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System 6-based novel writing software
- Thread starter LaPorta
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Maybe a combination of HyperCard (I bet there is an actual novel-writing stack available in archives out there somewhere / MORE for outlining, flowcharts and such / and Word 5.1 or similar for actual text? FileMaker could be harnessed for a novel's purposes as well, e.g., character, characteristics, appearances in the plot, whatever, via a custom database.
I know an established academic writer who used to write in either the Acta or MORE outliner exclusively, I forget which, back in the late 80s, and who swore by it. I like MORE better, as it is so much like OmniOutliner, and as a MORE file can be imported into OmniOutliner, or at least, it could back in OO3 days. From there it can be gotten into current Word file format, with a little handwringing.
For outlining/ writing, FullWrite might also be worth a look, though I am not sure how translatable the file format would be. I gather it was what Douglas Adams used. See http://www.atpm.com/10.03/atpo.shtml on outliners.
I am not aware of an actual novel writing software package that existed as a standalone, but others may be able to help you better than me.
I know an established academic writer who used to write in either the Acta or MORE outliner exclusively, I forget which, back in the late 80s, and who swore by it. I like MORE better, as it is so much like OmniOutliner, and as a MORE file can be imported into OmniOutliner, or at least, it could back in OO3 days. From there it can be gotten into current Word file format, with a little handwringing.
For outlining/ writing, FullWrite might also be worth a look, though I am not sure how translatable the file format would be. I gather it was what Douglas Adams used. See http://www.atpm.com/10.03/atpo.shtml on outliners.
I am not aware of an actual novel writing software package that existed as a standalone, but others may be able to help you better than me.
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What features are you looking for? I've written three novels in Pages '09 and that's just using the basic word processor functions.
FullWrite would probably do the job, but as beachycove mentioned getting it from FullWrite into a modern word processor later on may be an issue. I have not yet found a way to get something out of FullWrite and into Pages or any other modern (or old) word processor.
WriteNow may be a better option. WriteNow 4 will run on System 6 and can export to RTF. The downside is that you cannot go direct from the RTF into Pages because some characters will not translate properly. It was suggested to me in another thread here (and I have not tried it yet) that using Microsoft Word or the Data-something translation software (can't recall the name) on a System 9 system may do the trick. I'm pretty sure I've done it by importing a RTF file into PageMaker and then opening that PageMaker file in InDesign to access the text and characters are translated properly, so the RTF to classic Word to modern software might work as well.
WriteNow 3 would probably work as well, but I have not tested it at all.
FullWrite would probably do the job, but as beachycove mentioned getting it from FullWrite into a modern word processor later on may be an issue. I have not yet found a way to get something out of FullWrite and into Pages or any other modern (or old) word processor.
WriteNow may be a better option. WriteNow 4 will run on System 6 and can export to RTF. The downside is that you cannot go direct from the RTF into Pages because some characters will not translate properly. It was suggested to me in another thread here (and I have not tried it yet) that using Microsoft Word or the Data-something translation software (can't recall the name) on a System 9 system may do the trick. I'm pretty sure I've done it by importing a RTF file into PageMaker and then opening that PageMaker file in InDesign to access the text and characters are translated properly, so the RTF to classic Word to modern software might work as well.
WriteNow 3 would probably work as well, but I have not tested it at all.
Just casually, I've done some long-ish form fiction writing in MacWrite Pro 1.5v3 on my various older Macs. That's actually 7-era software, but.
Word 5 would be good to look at. Nisus Writer might be that much better, depending on what you can find for system 6, because if I recall correctly, its file format is basically plain text plus markup.
You could, of course, also just use a plain text editor such as BBEdit, and depending on what's there, an HTML editor would also work. (I had to copy/paste my work in MWP to Claris HomePage as the easiest way to move the text to a modern machine.)
Word 5 would be good to look at. Nisus Writer might be that much better, depending on what you can find for system 6, because if I recall correctly, its file format is basically plain text plus markup.
You could, of course, also just use a plain text editor such as BBEdit, and depending on what's there, an HTML editor would also work. (I had to copy/paste my work in MWP to Claris HomePage as the easiest way to move the text to a modern machine.)
I gave up somewhat on Pages since '09 was replaced with the iOS-derived Pages on the Mac App Store, which has its own problems ingesting documents from Pages '09 and earlier. All docs there seem to be stuck in an island. It's a shame because the original Pages was one of the nicest, easiest to use page layout and word processing apps I've used of late.
Since you mention the problem is with translating characters, I wonder if this is a problem going from the Mac ASCII-derived text encoding to modern platforms with some imperfect superset of ASCII (Windows-1252 usually) or a Unicode derivative. I know DataViz made several translators way back in the day like Connections Pro and perhaps more relevant, MacLinkPlus Deluxe for Mac OS. They were lossy converters, but RTF is standard enough that there should be something to go back and forth between early Mac RTF and TextEdit's RTFD or something roughly equivalent.
EDIT: FrameMaker is also fantastic, though I remember it being sluggish on 68k platforms. Desktop publishing software didn't really allow for near real time editing until the PPC 601 era of Macs. Up until then there were many modal windows and parameter changes without snappy, easy to find previews.
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Thank you everyone for your suggestions. Coincidentally, I have a few of these programs. I think that the owner of one of my Macs from back when was a writer, as there were multiple such programs on it.
I was wondering if there was a full-blown program that helped you keep track of characters, storylines, subplots, etc...but perhaps that is too much to ask.
I was wondering if there was a full-blown program that helped you keep track of characters, storylines, subplots, etc...but perhaps that is too much to ask.
I mentioned HyperCard, and came across this: https://archive.org/details/hypercard_writing-with-hypercard . Also, the Dock Hypercard stack would be interesting to adapt to your needs. I uploaded it to one of the archives a few years ago, so it should be out there. Very interesting piece of HyperCard software.
HyperCard would be an interesting one. Is the linked stack an actual tool or just a presentation/essay with ideas on howyou might use HyperCard for it? (I forgot to hit post here, but it gave me time to just go try it, the stack is just an essay, but with HyperText added. If you click a link in the text it plays a noise and displays an illustration to the left.)
When I was noveling on my 1400, 6100, and 180 in 2016 (or 2017? I need to go back and figure out which) what I ended up doing was having a separate notes file. I mostly pantsed the actual plot, save for a pitch I'd put together as a part of another project, so I had a copy of the pitch, a record of what happened in short/summary form, then character and location names I'd used.
Either a single app that can have multiple documents open or a single app whose documents can be relatively large would probably be the easiest way to do that. I don't happen to know of any other structured info-bases specifically for fiction of novel writing, the way you'd use, say, Scrivener on a modern computer.
If you have a suitable system 7 machine, you might combine an outliner with a word processor, and just consider location and character notes to be part of their own top-level outline at the start or end of your plot notes. I tried this, Claris Impact, which works on 68k but is fairly heavy. (So, Impact and MacWrite Pro and Resolve wouldn't really run at the same time on, say, the PB180).
I ended up reverting to a single MacWrite Pro doc, a simpletext notes file, and both a simpletext word count record and a Resolve file to be updated primarily on the higher end computers (anything with enough RAM to have MWP, SimpleText and Resolve open at once.)
I said it before and I'll say it again: I heavily recommend against writing a novel in Frame/FrameMaker. That's probably even more inappropriate a tool for fiction writing (I'll argue: for writing copy in general) as just writing a story directly into XPress or PageMaker/inDesign. If you have enough RAM to do that, you probably have enough RAM to run System 7 and MWP+simpletext or Impact.
The other-other option is to just use the Mac for your text processing for the novel itself and use an ipad or a paper notebook for the other notes. As a NaNo thing this year I gave my wrimos little gift packs that had 100-packs of index cards in a little zip-closed bag, a pen and a sticker, the intent being that you might write notes about particular things on the cards and either post them on a wall/board or keep them with them in the pouch. (It's a technique I've been meaning to try, but I always design myself out of wall space in any home I have instantly.)
When I was noveling on my 1400, 6100, and 180 in 2016 (or 2017? I need to go back and figure out which) what I ended up doing was having a separate notes file. I mostly pantsed the actual plot, save for a pitch I'd put together as a part of another project, so I had a copy of the pitch, a record of what happened in short/summary form, then character and location names I'd used.
Either a single app that can have multiple documents open or a single app whose documents can be relatively large would probably be the easiest way to do that. I don't happen to know of any other structured info-bases specifically for fiction of novel writing, the way you'd use, say, Scrivener on a modern computer.
If you have a suitable system 7 machine, you might combine an outliner with a word processor, and just consider location and character notes to be part of their own top-level outline at the start or end of your plot notes. I tried this, Claris Impact, which works on 68k but is fairly heavy. (So, Impact and MacWrite Pro and Resolve wouldn't really run at the same time on, say, the PB180).
I ended up reverting to a single MacWrite Pro doc, a simpletext notes file, and both a simpletext word count record and a Resolve file to be updated primarily on the higher end computers (anything with enough RAM to have MWP, SimpleText and Resolve open at once.)
I said it before and I'll say it again: I heavily recommend against writing a novel in Frame/FrameMaker. That's probably even more inappropriate a tool for fiction writing (I'll argue: for writing copy in general) as just writing a story directly into XPress or PageMaker/inDesign. If you have enough RAM to do that, you probably have enough RAM to run System 7 and MWP+simpletext or Impact.
The other-other option is to just use the Mac for your text processing for the novel itself and use an ipad or a paper notebook for the other notes. As a NaNo thing this year I gave my wrimos little gift packs that had 100-packs of index cards in a little zip-closed bag, a pen and a sticker, the intent being that you might write notes about particular things on the cards and either post them on a wall/board or keep them with them in the pouch. (It's a technique I've been meaning to try, but I always design myself out of wall space in any home I have instantly.)
Reading through this essay: This is how I use OneNote.
The proposed format is a stack that has a text field for a title or summary and then a larger text field for body text. It looks like, optionally, a date field. You could actually do that in Claris Organizer or Palm Desktop, as well, but you'd use categories to differentiate between different types of notes. (I also do this in Outlook on Windows PCs, alternatively in the Notes and the Journal areas.)
The overall point of the article is in part that keeping an overall writing notebook or set of notebooks that are searchable and sortable is a good way to find information later on when you might not know you need it, so it's more "as a writer your Mac has the power to be the all-encompassing database of your entire life and here's how I did it in HyperCard."
There are squillions of modern PIM and note-taking products, many aimed explicitly at being these sort of universal digital junk drawers, and at least as many aimed at being project-based tools for writers. Unfortunately, these things probably started to exist on their own in the system 7 era, but even something as simple as the Notepad desk accessory would be a good starting point, especially for a single or smaller project.
The proposed format is a stack that has a text field for a title or summary and then a larger text field for body text. It looks like, optionally, a date field. You could actually do that in Claris Organizer or Palm Desktop, as well, but you'd use categories to differentiate between different types of notes. (I also do this in Outlook on Windows PCs, alternatively in the Notes and the Journal areas.)
The overall point of the article is in part that keeping an overall writing notebook or set of notebooks that are searchable and sortable is a good way to find information later on when you might not know you need it, so it's more "as a writer your Mac has the power to be the all-encompassing database of your entire life and here's how I did it in HyperCard."
There are squillions of modern PIM and note-taking products, many aimed explicitly at being these sort of universal digital junk drawers, and at least as many aimed at being project-based tools for writers. Unfortunately, these things probably started to exist on their own in the system 7 era, but even something as simple as the Notepad desk accessory would be a good starting point, especially for a single or smaller project.
I still use Pages '09. I haven't had a problem going back and forth with Pages on my iPad, but my iPad is still iOS 6 so maybe problems were introduced in later versions.
Pages is the first word processor I've used regularly, outside of AppleWorks way back on the Apple IIe. Before that, I used SaintEdit which was a simple text editor. But I got spoiled with Pages.
And then Apple went and dumbed it down. So disappointing.
I could be wrong but I seem to remember there was something like that available for PowerPC Macs. I don't remember anything for 68k Macs and System 6.
