630 in 52xx

[supernova777]

[mod note]

This topic was created by splitting from the original thread.

[/mod]

Another idea would be a Quadra 630. It's easy to find IDE drives or to get a 2.5" SATA with an IDE-SATA adapter. Depending on the version of the motherboard, you can have up to 196 megs of memory, plus you can have a CommSlot ethernet and/or an LC/PDS ethernet.

i was thinking this aswell.. because i have a performa5200CD and the motherboard can slide into this and make it a 68K Mac.. that has a color screen!!!!! and the hd already has os 7.6.1 on it

aswell as a scsi cdrom.. 

196MB of RAM? i had no idea the quadra 630 could take so much RAM? are u sure?  

because everymac's page says 36MB...

http://www.everymac.com/systems/apple/mac_quadra/specs/mac_quadra_630.html

 

[IPalindromeI]

I'm pretty sure you can't put a 6xx board into a 5xx chassis. They lack the edge connector.

 

[johnklos]

i was thinking this aswell.. because i have a performa5200CD and the motherboard can slide into this and make it a 68K Mac.. that has a color screen!!!!! and the hd already has os 7.6.1 on it

aswell as a scsi cdrom.. 

196MB of RAM? i had no idea the quadra 630 could take so much RAM? are u sure?  

because everymac's page says 36MB...

http://www.everymac.com/systems/apple/mac_quadra/specs/mac_quadra_630.html

The 36 meg limit was never real. Everymac should know better.

Perhaps it was the Performa 630 motherboard, but one of them has two SIMM slots. With a single slot, the Quadra / Performa 630 can take 128 megs plus the four onboard for 132 megs. With two slots, the second can only see up to 64 megs, so it's 192 plus the four onboard.

The PowerPC machines can't directly take m68k motherboards because the PowerPC machines use one of the power pins for 3.3 volts. You'd short that to 5 volts if you put in an m68k motherboard. I've adapted a Performa 6400 to run in a Quadra 630 case by breaking off the pin on the motherboard, then adding my own 3.3 volt regulator.

Here's a picture of a Quadra 630 motherboard with a 128 meg SIMM and a NewerTech Quadra Overdrive:

http://www.klos.com/~john/q630_batteries.png

 

[Bunsen]

I'm pretty sure you can't put a 6xx board into a 5xx chassis. They lack the edge connector.

.

"6xx" and "5xx" both include a number of different machines.  Some slightly, and some vastly different (605 for instance is not an edge connector machine at all).

The 630 board is the same format as the 580, 5200 series, 5400 and 5500.  The 575 is different. 

The Takky mods for Colour Classic, for instance, once the internal modification is all done, you can use any board from a 630, 580, 5xxx, or 6xxx (four digit).

 

[Bunsen]

The 36 meg limit was never real. Everymac should know better.

.

It was real-ish when those were the largest sticks you could buy. I agree though that Everymac should know better by now: they list the "unofficial" but known-good maximums on newer machines.

Perhaps it was the Performa 630 motherboard, but one of them has two SIMM slots.

.

630DOS and 640, I believe.

The PowerPC machines can't directly take m68k motherboards because the PowerPC machines use one of the power pins for 3.3 volts. You'd short that to 5 volts if you put in an m68k motherboard.

.

Oh, that's good to know.  Thanks.

I've adapted a Performa 6400 to run in a Quadra 630 case by breaking off the pin on the motherboard, then adding my own 3.3 volt regulator.

.

Isn't that the reverse of what you were just describing though?  That's a PPC logic in a 68k case.

 

[johnklos]

Isn't that the reverse of what you were just describing though?  That's a PPC logic in a 68k case.

I was just illustrating that the power supply connections were different.

 

[supernova777]

The PowerPC machines can't directly take m68k motherboards because the PowerPC machines use one of the power pins for 3.3 volts. You'd short that to 5 volts if you put in an m68k motherboard. I've adapted a Performa 6400 to run in a Quadra 630 case by breaking off the pin on the motherboard, then adding my own 3.3 volt regulator.

so.. i cant order a quadra 630 motherboard and swap it into my performa 5200CD all-in-one unit without modifying the power supply..

well. im not technically able to do stuff like that myself so.. there goes that plan out the window ;(

thanks i was just about to order it too.. and i would have probably blown up both the motherboard + the case.

the article i metioned in my other thread made no mention of having to modify the power supply..

im really kind of pissed now i spent the last few days looking into the details of this.. what a waste of time

 

[supernova777]

i had just watched all these videos on how horrible the performa 5200CD was -- because it had a weak 75Mhz PowerPC chip running in 32bit mode, when its a 64bit chip. and performing miserably at the task of having to emulate alot of 68k code at the time of its release .. all the software was still for 68k which is why the 5200CD is revered as the worst mac ever... and that the 68k code runs much better on a native 68k cpu. which is why i wanted to get a quadra 630 board and throw it in there.. and have it become a 33mhz 68040 cpu powered mac. it seemed like the perfect fix for my situation given what i have available to me.. and i already have the 5200CD installed with a sata3 HDD + SATA to IDE adapter.

now johnklos has dropped the bomb and said that this isnt possible and that the psu doesnt  match the board.. 

so im not sure what to believe now because i read in multiple places from multiple people that it is compatible and noone mentioned any difference in power supply voltages.

i was just about to order the quadra 630 motherboard for cheap along with a PDS network card.. and i would have been SORTED.

can anyone help me confirm if this *IS* or *ISNT* possible?????

i am NOT wanting to pay someone else to mod the power supply for me. im not an electrician or soldering DIY type of guy.. i just want to run old music sequencers that were written for the 68k cpu.

Johnklos:

i just re-read what u wrote above... and i saw u mentioned the 6400.. I dont have a 6400. I have a 5200CD. I might have mentioned the 6400 briefly when talking about wanting to UPgrade the 5200CD.. but im more interested in DOWNgrading it.. to achieve better compatibility with older software.. I have plenty of G3/G4 Machines.. but no 68k's. I can use my G3 450mhz + G4 1.25Ghz + 933Mhz machines for any powerpc applications on os9.22 - i dont really want to use the 600 series powerpc chips. Im interested in experiencing the 68030 + 68040 cpus with the early to mid 90s midi sequencing applications such as Vision, Performer, Cubase, Logic, Master Tracks Pro etc etc and they were all written for the 68k cpu originally. 

can u please clarify if im able to go ahead with downgrading the 5200CD with a Quadra 630 logic board without any voltage differences? 

 

[supernova777]

ok ive just re-read what he wrote.. and that totally confused me.. *** I DONT HAVE A QUADRA 630 CASE*** AND I DONT HAVE A PERFORMA 6400 MOTHERBOARD EITHER!! *** so im in the clear right??

wow that really confused me.....

 

[johnklos]

If you get a Quadra 630 motherboard, you can break off the pin that corresponds to the 3.3 volt pin on PowerPC systems. This might help:

http://homepage2.nifty.com/frogeye/connector.html

 

[supernova777]

another reason for me wanting to downgrade it is that i saw on a video on youtube that the serial ports on the 5200CD were not able to do proper hardware handshaking so they didnt have the best modem/serial performance which is important to me for using it with my multiport midi interface that uses both the printer + modem ports simultaneously

 

[supernova777]

If you get a Quadra 630 motherboard, you can break off the pin that corresponds to the 3.3 volt pin on PowerPC systems. This might help:

http://homepage2.nifty.com/frogeye/connector.html

is this absolutely neccessary? what would happen if i dont? (im not great at DIY and i would most likely screw it up)

just to be sure..

im looking to put a quadra 630 motherboard into >>> 5200CD all in one 

the other articles that mentioned this was possible never mentioned anything about breaking pins + modding anything

 

[supernova777]

johnklos: are u sure u arent getting confused between the PCI based performas..?? (5400, 6x00 series)???

this one has 1 PDS slot.. just like the quadra 630.. from the articles + videos that i watched.. it basically claimed that the 5200cd *IS* a quadra 630 modified to take a powerpc 603 cpu...

 

[supernova777]

aplmak: 
thats exactly why i want to swap the motherboard out for a different one. i understand everything ive read about why it was perceived to be such a dog at the time.. underpowered cpu with no cache running emulation of software that was designed for a different cpu.. makes sense. but i actually like the design of the unit cosmeticlaly its pretty neat..  thats why i think it would be cool to use it as a 68k mac.
 
im just waiting to hear confirmation from someone that i can swap in a quadra 630 into it and im ready to pull the trigger.
johnklos seems to think that its not 100% compatible voltage wise. (https://68kmla.org/forums/index.php?/topic/26658-looking-to-buy-a-68k-mac-anyone-have-any-quick-tips-for-me/?p=284204)

 

[supernova777]

i had the perfect plan untill johnklos said it wouldnt work.. and hes only given 1 sentence replies that arent really helping me to clarify whether or not i can do what i wanted to do.. (swapping the 5200CD's motherboard for a 68k powered quadra 630) 

can someone please help me get confirmation on this?

like i said i was about to buy the board.. and have it shipped to me and then johnklos made the comment that some type of power connector modification was neccessary. hes the only one who has said this..  can i get a second opinion from someone else ? anyone have experience?

 

[uniserver]

the 5200 has a crappy monitor.  and bad plastics.

and not to mention what you want to do wont work as the edge connector is not compatible.

at least the 520 550 575 had that nice Sony Trinatron .28 dp tube.

 

[supernova777]

 your points about the plastics + monitor seem to be the general consensus .. absolutely.
but re: the connector being incompatible -- the evidence points to you being incorrect 

here is yet ANOTHER article indicating that they are interchangable, but it again is talking about the opposite of what i want to do, which is taking the performa 5200CD board into a quadra 630 housing...

another case of it being claimed that the performa IS a quadra 630 basically.. with a 'hacked into place' powerpc upgrade

Converting a Quadra 630 into a Power Mac 5200

http://lowendmac.com/lab/app2.html

ll, it occurred to me that since I had several dead 5200s sitting around - victims of a power surge - I might try sticking a 5200 motherboard in the 630's case and see if it would work.

Here are the two motherboards, side by side:

As you can see the internal socket that seats the motherboard and provides the nice drawer-style access is identical. So, in a nutshell, I inserted the motherboard - and it worked!

 

[supernova777]

 

[uniserver]

I guess your evidence has pointed to me being incorrect  but then again just because a DB15 is physically the same for Mac Video Connection and DVI networking ports etc... doesn't mean its gonna work.

I don't even think the 5200 has the 3.3v rail, that wasn't till the 5400 series... but evidence might also make me incorrect on that as well.

have you seen this:

http://lowendmac.com/myturn/2k1213.html

If i had a 630 and a 5200 sitting next to each other i could slam the 630 into the 5200, turn it on and see what happens for you.

I could very well take the 5260 from the shed, bring it to my office and slide in a 630 into it and put all this to rest for you.

Even if the magic smoke rose from these i probably would be more concerned with setting off the smoke alarm then i would either of those machines.

but on the flip side, i think you may be onto something, by taking 2 valueless machines and making something that might be kind of cool man. So i think you do deserve your credit with this idea.