Getting started with an incomplete Performa 6100

[somedude]

I apologize for consecutive posts, but it seems that editing is time-limited.

Unfortunately, I may have hit a brick wall: apparently, Internet access on these 6100s is only available over dial-up...

I was looking forward to try it out, but I don't even have a land line in my house, not to mention an ISP that still does dial-up.

I will still try to get it running, though, should be a fun project still.

If I can get some peripherals and a drive, I will post some pics.

 

[MJ313]

6100's can get online via Ethernet, you just need an AAUI transceiver.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_Attachment_Unit_Interface

A lot of dongly attachments for those 6100's....

 

[tanaquil]

According to lowendmac, the 6100 comes with an AAUI Ethernet port. You should only need an AAUI->RJ-45 adapter, which should be dirt cheap. If you have trouble locating one, I think I have one I bought by mistake because I didn't understand what it was.

 

[somedude]

Cool!

Thank you very much, that's reassuring.

I will try to find one of those adapters/transceivers.

They are expensive on eBay though, one wanted $100 shipping...

The port is there, I had no idea what it was.

 

[MJ313]

Also keep your eye out for a 10/100 baseT hub or switch, because you might (probably will) have issues connecting directly to a modern router. All of this stuff can be found, if you just know what to look for and know where old tech piles up. Just do your research, or ask questions and someone will offer advice.

 

[tanaquil]

https://www.ebay.com/itm/272265196250

FYI! I just happened to see this. You would still need the DB15/VGA adapter, those are very common.

 

[trag]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Asante-FN10TA-Friendly-Net-Media-Adapter-10-Base-T-RJ-45-New-sealed-/272240447724?hash=item3f62cb90ec:g:0eYAAOSwLN5WlLoL

AAUI Transceiver for less than $15.

 

[tanaquil]

AAUI: that's the one you want, and the price is right. $100, LOL - either the seller is crazy (there are plenty of those) or you were looking at a SCSI-Ethernet adapter. Now those cost serious money.

I can't recall if I mistakenly ended up with the one I have because I somehow thought it was a cheap SCSI bridge, or if I was trying to find an AUI adapter. Ah well, it was cheap, and I keep it around in case I ever end up with a Quadra from that generation.

 

[somedude]

Many thanks to everyone that pitched in, it was very helpful and amazingly prompt.

I'm afraid that I must table this project for now.

The one store I had high hopes I could find some old stuff didn't have a single part I needed.

Since my only hope right now is eBay and I can't afford to spend a couple of hundred on the stuff I need, I have to quit for now.

The one thing I will try is to build a video conector for Hdi45 and try to make a VGA adapter.

I found pinouts online and the pin pitch appears to be 2mm, so I cam try to use a perfored board with a 2mm pitch.

If the machine is alive and well, I might take my time and source out the keyboard, mouse, HDD and AAUI-Ethernet adapter.

Maybe I can trade some RAM for what I am missing. I have some 32M sticks of EDO.

Again, thank you all for your help.

 

[tanaquil]

Good luck! The machine can wait. Just make sure you take out the PRAM battery before you store it, those things can explode.

 

[Bunsen]

Moved to Nubus Powermacs forum.

 

[Bunsen]

For everything you might ever want to know about 6100s, see http://kan.org/6100 - bearing in mind any prices there are several years out of date.

 

[Bunsen]

[AAUI comments removed - already answered]

One other note - RAM in those machines must be installed in matching-sized pairs, as it uses both slots for a 64-bit RAM bus.  You can go up to 256MB or possibly 512MB total, but 128MB would be more than enough for Mac OS 9.x, 64MB plenty for 8.x, and 32MB probably about enough for 7.x.

I don't personally recommend running System 7 on those machines, as most versions tended to be quite buggy and crashy on PPC.  8.1 is what I would recommend for a low-RAM setup, and 9.1 if you have a decent amount.

I wouldn't bother with trying to build an HDI-45 to VGA adapter unless you enjoy that kind of tinkering.  The HDI to Mac adapter cable and the Mac to VGA adapter are both around the ebays pretty regularly.

Or, the PDS slot can take a couple of different video cards.  The HDI-45 uses motherboard RAM for video, so it can be painfully slow, especially if you have no cache and / or are trying to browse the internet.  The HPV card /edit/ and AV card / both have their own fast VRAM onboard, which will be a huge improvement.

Both the HPV and the AV cards have Mac 15 pin video connectors, so that's one adapter you wouldn't have to buy.  The AV card doesn't have onboard VRAM and so you're still stuck with slow main system RAM for video, but they're cheaper to find, and also have S-Video (PAL/NTSC) output and input.

/eta/ correction:  according to kan, the AV card has 2MB of VRAM onboard.

You will also need the right-angle PDS riser card (specific to the 6100) if that is not included.  There are G3 CPU upgrades for that PDS which take the place of the riser, and have a pass-through for a video card, but they are also getting hard to find these days.

I really don't think you'll need to spend a couple of hundred on this, if you're willing to hunt around and be patient.  Once you have video at least, you should be able to boot from the CD you have there, or a floppy, and decide if it's worth pursuing beyond that.

 

[Bunsen]

You will also need the right-angle PDS riser card (specific to the 6100) if that is not included.

I think you can put a 6100 PDS card straight into the motherboard slot, but then you won't be able to put the lid back on the machine.  Still, that might be an option for testing until a right-angle riser or G3 shows up.

 

[Bunsen]

One good thing about a SCSI ZIP / Jaz drive is that you can use a matching USB drive to transfer software to and from a PC while getting set up - and, should you find any other old SCSI-dependent Macs down the road, it will come in handy again.  Even a 100MB ZIP should be enough to get a working test system up.

 

[Elfen]

Thank you very much

....

..

.

@elfen

I thought you would get a kick out of it, so I posted...

I might be able to get an 18.2 SCSI drive with a 68 pin connector, which I believe could be adapted to 50 pin.

PM Uniserver. I think he has those adapters. He also has those 68pin drives (forget what size but they are greater than 10GB, and they are NOS- New Old Stock, never used), and they do come with the 50pin adapter.

Here's a 6100/7100/8100 monitor cable on Flea Bay for $25... its a bit steep but its the only one I can find under them. Other internet markets might have them but I don't know them. And its not that rare as the seller claims. Just hard to find.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/RARE-Apple-PowerMac-6100-7100-8100-Adapter-for-Apple-Mac-to-use-VGA-displays-/222128839191

 

[somedude]

Thank you very much for your replies.

I will take it slow, one step at a time.

Video first.

 

[Cory5412]

Welcome to the forum and congratulations on the 6100!

For the baseline entry of the time, they're a very nice machine and I've got one myself.

AUI dongle will have no trouble at all connecting to a modern 10/100 or gigabit residential gateway switch, or whatever inexpensive gigabit switch you're using in your home.

Uniserver is no longer on the 68kMLA forums. When it comes time to buy storage, we have a vendor selling scsi2SD cards, or ebay or our or own trading post will surely have some form of SCSI disk available. Different people have different ideas about what storage is "appropriate" for that kind of machine. I'm personally hesitant to recommend the old stock server disks that elfen does, because they can generate a lot of heat, which a 6100 may not be able to dissipate. Not sure about older disks, like the 18-gig ones.

A note about PRAM batteries: I do recommend taking the one in your system out, but it might still be good, hold onto it just in case.

The 6100 suffers from an oddity when no PRAM battery is installed. You will not get video unless you do what is sometimes called the Pizzabox Power Toggle. Basically, you turn the machine on, then off again, then on again in rapid succession, and this gets it to display video.

I recommend buying a fresh PRAM battery to avoid the strain this will put on the components. What I did with mine for a while was to just boot it and leave it running, which is also an option, albeit an inefficient one.

Although I personally ended up just buying the HDI45 adapter, I'm following your attempt to build an HDI45 to VGA cable with great interest. It's worth trying, because electrically Apple's HDI45 to DB15/SVGA adapter was trivial.

 

[Bunsen]

AUI dongle

Just to note, for the sake of ebay searching, that there is such a thing as an AUI dongle, but what you want is an AAUI dongle.  The extra A stands for Apple.  An AUI dongle is not compatible with the socket on the back of a 6100.

the Pizzabox Power Toggle. Basically, you turn the machine on, then off again, then on again in rapid succession, and this gets it to display video.

Note that you should leave the machine powered on (ie, failing to boot) for a time before trying the rapid off-on cycle.  This is to allow the PRAM circuit to absorb a little charge before attempting to boot it without a battery.  The length of "a time" varies - I usually give it a half-hour, then a couple of hours if that fails, then overnight, before giving up.  While it's not a permanent fix - getting a good battery installed is recommended - it is a useful test to find out if the machine will boot at all before proceeding with other repairs / purchases.

 

[Cory5412]

My bad about AUI vs. AAUI. AUI will in fact not connect to the onboard Ethernet port on the back of any Mac.

I usually did the powertoggle immediately and didn't have any problems, although waiting will at least relieve part of the tress of the powertoggle action.

In general, PRAM batteries are cheap and a new one is a good investment. I buy mine at the Fry's Electronics down in Phoenix, but local Radio Shacks might have them, and you can find them online.

This stuff is old enough that when possible I like to avoid taking unnecessary chances.