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Caps! -- Macintosh SE/30

uniserver

uniserver

68LC040
 
Yuck, don't re-install the same crappy SMT electrolytics that leaked the first time. Look at the specs, they're only rated for a few thousand hours. Tantalum or ceramic chip capacitors are far superior for only a few dollars more per computer.

 
I agree on specifying Tantalums only for these recap database entries.

If someone wants to use electrolytics, they can easily to find compatible substitutes for the cap specifications posted in the 68kMLA's (grass roots) database development project.

James, it you'd hash it out with Jeff we could some help coming up with guidelines, equivalencies and acceptable variations from spec . . .

. . . if you can parse that, hopefully you know what I'm fumbling at saying.

Thread linked: Capacitor Replacement Thread . . .

 
Yuck, don't re-install the same crappy SMT electrolytics that leaked the first time.
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Agreed, and having all these threads on caps is diluting the good info already contained here in the forums. Also saying things like twist off caps and promoting other lazy methods of fixing stuff is frustrating to see. Think of it from the perspective of someone new coming here trying to find reliable info for fixing their gear without making it worse. I hope mods (it?) put in some input and try to improve quality vs quantity of info to buck the more recent trend. :-/

 
If they last 5 years I'd be happy. I'm sure that would be more than enough. After that they will most likely be just for sure mostly.

 
Agreed, and having all these threads on caps is diluting the good info already contained here in the forums.
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This is a work in progress, I like the feedback, if you'd post the links to existing threads/info in Capacitor Replacement Thread . . . it would be greatly appreciated.

uniserver, don't be defensive about constructive criticism, this is a group effort, your graphics are VERY helpful, but the commentary for all articles will need to be vetted, edited, aided and abetted by the rest f the gang.

Guys, I asked for help in compiling this database w/almost exactly this type of artwork quite a while back. uniserver is, so far, the only one to post content for the project, so take it easy and make sure commentary is helpful AND constructive . . . deal?

Rule #1 - Form factors and types should be strictly adhered to for this project, as well as appearance of parts if possible. Let's all work together to make this just right, @ troops!

@ tt & gang: how about jumping in with pics of the period correct cap types in tantalum and the specs and ordering info for them? Those on the rest of the continents, we need similar data for local parts suppliers.

Anyone wanting to substitute less expensive components may do so on their own hook, this project is meant to try to keep our toys working for another 25 years.

 
They are oem replacement parts, They will last (at a minimum) as long as the stock caps did.

Its like a GM Car has A/C delco spark plugs, sure you can go and buy Bosch +4's, but the car was designed / engineered / tested to operate with

Oem Stock Parts.

I am not taking offense, not at all. Its just these campfire stories, That your system is going to blow up like next year, using oem parts is ridiculous.

Keep in mind, with your costs, If at some point you do want to get some ROI on your vintage peace? It's not gonna happen if you do not keep an eye

on what you are spending.

 
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The tantalums I used were under 50 cents each. Arguably superior multilayer ceramic chip capacitors are around 80 cents. Those have the advantage of being non-polar and are potentially a bit more reliable than tantalum. I can poke around on Mouser this evening and find some links, but I just bought the same tantalums that were posted on some Mac re-capping page I found on the net. For what it's worth, I haven't yet found a bad through-hole cap on a Mac logic board. My policy with those has been to test the ESR, and if it checks ok (as they all have) I leave it alone. The through-hole caps that go bad are the really highly stressed ones in the power supply.

Any number of different parts will work here. The applications that used the SMT 'lytics are non-critical, they had to be, even when new the old caps had terrible specs, ESR of 10+ Ohms was not uncommon and that's with a brand new part. My reasoning for using more reliable parts is that each leakage damages the board, and each replacement risks lifting a pad or tearing a trace. When working with stuff that isn't made anymore IMO it's worth a few dollars more to do it once and be done with it. It's still only about 5 bucks to re-cap the whole board.

 
Yuck, don't re-install the same crappy SMT electrolytics that leaked the first time.
Click to expand...
Agreed, and having all these threads on caps is diluting the good info already contained here in the forums. Also saying things like twist off caps and promoting other lazy methods of fixing stuff is frustrating to see.
Click to expand...
There are a couple of folks on the forums who seem to have made it there mission in life to recommend the twisting off method in every single thread on the topic and they go out of their way to criticize desoldering the caps.

I've mostly been ignoring it, figuring folks can get the more reliable methods from the older threads, and I don't feel like having a war spread across dozens of threads. So I limit myself to stating that there are several available methods and different folks have different preferences.

However, the twist-off folks have been preaching their method as the one true method and that is extremely irritating and probably out right wrong.

Okay, grumpy-old-man mode off.

You can always order the tantalum caps from me. You're really not saving any money going with Mouser or Digi-Key at the prices you're qouting here. The only advantage is that Mouser and Digi-Key have on-line ordering forms and one must actually type a message or two to order from me -- although I'd respond fine to a simple PayPal payment with shipping address and a list of capacitors.

 
The whole point to all this effort is to get away from the good old boy, PM - word of mouth communication,

Here is your main board-

Here are the caps you need-

Here are the cap links-

Here is how much they cost-

Here is how many are in-stock-

Here is shipping/carrier/pay

On their way, The next day-

Buy.

Cap.

Done.

 
Guys, I asked for help in compiling this database w/almost exactly this type of artwork quite a while back. uniserver is, so far, the only one to post content for the project, so take it easy and make sure commentary is helpful AND constructive . . . deal?
Rule #1 - Form factors and types should be strictly adhered to for this project, as well as appearance of parts if possible. Let's all work together to make this just right, @ troops!

@ tt & gang: how about jumping in with pics of the period correct cap types in tantalum and the specs and ordering info for them? Those on the rest of the continents, we need similar data for local parts suppliers.
Click to expand...
Mk.588 did a good job outlining the different components. I think techknight, trag, jdw and others also covered it in different ways. I am not an electrical engineer so I defer to those more knowledgeable about picking the best components. I offered my own take when I found out about polymer caps as a different technology and did not really see anyone talking about them. I listed exactly what I used in that thread and re-posted in the cap replacement thread. If you use those parts they will work and their dimensions are as close to stock as what I could find at Mouser. I think it's also fine to use tantalums, but I offered that info. for people who might have a special board/machine they want to keep looking more original. Using electrolytics for the small caps seems suspect going on our collective past experience. I do not see a reason to buy the cheapest parts when the better alternatives are not very much more. The time you spend on the repair is worth using better parts and repair methods. You can order from Trag if you have no clue what to buy.

If you are going to list parts here, I say the rule is you have to actually use them before you recommend them as a substitute.

There are a couple of folks on the forums who seem to have made it there mission in life to recommend the twisting off method in every single thread on the topic and they go out of their way to criticize desoldering the caps.
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Yeah, I sort of feel it has become the norm and is turning off people that make this forum a great place to learn new things.
 
Gentlemen, Trag is correct. Why buy from anywhere else.

Here are my BEFORE/AFTER SE/30 logic board recapping pics, with complete description under the photo, including link-backs to various discussions on this site, as well as to Trag's recapping kit:




 
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