should be replacement of the adapters chipset with that of the DuoDock in case the newer ASIC revs are required, but identical pin for pin compatable components are a WONDERFUL (unprecedented?) convenience! if this little baby works out i won't even need to (but will anyway) try to expand the adapter to the second slot (hrrmm? i wonder just how many slots that chipset supports?) anyhoo, it looks like more fun stuff to come! jt ™. . Edited by - Trash80toG-4 on 20 Apr 2002 11:17:41 |
Trash80toG-4
NIGHT STALKER
USA
2899 Posts |
Posted - 20 Apr 2002 : 12:42:37
i was posting a piccie of my MacStack and figured i'd share the screenshot of the hacked docks Desktop the portrait portion is from the Radius card and the Dayna NuBus NIC is initialized but not configured as can be seen in the appletalk control panel. it would have defaulted to printer port if the NIC hadn't been online. my problem getting the network connection up might only have been the jury rigged wire, it wasn't worth retesting, it was a lot easier to swap in another video card which worked fine.
jt ™. .
Edited by - Trash80toG-4 on 20 Apr 2002 12:55:02
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Trash80toG-4
NIGHT STALKER
USA
2899 Posts |
Posted - 24 Apr 2002 : 06:15:41
thought of a new twist while updating the info and begging for feedback on fritter!quote:
UPDATE!.......i tested the ROMless Dock II with two video cards in it and had two CRT's and the LCD running at once! the TattleTech info on ROM/NuBus config for info the Dock II and the MiniDock are identical dates and setup, the only differences are the Dock Type and ID! my guess is that there's a good chance the MiniDock ROM will work the Dock II. they can get apple's IIsi ROM to work for cleaning up an SE/30's memory act and this is a LOT simpler than that. Was the Dock I-II series also OEM'd by SuperMac Technology? I know they were for the MiniDock, i wouldn't be at all surprised if the ROMs aren't identical. i wonder if there is something similar to the LC475/Q605 jumper on every Dock's board? if so, swapping the ROM's won't work, but a simpler hardware hack might be all that's necessary. Has anybody got a MiniDock with another brand name on it? i'd appreciate any TattleTech (or TechTool or any other) info to check against my suspicions. suggestions or hunches/differing theories would also be greatly appreciated. jt =8-}
feedback and info would be GREATLY appreciated, gang! jt ™. . Edited by - Trash80toG-4 on 24 Apr 2002 06:17:02 |
IIsi Nubus Adapter/Duo MiniDock Graft?
68k of the Week: kastegir's PowerBook 180.