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Apple Lisa disk images

Hello,

I am just wondering if anyone has 400k disk images for MacWorks plus, the original MacWorks, Lisa Guide and Lisa test.

I have tried the MacMorhership but I cannot get the images on there to work, unfortunately. (Must be doing something wrong)

I have got the Lisa workshop to work so I think the process is okay. 

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,

 
Sorry I should have been more precise:

Is it for Mac or Windows?

Where do I find it?

If disk copy doesn't work I can't imagine this will.

Please be mindful that I have never heard of this program so just saying "um...yeah" doesn't help me a great deal.

 
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Thanks for the helpful link, much appreciated.

I have now managed to find Lisa Guide but I couldn't find MacWorks or MacWorks plus and the Lisa Test.

I will have another look though just to confirm this.

Thanks again.

 
I've successfully made 400K Lisa floppies of MacWorks and Lisa Office using Disk Copy 4.2 on a vintage Mac. I've never used Dart. I believe the Mac needs to be one of the earliest compacts like a Mac Plus, and not a Mac II series, because Apple changed something in the floppy controller of later Macs that alters the floppy's sync bytes in a way that the Lisa doesn't like.

Here's a site with a Disk Copy 4.2 image of MacWorks: http://ruby.he.net/~sigma/mwplus2.htmlOffhand I don't recall where I found the DC42 images of Lisa Office, but I think it only took a brief Google search.

 
I have now managed to find Lisa Guide but I couldn't find MacWorks or MacWorks plus and the Lisa Test.
One word - mothership...

Or is that two?

Anyway... Google, apple lisa mothership - go to the utilities link...

 
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've successfully made 400K Lisa floppies of MacWorks and Lisa Office using Disk Copy 4.2 on a vintage Mac. I've never used Dart. I believe the Mac needs to be one of the earliest compacts like a Mac Plus, and not a Mac II series, because Apple changed something in the floppy controller of later Macs that alters the floppy's sync bytes in a way that the Lisa doesn't like.
I've made all my disks on a Powerbook 180 and they were all useable but yeah, I couldn't write disks on a Mainstreet Powerbook G3 and get the Lisa to read them.

Thanks for the helpful link, much appreciated.

I have now managed to find Lisa Guide but I couldn't find MacWorks or MacWorks plus and the Lisa Test.
Double check those four archives. I'm finding several copies of LisaTest in them and at least one copy of MacWorks.

 
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Yep you were right, I had another look and found the copies you mentioned. Although not sure if the MacWorks is version XL or the original so I'm going to have to test that one out.

As for Mac mothership as I said I've already tried it and cannot get the images to work.

As for the link from bigmessowires (thank you) that's for MacWorks plus II so I will need the programmable frequency generator to use that software won't I?

As for disks I managed to get disk images to work when being written by my Macintosh classic SuperDrive. If the image is valid it does work on my classic.

 
Here's a link to get DART: http://macgui.com/downloads/?file_id=21842

FWIW, I had no problem making Lisa disks on powermacs, but you must use Disk4.2 or DART.  It's the newer 6.x versions of disk copy don't correctly copy the Lisa tag bytes.

On a Powermac, at launch, DART will throw an error, but still works fine, this is a known issue documented by apple.

The best solution is to use the Lisa herself to make the disks using BLU ( http://sigmasevensystems.com/BLU ).  Much like ADT-Pro does for the Apple 2, BLU can be loaded from "cold metal".

Rick

 
I believe the problem with some newer Mac models is the number of sync bytes (bit-slip markers) at the start of each sector on the floppy. Newer Macs only write 3 sync bytes instead of 5, so the Lisa hardware can't reliably synchronize with the bitstream. That's a different issue than tag bytes and Disk Copy 6.x issues - though both questions are important for making a working Lisa floppy. But it sounds like the original poster is able to create working Lisa floppies without problems, and is mainly just looking for where to download the software he/she is interested in.

Here's a bit more about the 3 vs 5 sync bytes issue, from lisafaq.sunder.net/lisafaq-hw-media-floppy_dc42.html

Preferred hardware and software for making floppies compatible with the Lisa

For trouble-free results, use another Lisa or a Macintosh 128K, 512K, 512KE, or Plus for making disks for use in a Lisa.

Although newer Macintosh models may appear to make disks usable on a Lisa, there are circumstances where some data will not be readable by Lisa hardware. In these cases, using DiskCopy 4.2 to duplicate the disk onto itself is likely to make the disk usable on a Lisa.

If you must use a Macintosh II or later, use:

  • an 800K drive (instead of the 1.4M High Density SuperDrive)
  • DiskCopy 4.2
  • If the image is in DART format, make the disk with DART, then use DiskCopy 4.2 to duplicate the disk onto itself (this corrects the disk to have 5 bit-slip-FF's as required for the Lisa hardware)
To check whether a disk made in another machine is readable on a particular Lisa, mount the disk using FEdit Plus on the Lisa running under some (any) version of MacWorks and have it read every sector (eg. by searching for something, or put a weight on the mouse button). An I/O Error indicates some sector could not be read.

Technical Explanation: The Lisa floppy disk controller (FDC) anticipates 5 bytes of "bit-slip-FF" to synchronize its state machine to an address mark or data mark. The Macintosh FDC was improved to need only 3 bytes of bit-slip-FF, however use of this improvement was only implemented in the Macintosh II ROM and later.

The result is that some sectors of a disk written by a Mac II or later may not be readable by a stock Lisa FDC. This includes disks initialized on such a machine, as well as any file/directory data written on such a machine.

The rare exception is DiskCopy 4.2 which bypasses the floppy driver and accesses the floppy hardware directly. It happens that DiskCopy 4.2 writes 5 bit-slip-FF's even on hardware as recent as the beige G3 desktop, and regardless of whether the source disk/image used 3 or 5 bit-slip-FF's.

The number of bit-slip-FF bytes on a particular floppy can be determined using a PC with the Central Point "Deluxe Option Board", which has the capability of reading individual magnetic transitions on a disk.

For further information about bit-slip-FF bytes and the GCR encoding of Apple floppies of this era, see the Apple II book "Beneath Apple DOS".

MacWorks Plus II includes a Programmable Frequency Generator (PFG) that provides real-time adjustment of the FDC timing under software control, enabling MacWorks Plus II to read almost all Macintosh disks written with 3 bytes of bit-slip-FF.

 
Great, thank you. Unfortunately I cannot get any of the images to work. I think it is due to the fact that I have to decompress the zip files and the Lisa doesn't like that. If I try and decompress the zip files on a power Mac then the disk image will mount using disk copy 4.2 but if I decompress them on the original Mac mini they are not 'seen' by disk copy? Does anyone have any ways to get round this? The obvious one is to get a unzip tool on my power Mac, but everytime I use my tool that I already have on there I get an error code thrown at me (error 39, I think.)

Edit: also is there a way I can compress the files to have the extensions .sit files? That's how I got all of the Lisa pascal disk images to work as they had that extension and so could be expanded on a power Mac using StuffIt. My older generation Mac's can't handle zip folders.

 
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You create .sit files using DropStuff. Almost any of the old Stuffit installer packages included it. I have also never opened ZIP files on a mac with anything but unRAR or something similar and even then I swear by using Stuffit as it has a very long history of support on the mac.

 
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Disk Copy 4.2 files don't have a resource fork (unlike 6.3 files), so they can be safely stored in a zip file without a problem. Make sure the disks you are using aren't bad. I have plenty of DD and HD 3.5" disks here that never seem to work correctly with Disk Copy since the program is very sensitive to bad sectors. Always run a verification pass after copying the image too.

 
Hello everyone,

Unfortunately I still can't get any of the disk images to work. I have tried DART and Disk copy 4.2 with no luck. I am certain it is to do with the fact that the files are in the ZIP format. I cannot download Stuffit as it isn't compatible with OS X which is the highest OS the original Mac mini can take. 

Im sure that if I can format the files into SIT files then I will be able to get the images to mount correctly when using Disk copy 4.2

Thanks,

 
Unfortunately I still can't get any of the disk images to work.
What exactly is going wrong, at what point in the process? You made floppies, but the Lisa wouldn't read them? Or something else?

So you have a Macintosh Classic, and a Mac Mini running OSX, right? How are you transferring files between the two? You mentioned you'd already made some Lisa floppies successfully with the Classic, so I assume you've got some path for downloading files from the internet to the Mac Mini, than transferring them over to the classic.

What software do you already have on the Classic? Do you have ResEdit, or a utility called SetFType, or StuffIt (any version)? 

What you probably need to do is download files from the internet to you Mac Mini, and unzip them there. I'm guessing that inside of the zip file, you'll find a .sit file, or a .image disk image file. Transfer these to your Classic.

This transfer process will have lost the Macintosh type and creator IDs from the files, so tools like Disk Copy may not recognize them. You can use ResEdit or SetFType on the Classic to set the type and creator IDs of each file to the appropriate values, then you should be able to view and open them in the other utility programs. I think StuffIt may also have a way to force it to show *all* files when you're browsing for a .sit file to open: a checkbox in the file dialog maybe, or hold down the shift key, or something like that.

StuffIt archive files should have a creator of "SIT!" and type of "SIT!", "SITD", or "SIT5" depending on what version of StuffIt was originally used

Disk Copy 4.2 image files should have a creator of "dCpy" and type of "dImg"

 
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