Best QS G4 AGP card?

[LaPorta]

What was the top-of-the-line card that would work in a Quicksilver that had the ADC port?

 

[volvo242gt]

Do you need OS 9 acceleration? Then, a Radeon 9000 is going to be your best bet. If only OS X acceleration is needed, then one of the more modern cards used in the FW800 MDD and G5 series Macs would work, provided an external power source is used for the card (as in connecting it to the power supply directly).

 

[demik]

What @volvo242gt said

Using a Radeon 9000 from a MDD on a QS for MacOS 9. Maybe a 8500.

For OS X, flashed 9800 Pro are kinda doable, or X series but they have become unobtanium. Or the Nvidia era equivalents like a 4MX ori you can find it a 6800

 

[ArmorAlley]

Is Mac OS 9 important?
The nVidia GeForce Ti 4600 is often given as the best AGP card that supports Mac OS 9 [1].
The ATi Radeon 9000 is, by no means, a bad card [2]. It also supports Mac OS 9.

The last AGP cards with an ADC port to come with an G5 was either the Radeon 9600 XT [3] or the nVidia GeForce FX 5200 Ultra [4].
There may have been later/other cards with an ADC port but I am not aware of them.
These cards should work in a Quicksilver (basic 2D support in Mac OS 9 only) and 3D support in Mac OS X. The QS has a 4x AGP-slot and these are AGP 8x cards.

ADC is an abomination that should never have happened.

[0] List of ATi graphics processing units: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_AMD_graphics_processing_units
List of NVIDIA graphics processing units:

List of Nvidia graphics processing units - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GeForce_4_series
[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radeon_R200_series
[3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radeon_R300_series
[4] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GeForce_FX_series

 

[Phipli]

I think the ADC power pins moved between eras, so I'm not sure that a G5 card would work in an older G4 out the box. Not sure of the details, but something to check up on. I think the transition aligns with the move from 2x to 4x AGP, or is it 4x and 8x?

Not my era of machines, I've never run one regularly.

 

[LaPorta]

Seeing how varied the responses are, I’ll refine things: I’ve got a Radeon 9000 currently with 64 MB. Playing Halo isn’t exactly the speediest. I was seeing if there was maybe a 128 version or something to help out. I’d rather not get the cards that I have to modify or anything like that…though “getting separate power” could be ok.

 

[Phipli]

Seeing how varied the responses are, I’ll refine things: I’ve got a Radeon 9000 currently with 64 MB. Playing Halo isn’t exactly the speediest. I was seeing if there was maybe a 128 version or something to help out. I’d rather not get the cards that I have to modify or anything like that…though “getting separate power” could be ok.

What speed processor do you have? Halo ran OK on my 1.25GHz G4 Mac Mini, which has a Radeon 9200 (similar performance to the 9000).

The 9000 should have enough grunt, perhaps it is CPU that you're running low on?

128MB wouldn't speed up performance and 32MB VRAM was enough to run Halo.

Have you tried reducing the resolution?

 

[CircuitBored]

My two cents: The GeForce 4 Ti 4600 is the best QS graphics card by a long way. Back when these cards were all as cheap as chips, I spent the better part of five years hoarding G4 graphics cards and trying to find "the one" that performed well in both OSX and 9 while also having an ADC port. I found ATI cards to be generally more troublesome in OS 9 than their Nvidia counterparts. Oftentimes they would work "fine" but I'd run into odd issues with textures in 3D applications and random "Type #" errors on the desktop. I was told at the time that it was "drivers" to blame but mucking about with ATI extensions in 9 is an exercise in frustration. The Ti 4600 offers flawless performance and reliability, with the caveat of one particularly bad (and loud) heatsink/fan combo. With proper cooling, the Ti 4600 is the king of the hill in my eyes. Its little sister, the GeForce 3 Ti 500 is also a great card.

Sadly the cat is out of the bag and the older Ti cards for Mac now demand stupid prices on eBay. You can still snag good deals from time to time though, if you're willing to be patient.

ADC is an abomination that should never have happened.

I don't think it's fair to call it an abomination. It was a good idea in principle but it flopped because it was ultra-proprietary. People without ADC monitors were essentially downgraded to a single DVI port and people who wanted two ADC monitors had to buy a pricey DVI-ADC adapter. It was a motorcycle and sidecar; the worst of both worlds for everyone involved. On a technological level, ADC is fantastic. It's just a shame that the G4s that used it were plagued by power supply issues. Had Apple opened up the ADC standard I think it would be looked back on more fondly.

I think the ADC power pins moved between eras, so I'm not sure that a G5 card would work in an older G4 out the box. Not sure of the details, but something to check up on. I think the transition aligns with the move from 2x to 4x AGP, or is it 4x and 8x?

Not my era of machines, I've never run one regularly.

The G5s have an AGP "Pro" 8x slot that is not pin-compatible with the G4's AGP 4x. If I recall correctly, you can use unmodified G4 cards in a G5 but in order to use an OEM G5 graphics card in a G4 you have to tape over/cut pins 3 and 11. I think the Sawtooth was the exception and can use unmodified G5 cards, however it's only a 2x slot so performance will be significantly hampered.

 

[Phipli]

Halo system specs as follows, note your existing video card is already the 'recommended', not the minimum. How do the rest of your specs compare?

 

[LaPorta]

It runs ok, reducing the resolution is probably the best I can do, I was just seeing what else maybe could help. It’s a dual 1 GHz QuickSilver, 1 GB RAM. Also, I forgot to mention earlier, OS 9 isn’t important - only games I’d be playing are on X. I guess if I really want a bang-up Halo experience, I should set up my dads G5 .

I appreciate all the info thus far, I didn’t have any concept of graphics around this era.

 

[Phipli]

It runs ok, reducing the resolution is probably the best I can do, I was just seeing what else maybe could help. It’s a dual 1 GHz QuickSilver, 1 GB RAM. Also, I forgot to mention earlier, OS 9 isn’t important - only games I’d be playing are on X. I guess if I really want a bang-up Halo experience, I should set up my dads G5 .

I appreciate all the info thus far, I didn’t have any concept of graphics around this era.

If you just want OSX and want to use the G4, then a 1.6GHz upgrade and a Radeon 9800 Pro (G4 version) might sort your issue

Don't pay this much (this is likely a dual DVI version, but probably worth the sacrifice of losing ADC if you found the same card for $100, or whatever you're willing to pay)

Apple Mac Edition ATI Radeon 9800 Pro AGP Video Graphics Card In Retail Box NEW | eBay

Since grading is so subjective we do not get into this matter. Only what is pictured is included (or specifically stated above).

www.ebay.com

 

[herd]

The best GPUs for a Quicksilver would be one of the re-flashed cards like the FireGL X3, x800, x850, 7800, etc. And if you need ADC, there are adapters.

Fastest Graphics Cards for G4 Power Macs?

real world speed test results for performance minded Macintosh users

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ATI FireGL X3 modified to run on a G4 Power Mac

real world speed test results for performance minded Macintosh users

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'Mutant' Graphics Card Upgrades for G4 Power Macs

real world speed test results for performance minded Macintosh users

barefeats.com

 

[LaPorta]

I suppose I don’t “need” ADC, it’s just convenient since I have cinema displays. On the flip side, two of them have the adapters as well so I could use regular DVI.

 

[Phipli]

I suppose I don’t “need” ADC, it’s just convenient since I have cinema displays. On the flip side, two of them have the adapters as well so I could use regular DVI.

The cheap cards at the moment seem to be the Radeon 9600s. They're about 30% faster than your 9000 in PC fill rate tests (not an ideal comparison, but it should be vaguely representative). But only half the speed of a 9800. The main advantage is you can find them for less than $30. Perhaps worth it as a backup card anyway.

For your G4, you either want a dual DVI 8x one, or a 4x one with ADC? I think.

I have some of the G5 style ones (8x??) that I plan to do the resistor mod on to get working in a G4 if I need to. A G4 style one would work straight with no mods.

 

[volvo242gt]

My nVidia experience with pre-2009 hardware hasn't been that great. My original G4 DA 533 had a nVidia card in it that died spectacularly within a month of purchase in 2009. Wound up picking up my second G4 DA (a 466), which had an ATi Rage 128 Pro in it. Took the hard drive from the 533, along with the processor, and swapped them over, since the 466 had a nicer case anyway. That machine's card lasted me another 4 years before I installed a Radeon 9700 that was reflashed, and then a 9800 Pro.

Non-Mac, had two Dell notebooks that killed off their nVidia chips (an Inspiron 8600 with a GeForce 5200 and a Latitude D830 with a Quadro 140M). All the ATi equipped machines were fine, along with those running the intel integrated graphics chip. With my last two MBPs, both seem to have been fairly reliable. The nVidia chipped mid-2010 machine tended to run much hotter than the current Radeon 6770 chipped late-2011 machine. Eventually, I do expect the chip to fail on said computer.

 

[ObeyDaleks]

I believe the 7800 GS is supposed to be the “best”, but I tried one (flashed it myself) and it was so hot and noisy, I went back to my trusty 9800 Pro. I use it with the OG 23” Cinema Display using the ADC converter brick. 9800 Pro will be a huge upgrade from your 9000. Halo runs like butter with it.

 

[Unknown_K]

I have a modded 7800 GS in my G5 single 1.6ghz tower and didn't know they ran hot (haven't used it in a long time).

ATI 9000's are my go to for G4 towers since they work great in OS 9 and OSX plus they were easy to find and cheap (or were at the time). I do have an Apple ADC LCD monitor I use sometimes.

I stuck a 9600 from a G5 into a MDD model after cutting a trace (easy enough to solder fill if needed) so it ran in AGP 4x mode. That is an OSX only machine. The connector for the ADC is in different places on G4 and G5 machines and don't interfere with each other.

The Mac edition 9800 Pro is an AGP Pro card that gets power from the extra slots and is meant for G5 AGP towers and won't work in a G4. You can mod a PC 9800 but good luck finding a working unit that doesn't cost a bunch since PC gamers lust after them.




https://www.techpowerup.com/gpu-specs/radeon-9800-pro-mac-edition.c2233#gallery-1

 

[Phipli]

The Mac edition 9800 Pro is an AGP Pro card that gets power from the extra slots and is meant for G5 AGP towers and won't work in a G4.

I think there is more than one version. The one I linked says AGP 2x / 4x in the box, and the one I own is from a G4 (genuine Mac card, bought as an upgrade).

 

[LaPorta]

So Mac 9800 Pro…guess I better look for gold falling from the sky!

 

[ObeyDaleks]

The Mac edition 9800 Pro is an AGP Pro card that gets power from the extra slots and is meant for G5 AGP towers and won't work in a G4. You can mod a PC 9800 but good luck finding a working unit that doesn't cost a bunch since PC gamers lust after them.

Hmm I didn’t know that. Mine is a flashed PC version and it is rock solid in my MDD.