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System Software Install Issue on Mac Classic II
- Thread starter eR1c
- Start date
Okay, played with this some more this evening:
I put the original HD in, on startup it spins up then stops. I believe that the computer is looking for a startup disk, hence why it is spinning. -but passes and spins it down once it determines it is not a suitable drive or unrecognized. But it is spinning up initially. Just after that the screen goes back to the flashing ? folder.
I then swapped Charles's HD back in, (the 2.5" drive). I do not hear it spin up (but maybe it is a quiet drive)?? I know my laptop's HD is really difficult to hear. I do notice that the top of the new 2.5" HD gets warm to the touch ...so it is definitely getting power.
I also tried restarting w/ extensions turned off (held shift key down).
I zapped the PRAM again.
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so tonight I didn't have any luck. Next I will try that 7.5.3 patched boot up disk from a floppy. Yet that may have to wait a few days, as I have some other work related things to tend to.
as a side note, I have an extra motherboard that is bad, but some parts may be fine, ...i read that there is a "SCSI controller"?? Not sure what this is or what it looks like, but I could swap some hardware parts from my other motherboard if there are known parts that fail over time? ...so that is an option.
any further recommendations welcomed!
I put the original HD in, on startup it spins up then stops. I believe that the computer is looking for a startup disk, hence why it is spinning. -but passes and spins it down once it determines it is not a suitable drive or unrecognized. But it is spinning up initially. Just after that the screen goes back to the flashing ? folder.
I then swapped Charles's HD back in, (the 2.5" drive). I do not hear it spin up (but maybe it is a quiet drive)?? I know my laptop's HD is really difficult to hear. I do notice that the top of the new 2.5" HD gets warm to the touch ...so it is definitely getting power.
I also tried restarting w/ extensions turned off (held shift key down).
I zapped the PRAM again.
-----------
so tonight I didn't have any luck. Next I will try that 7.5.3 patched boot up disk from a floppy. Yet that may have to wait a few days, as I have some other work related things to tend to.
as a side note, I have an extra motherboard that is bad, but some parts may be fine, ...i read that there is a "SCSI controller"?? Not sure what this is or what it looks like, but I could swap some hardware parts from my other motherboard if there are known parts that fail over time? ...so that is an option.
any further recommendations welcomed!
Does the drive still spin down if you power it on without the SCSI cable connected? if it does, then there's a problem with the drive. The old drives all should remain spinning as far as I know.
Even with the cable attached it shouldn't be spinning down. I have a bad drive myself, but it remains powered up and spinning even though the Mac gave up trying to boot from it. It doesn't tell drives to spin down last I checked. At least the Macintosh SE line doesn't. (I don't think any of the compact line does. Controllers telling the drive to spin down is more of a power saving feature and none of the old macs had much in the way of power saving features)
As for the 2.5 drive, it may not be terminated properly being that it sounds like you are using a 80/68 to 50 pin adapter on it. Also try using Lido. It seems my dead drive and gave me a useful error code that narrowed the problem to the drive and not the cable/scsi controller. If the 2.5 drive isn't terminated properly, Lido will give you a SCSI arbitration failed error. I forget the exact message, but I believe Lido will give you a clear error that can indicate a termination issue. If the SCSI bus is bad Lido might also display an error for that.
Although I may still attempt to format mine once my mouse arrives (as I can't navigate the program without a mouse.
). My drive had a head crash due to it's age. (it was inactive for a long time judging from the fact the previous owner said it was still working last time he used it but had it in storage for more then a decade)
Despite that, the drive does not power down even when connected to the Macintosh SE that boots to the flashing floppy disk icon. So your drive should not be powering down. There appears to be a serious hardware fault like a stuck head. Although some models that had a head crash might power down after failing to read the special area before track 0. Mine doesn't power down with that problem though.
Either way, if Lido fails to see/format your drive, a patched version of one of Apples official tools won't help.
Even with the cable attached it shouldn't be spinning down. I have a bad drive myself, but it remains powered up and spinning even though the Mac gave up trying to boot from it. It doesn't tell drives to spin down last I checked. At least the Macintosh SE line doesn't. (I don't think any of the compact line does. Controllers telling the drive to spin down is more of a power saving feature and none of the old macs had much in the way of power saving features)
As for the 2.5 drive, it may not be terminated properly being that it sounds like you are using a 80/68 to 50 pin adapter on it. Also try using Lido. It seems my dead drive and gave me a useful error code that narrowed the problem to the drive and not the cable/scsi controller. If the 2.5 drive isn't terminated properly, Lido will give you a SCSI arbitration failed error. I forget the exact message, but I believe Lido will give you a clear error that can indicate a termination issue. If the SCSI bus is bad Lido might also display an error for that.
Although I may still attempt to format mine once my mouse arrives (as I can't navigate the program without a mouse.
). My drive had a head crash due to it's age. (it was inactive for a long time judging from the fact the previous owner said it was still working last time he used it but had it in storage for more then a decade)Despite that, the drive does not power down even when connected to the Macintosh SE that boots to the flashing floppy disk icon. So your drive should not be powering down. There appears to be a serious hardware fault like a stuck head. Although some models that had a head crash might power down after failing to read the special area before track 0. Mine doesn't power down with that problem though.
Either way, if Lido fails to see/format your drive, a patched version of one of Apples official tools won't help.
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Thank-you, this is extremely helpful.
I will try what your recommending. As for terminating the new HD, is there a proper way I should be doing that? I can post a photo this evening. My new HD has a jumper at ID 2 and towards the opposite end of the pins. -a photo may help here.
Thanks, not quite ready to give up on this old Mac.
I will try what your recommending. As for terminating the new HD, is there a proper way I should be doing that? I can post a photo this evening. My new HD has a jumper at ID 2 and towards the opposite end of the pins. -a photo may help here.
Thanks, not quite ready to give up on this old Mac.
Lido won't fit on a floppy with both system software and other disktools. So just make a bootable floppy and put Lido on it. You won't have much room for anything else on that floppy.
-perfect! (thank you for your help).So just make a bootable floppy and put Lido on it. You won't have much room for anything else on that floppy.
by the way have you read "Ready Player One"? Read it several months ago, -it is partly responsible for my obsession with getting my old Mac running.
Don't think I've read that one. My main reason for getting back into vintage macs is simply because I used to use them when I as a child, so sentimental reasons. 
Quick question, -and looking ahead if I can't solve this issue.
Would an iomega Zip drive work as a startup disk? Have a dedicated zip drive as my startup disk. I remember using one (but not as a startup drive) back in the day w/ my Power PC ...I think they worked pretty well.
Would an iomega Zip drive work as a startup disk? Have a dedicated zip drive as my startup disk. I remember using one (but not as a startup drive) back in the day w/ my Power PC ...I think they worked pretty well.
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I recently posted a thread in the conquests thread. It shows me booting a Macintosh SE off a zip disk. So you can definitely use one as your boot drive. Though mine now has a working hard-drive so that's what I use to boot it. The bootable zip disk I made has verious versions of MacOS installers on it. Something I plan to use with any additional Macs I plan to acquire. 
Zip drives are only slightly slower then the hard-drives of the period and on an SE or Classic I would think the difference wouldn't be that noticeable.
So if you are worried it would take as long too boot from one as it does a traditional floppy disk...don't. They are much faster then floppy disks.
Zip drives are only slightly slower then the hard-drives of the period and on an SE or Classic I would think the difference wouldn't be that noticeable.
So if you are worried it would take as long too boot from one as it does a traditional floppy disk...don't. They are much faster then floppy disks.
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Well, hopefully it won't come to that. Post a picture of the adapter you got with the 10k drive. I know variants exist... some with active termination, some without. It would be good from a troubleshooting perspective to know exactly what you got.-Thanks, good to know that I WILL be able to use this MAC then.
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