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Best compact mac for retro gaming
- Thread starter macaddict
- Start date
A Plus wouldn't be bad. I'd argue an SE or even an SE/30 would be better though. A Color Classic would be nice as well.
SE's are going to be the cheapest, and you also don't have to worry about finding the older keyboard, you can use any ADB keyboard with an SE or newer. 128k/512k/Plus keyboards can be pricey if you dont get them with the machine.
SE's are going to be the cheapest, and you also don't have to worry about finding the older keyboard, you can use any ADB keyboard with an SE or newer. 128k/512k/Plus keyboards can be pricey if you dont get them with the machine.
Color Classics are nice...and expensive!
Plus, there's a lot of newer, color software they can't play without modification, so the color isn't as big of a benefit as you might think at first. It is a nice screen though.
SE's and SE/30's can be had for a reasonable cost, the SE is also reliable like a tank.
Plus, there's a lot of newer, color software they can't play without modification, so the color isn't as big of a benefit as you might think at first. It is a nice screen though.
SE's and SE/30's can be had for a reasonable cost, the SE is also reliable like a tank.
Easier to get SE/30 than to try and upgrade Mac Plus. Mac Plus is limited to max 4MB, no internal hard drive without serious hack, and the tiny keyboard isn't too comfortable compared to Extended Keyboard II. Plus you're also limited with choice of mouse for Plus vs SE/30. SE/30 can have really huge memory upgrade although anything over 8MB is probably overkill.
For all-in-one color, something like LC or Performa 550 or 575, they support 640x480 which are required minimum for some games. Color Classic and II as well as Performa 275 have smaller display and may have problem with a few color games.
For all-in-one color, something like LC or Performa 550 or 575, they support 640x480 which are required minimum for some games. Color Classic and II as well as Performa 275 have smaller display and may have problem with a few color games.
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No - if all you want to do is play 68K games, the Duo isn't a good choice due to non-standard resolution (640 x 400), terrible keyboard (it really is) and lack of expansion options (2.5" SCSI drives, hard to find RAM if yours has little). The Colour Classic is versatile machine, but again you're limited to low non-standard resolution. I'd suggest looking out for an LC475/Quadra 605), which is small, you can plug it into a modern LCD monitor without issue, and cheap to upgrade. For B&W only games, an SE/30 would be a good choice, partly because of it's 1.44MB drive. A Plus/SE with 800K drive takes too much work to get software onto it.
Also consider a later PPC Powerbook (not as many 68K games will run due to compatibility issues, but there are of course many PPC-accelerated games), which can give you PCMCIA (invaluable getting games you've downloaded online onto a CF card, then CF-->PCMCIA adapter). Something like a 3400 is pretty good - it'll run 80% Mac games, PPC included, nicely.
Also consider a later PPC Powerbook (not as many 68K games will run due to compatibility issues, but there are of course many PPC-accelerated games), which can give you PCMCIA (invaluable getting games you've downloaded online onto a CF card, then CF-->PCMCIA adapter). Something like a 3400 is pretty good - it'll run 80% Mac games, PPC included, nicely.
So my requirements are AIO or laptop, fairly portable( under 25 lbs or/and with carrying case) and a Motorola processor. so far the se/30 looks like the best choice for b/w games, but for color games I still have not found a good system yet. Any system that works with color games at 640 by 480? I read about a mod for the color classic 2/ performa 275 that brings the resolution to 640 by 480, but it looks a little bit hard. I would be willing to do it though if it would mean that I could get the best retro gaming experience in color on a macintosh. Any other suggestions?
My tuppence worth would be that since you are looking at this solely for the purpose of retro gaming is to work backwards from what games you want to play.
68k games - probably an se/30. Se's are the cheapest and aren't likely to need an instant recapping, but the upgradable its of an se/30 will play a broader range and it is possible (if blindingly expensive) to find a dos card. Se dos cards are rarer than water on the sun.
If yo just want to be able to play a long range of games on one machine, look at the performas because of the much cheaper and readily available dos cards. Though to be honest if you want to play mid nineties games buy an old pc or emulator - those were apples dark days and every game pretty much was on windows/dos
68k games - probably an se/30. Se's are the cheapest and aren't likely to need an instant recapping, but the upgradable its of an se/30 will play a broader range and it is possible (if blindingly expensive) to find a dos card. Se dos cards are rarer than water on the sun.
If yo just want to be able to play a long range of games on one machine, look at the performas because of the much cheaper and readily available dos cards. Though to be honest if you want to play mid nineties games buy an old pc or emulator - those were apples dark days and every game pretty much was on windows/dos
Another all-round awesome computer for 68K and DOS would be a Quadra 630 DOS compatible - often derided for being a bit cheap, a mess internally and with poorly performing onboard video, but you can soup those puppies up with a full 40Mhz '040 (over clocked), big IDE hard disk, and an overdrive 486 (eg. DX4-100, over the crappy Cyrix 486SX25 they came with).
The Colour Classic is a versatile machine though, but to be honest only with the "Takky" modification. I know purists won't like hearing that, however then you can run anything on it and fast.
The Colour Classic is a versatile machine though, but to be honest only with the "Takky" modification. I know purists won't like hearing that, however then you can run anything on it and fast.
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Do bear in mind that you'll have to get the games onto the compact mac in question.
None came with ethernet, for example, and you'll pay more for the SE/30 ethernet card than you will for the SE/30. Compact mac networking was done via AppleTalk and serial cables.
Not all came with hard drives, especially Pluses and SEs. Furthermore, Pluses and earlier SEs came with 800K floppy drives.
You have to think about how you will get your software onto the compact mac - via floppy? or via a SCSI device, like an external hard drive, CD-ROM or zip-drive, all of which entails more expense.
Remember that these machines are between 20 - 30 years old. Parts fail. Boards will need recapping.
If hassle is an issue, and if you are starting from scratch, old compact macs can be a hassle. With any luck you'll find a decent seller who will do it all for you.
I know that you specified a compact mac, but I wonder whether an old mac like a IIcx might be sufficient for your needs. It is quite expandable, certainly more so than the compact macs and shouldn't cost as much. You won't get the cute little B&W mac, but the range of games will be greatly expanded. Much as I enjoyed playing Prince of Persia, for example, on an SE, I prefered it in color on the IIcx.
The IIcx is relatively inexpensive, partly because the IIci, is bigger brother, is so sought after. However, it just needs a half decent NuBus video card and a adaptor for a low-end LCD monitor. I'm not sure if it's possible to transfer files directly from your modern MBP to a IIcx via ethernet. If not, buy a USB zip drive and a SCSI zip drive, or a SCSI CD-ROM if you are able to burn CDs on your MBP.
None came with ethernet, for example, and you'll pay more for the SE/30 ethernet card than you will for the SE/30. Compact mac networking was done via AppleTalk and serial cables.
Not all came with hard drives, especially Pluses and SEs. Furthermore, Pluses and earlier SEs came with 800K floppy drives.
You have to think about how you will get your software onto the compact mac - via floppy? or via a SCSI device, like an external hard drive, CD-ROM or zip-drive, all of which entails more expense.
Remember that these machines are between 20 - 30 years old. Parts fail. Boards will need recapping.
If hassle is an issue, and if you are starting from scratch, old compact macs can be a hassle. With any luck you'll find a decent seller who will do it all for you.
I know that you specified a compact mac, but I wonder whether an old mac like a IIcx might be sufficient for your needs. It is quite expandable, certainly more so than the compact macs and shouldn't cost as much. You won't get the cute little B&W mac, but the range of games will be greatly expanded. Much as I enjoyed playing Prince of Persia, for example, on an SE, I prefered it in color on the IIcx.
The IIcx is relatively inexpensive, partly because the IIci, is bigger brother, is so sought after. However, it just needs a half decent NuBus video card and a adaptor for a low-end LCD monitor. I'm not sure if it's possible to transfer files directly from your modern MBP to a IIcx via ethernet. If not, buy a USB zip drive and a SCSI zip drive, or a SCSI CD-ROM if you are able to burn CDs on your MBP.
It depends on the system you are on and the game you want to play. There were a lot of games for System 6 on B/W Macs even though color was out for the Mac II series. But the LCs ended all that with affordable color system, a larger RAM Footprint and faster CPU and many games went to the LCs (and consequently to the Mac II series).
Then System 7 came out adding system features to programs, and games slid into that too. It would be difficult to play Spectre VR Tank battle game on a SE/30 even if you had the larger RAM and System 7 but no color. Even if you can play Spectre VR on a Mac Plus, the 68K is too slow and no FPU to assist in drawing all those polygon shapes (Spectre VR is slow on a LC without a FPU compared to similarly configured Mac IIci with a FPU).
So all this has a lot of dependencies you need to think about: what system you want it on, what CPU (and FPU), color or B/W and how much RAM you would have. Things like I/O is secondary but really necessary, a hard drive is a must for games so that counts out the 128K and 512K\Ke series. I remember using 2 floppy drives to play games in the old days, and swapping a third disk back and forth on the second drive!
Then System 7 came out adding system features to programs, and games slid into that too. It would be difficult to play Spectre VR Tank battle game on a SE/30 even if you had the larger RAM and System 7 but no color. Even if you can play Spectre VR on a Mac Plus, the 68K is too slow and no FPU to assist in drawing all those polygon shapes (Spectre VR is slow on a LC without a FPU compared to similarly configured Mac IIci with a FPU).
So all this has a lot of dependencies you need to think about: what system you want it on, what CPU (and FPU), color or B/W and how much RAM you would have. Things like I/O is secondary but really necessary, a hard drive is a must for games so that counts out the 128K and 512K\Ke series. I remember using 2 floppy drives to play games in the old days, and swapping a third disk back and forth on the second drive!
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My Duo 280c does 640x480 at 256 color. The odd 400 resolution is only if I switch to higher color depth, not many 68k games will support higher color depth beyond 8 bits, and some games that doesn't complain about color often runs much slower so I leave mine at 640x480x8 permanently.
Hard drive is not a problem, there are CF and SD adapter that will fit the 2.5" connector.
RAM is the main problem. There are very few on eBay and good luck finding one bigger than 8MB to go with built in 4MB. I got lucky with mine long ago when I bought a non working "part" 280c to fix up mine.
Duo does support external keyboard and mouse with a mini dock or with an ADB port hack. But in the long run, a 550 or 575 would be better 68k color all-in-one. And SE/30 is probably the best B&W all in one.
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