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Well, first of all, the original bidder did screw himself for one or more of the following

 

A. Knowing how much this stuff is worth, and trying to get a deal by underbidding rather than using the BIN.

 

B. Not knowing how much this stuff is worth, and bidding on an item he had no business bidding on in the first place.

 

C. Placing a bid on an item he obviously did not want. If he really wanted it he would have either BINned or placed a realistic bid and hoped he wasn't outbid later by someone with more money who didn't care about the price. $405 is most certainly not a realistic bid for this item since any one of the upgrades by themselves would sell for more than that on even a bad day. Having said that, this item still went way too cheap assuming it is legit.

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You guys are off your rocker. I lowball bids all the time and win. I just won (2) 18GB SCSI hds for $.99 a few minutes ago with $9 shipping, did I pay the going rate? HELL NO.

 

Maybe the guy knew it was worth $500+ and figured he might get it cheaper, it happens all the time.

 

The whole point of ebay to a buyer is to find deals way below market value, or he would just go pay market value at a store.

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There's kind of a SLIGHT difference between a hard drive and an se/30 with some of the rarest upgrades ever made for it all in one auction...

 

Things which go unsaid (logic and common sense) dictate what can and can not be under bid.

 

And you know darn well that most of the people who bid on rare se/30 upgrades on e-bay are insane with how much money they spend.

 

Don't try and say it would be possible for an se/30 with a collection of the rarest and most sought after and absurdly expensive upgrades would EVER, in this or ANY parallel universe sell for $405 or less. Think rationally here. You seem to have a bias against the se/30 in saying you think the most maxed out se/30 would be only worth $50 to you. Well that's fine and good to be your opinion but it is not shared by any of the whack job se/30 bidders that patrol e-bay 24/7, unfortunately.

 

The value in the items is not really because of some amazing functionality (though they are cool), but because of collectors value and extreme rarity.

 

The auction did end at a very low price and I'm willing to bet it was because of:

1. The sellers attitude

2. The lack of internal pictures until near the end, and even then it was only one that was not very clear

3. The lack of pictures showing the unit powered on

4. Come on, only 3-4 pictures, and not even supersized??? For pete sakes ebay lets you put 12 pictures for the same price as 4 and supersize is not even a dollar, total.

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The guy was looking for a deal...

I still would have to side with 003's logic a bit on this fellow. I mean, unless he's a complete newbie on EBAY, he should have known that the BIN was "a deal" relative to what that video card setup alone has sold for in the past.

 

But this one auction is merely one of many cases where the "lesser informed" or "ignorant" in our classic Mac community only work to drive up prices for us all. In my mind, it's not about grayscale cards or rare video cards, it's about anything we want to buy on EBAY (classic Mac merchandise, I mean). I often want to snap up a simple programmer's switch and someone things it's worth $20 and drives the price into outer space. While such utter stupidity may put smiles on the faces of sellers, it certainly causes me much bewilderment and frustration. For even when I myself was a "newbie" on EBAY, I had the sense to check out how other people bid and determined a "reasonable value" for items before I ever engaged in bidding.

 

Sometimes I feel we need a school specifically to train people how to exercise "good judgment" when it comes to bidding on EBAY!

 

Anyway, getting back more to the topic of this thread, I can only add that it is highly unlikely a grayscale setup will appear on EBAY for a price that any of us in this thread can afford (or would be willing to afford). I myself would spent a couple hundred dollars (as I did on a DiiMO CPU card recently), but certainly not more than that. Grayscale on an SE/30 is rare and would be really fund to tinker with, I know, but it's just not worth $500-$800 USD. No matter what way I look at it or how much I want it, I simply could never justify that cost.

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There's kind of a SLIGHT difference between a hard drive and an se/30 with some of the rarest upgrades ever made for it all in one auction...

 

Things which go unsaid (logic and common sense) dictate what can and can not be under bid.

 

And you know darn well that most of the people who bid on rare se/30 upgrades on e-bay are insane with how much money they spend.

 

Don't try and say it would be possible for an se/30 with a collection of the rarest and most sought after and absurdly expensive upgrades would EVER, in this or ANY parallel universe sell for $405 or less. Think rationally here. You seem to have a bias against the se/30 in saying you think the most maxed out se/30 would be only worth $50 to you. Well that's fine and good to be your opinion but it is not shared by any of the whack job se/30 bidders that patrol e-bay 24/7, unfortunately.

 

You just don't get it, you do know that some people with that card never paid much of anything for it don't you? You are the same person who said it would go for $2000 or some crazy number, you paid more for your setup and it doesn't have a solid state SCSI HD either.

 

I know a few people with Apple IIgs with the high speed SCSI, transwarp cpu accelerator, 8MB RAM card that got them at a thrift store, all those put together will sell for more then $400 on ebay, but they paid $20 for it.

 

You have some stupid figure stuck in your head and nothing can bring you to believe that somebody can get a deal once in a while.

 

I have a Tokamac II FX accelerator for my Mac IIfx, they are VERY rare, never seen one on ebay, only pics of one on the net are of mine and somebody in Japan. Go find me one at any price anywhere. I paid $3 for it.

 

Casolai from IRC got a Newertech Nubus RAM card for the 840av for something like $7 NIB, it sold on ebay the same month for $300 ish I think, very rare card.

 

Deals can and will be found. Ebay is not the whole universe.

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Deals can be found and they will be found. But e-bay is not a thrift store.

 

The difference between your IIfx accelerator and a grayscale setup is that the grayscale setup is in high demand and very well known about. I will admit, the first time I heard of the IIfx accelerator you speak of is right now.

 

The SE/30, for whatever reason, is also one of the most popular, if not THE most popular classic mac for collectors. I don't know why. It just is. And so the super rare upgrades for it go for extremley large sums of money because thats what the collectors are willing to pay. Is it possible you could walk into a thrift shop and find a grayscale setup sitting on a shelf for $15? yeah I guess it's possible. But how many times have you heard of that? None.

 

I only got the grayscale setup for the price I did because I asked the seller if he would end the auction early for me. And for whatever reason, he did. If the auction went to the end, it would have ended for a LOT of money. The grayscale setup seems to go for a lot more alone than it does already installed in an SE/30, also. I knew of it's rarity and I though the seller did as well, and was fully expecting him to say no. But when he said yes, what was I supposed to do? Say thanks but no thanks?

 

The auction in question here did not go for nearly as much as it should have and I attribute that to the fact that the seller had a bad attitude, he gave no pictures of it powered on, which would have been simpler to do than the picture of the inside, and the one picture of the inside was admittedly pretty vague. Quite seriously, each upgrade in that SE/30 assuming they are working, would sell on e-bay for way more than $500 a piece. I'm not trying to prevent people from getting deals and I never even contacted the seller. The whole reason I made this thread was so that maybe somebody here could buy it with buy it now, I would not want to drive up the price.

 

But what you don't seem to get is how rare and well known each of the upgrades is, and what kind of demand they are in. Yes, as you and I have already pointed out it is possible to get deals. But this was a strange one, and I have already explained more than once why it went for so low... I can't change your mind on anything but I can tell you what I know... you appearntly don't accept it. fine.

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The guy was looking for a deal...

I still would have to side with 003's logic a bit on this fellow. I mean, unless he's a complete newbie on EBAY, he should have known that the BIN was "a deal" relative to what that video card setup alone has sold for in the past.

 

But this one auction is merely one of many cases where the "lesser informed" or "ignorant" in our classic Mac community only work to drive up prices for us all. In my mind, it's not about grayscale cards or rare video cards, it's about anything we want to buy on EBAY (classic Mac merchandise, I mean). I often want to snap up a simple programmer's switch and someone things it's worth $20 and drives the price into outer space. While such utter stupidity may put smiles on the faces of sellers, it certainly causes me much bewilderment and frustration. For even when I myself was a "newbie" on EBAY, I had the sense to check out how other people bid and determined a "reasonable value" for items before I ever engaged in bidding.

 

Sometimes I feel we need a school specifically to train people how to exercise "good judgment" when it comes to bidding on EBAY!

 

Anyway, getting back more to the topic of this thread, I can only add that it is highly unlikely a grayscale setup will appear on EBAY for a price that any of us in this thread can afford (or would be willing to afford). I myself would spent a couple hundred dollars (as I did on a DiiMO CPU card recently), but certainly not more than that. Grayscale on an SE/30 is rare and would be really fund to tinker with, I know, but it's just not worth $500-$800 USD. No matter what way I look at it or how much I want it, I simply could never justify that cost.

 

And the real problem here is that when enough guys bid $20 for an item such as you referenced, then sellers get the idea in their heads that $20 is the going rate and start setting reserves or higher opening bids or shilling their own auctions. It doesn't matter that only 0.1% of bidders are crazy enough to go that high but enough of them win that it creates a false perception about the rarity or desirability of the item and the rest of us with a more realistic idea of the value have no chance of ever getting one unless we play the same game, which fuels prices even further. Rare and valuable items deserve the high prices they get most of the time, more common items don't. This is the main reason I snipe rather than broadcast my intentions by bidding early. I also leave less of a trail to follow later if someone wants to check the most recent items I won. If the bids all end in the same price range and at or near my maximum bid, it gives both the opposition, as well any future seller of similar items, a chance to analyze my bids and figure out where my limits are. If the auctions I win end all over the place with no discernible pattern, it offers me some protection and more chances to win at lower prices.

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There is a lot of classic Mac merchandise being sold as "untested" and/or "AS/IS" despite the fact many of these sellers have it within their means to test. These same sellers are of the type who refuse to answer many questions and/or have lackluster photos, or even foolish misspellings in their listing. These types drive me nuts!

 

But I completely agree that common items found on EBAY often cost too much. And I absolutely hate it when a seller makes ignorant claims such as citing a Mac Plus as being "rare." Indeed, that adjective should be banned from 99% of all listings. It's a rare case when I truly see something "rare"! And folks, any item you see nearly every day on EBAY (like a Mac 128k) cannot be defined as "rare." Grayscale video for the SE/30 though is more true to the definition of "rare" than most other items I've seen on EBAY.

 

Now won't one of you out there just build us a $100 copy of the video board and grayscale card and drivers so we can all enjoy grayscale?! :-)

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I have talked to the Micron Engineer who has the plans for those boards, waiting to hear when he is shipping them over (unless something happened). Was supposed to get all kind of docs/drivers/cards from him.

 

If I do get the schematics I will post them all. So maybe somebody could make a few hundred and send me one. ;)

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Well now this is driving me nuts.. I used to have a schematic of the grayscale adapter on my hard drive but now I can't find it. there WAS a link to it on 68kmla but it was lost when the server crashed. anybody else remember it or save it, or find it in the google cache?

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I get really annoyed when I see untested se/30 logic boards with bad caps going on e-bay for $40 or more...

Be prepare to get even more annoyed.

 

Unbelievable. Totally unbelievable. It's almost as if this seller viewed this thread first and then decided to hock his logic board for the highest price possible! It's also yet another example of a seller with 100% feedback and a very high score at that. So again, feedback scores alone don't tell the whole story.

 

I only noticed this particular auction because I've been looking for an SE/30 logic board for AGES and happened to find it this morning. But regardless of my desire to have one, I refuse to pay that -- especially when one considers I would have to pay USPS air mail rates to get it shipped to me in Japan! But the seller, like so many others, chooses only the elite country of the US-of-A to sell to, so I am excluded anyway (regardless of the fact I am a US citizen who just happens to live outside "the land of the free.")

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The frightful and very disturbing thing is, sometimes people DO bid in such foolish ways. Whether or not they will on this auction is to be determined in a few days' time. But tragically, such foolish bidding only works to reinforce the misnomer that "all classic Mac bidders are stupid and gullible" in the minds of less honest sellers (which appears to be majority of sellers, I must sadly report). The sheer ignorance of many bidders has a negative price impact on us all.

 

With that said, it very well could be the case that the seller will wise up to market driven forces if there are no bidders when the auction closes. I've seen this before. The seller then waits a couple days and relists at a lower price. The auction then fails to sell again and he relists again and sometimes again until his price is more in line with the auctual value of the item being sold. It is usually at that time that the intelligent among us place our bids! (Myself included.)

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I've actually seen quite a number of sellers like this, Tyler. These blood thirsty sellers have EBAY stores where every single Mac item is outrageously priced. These kind of sellers feed on the newbies and ignorant Mac users, which is what I was trying to describe in my last post.

 

Some people (who often do not participate in forums like this one), are simply unaware of how much something is worth. And these folks occasionally have a sudden urge for something nostalgic and they pay through the nose to sellers like this one to get it.

 

If there were not buyers like that, these sellers would either go out of business or lower their prices. The fact these overpriced auctions remain on EBAY though is evidence that some people ignorantly bid and pay such prices. And again, this is sad for all of us who may be interested in items like a logic board from time to time, albeit at a reasonable price.

 

One cannot say that EBAY is "all bad" because all of us have purchased at least one item off it for a good price, myself included. It simply gets depressing to see the vast majority of deals selling for prices that are far too high, especially now that USPS has raised its prices (no more ocean shipping for people like me who live outside the US).

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Now if it were started as an auction at 99 cents, it would surely be bid up that high. But with buy it now? people won't bite...

Surely you could get an entire SE/30 for far less than $99 though, no? The other compacts don't seem to be worth anything, are SE/30s really worth that much in comparison?

 

 

One cannot say that EBAY is "all bad" because all of us have purchased at least one item off it for a good price, myself included. It simply gets depressing to see the vast majority of deals selling for prices that are far too high, especially now that USPS has raised its prices (no more ocean shipping for people like me who live outside the US).

Personally I think eBay is great - I don't know about vintage Mac bits, as I don't really use it for that kind of thing, but for other stuff you can get real bargains on there, and high street stores can't compete with the prices available on eBay. I don't see that overpriced items are a bad thing really - it's just like traditional shops in that some are overpriced while others sell identical items much cheaper - it's up to the buyer to shop around and they should know that.

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I don't know about vintage Mac bits, as I don't really use it for that kind of thing, but for other stuff you can get real bargains on there... I don't see that overpriced items are a bad thing really...

Trust me. Once you start using EBAY "for that kind of thing" (to buy mostly classic Mac items), you suddenly gain a different perspective and come to see first hand what my posts in this thread are talking about.

 

It's really a different world on EBAY when comparing Apple merchandise to everything else. A lot of unethical sellers flock to the Apple section of EBAY because they know there are ignorant Mac loving buyers out there who will pay virtually anything to get what they want.

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There have been several recent cases wherein processor upgrades for 68K Macs have been unrealistically priced at the start. Most often they have not sold, been relisted at the same price and still not sold, and so on. Then there have been other listings of upgrade cards that started unrealistically, but were reduced in starting price at each relisting until they reached the level of attractiveness to sell. It depends somewhat on the Mac savviness of the seller, and whether realism catches up with greed.

 

If the SE/30 logic board above had metal RAM clips, a socketted CPU and a re-cap. job it could be worth the money. But it hasn't/aint.

 

de

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There is a lot of classic Mac merchandise being sold as "untested" and/or "AS/IS" despite the fact many of these sellers have it within their means to test. These same sellers are of the type who refuse to answer many questions and/or have lackluster photos, or even foolish misspellings in their listing. These types drive me nuts!

 

But I completely agree that common items found on EBAY often cost too much. And I absolutely hate it when a seller makes ignorant claims such as citing a Mac Plus as being "rare." Indeed, that adjective should be banned from 99% of all listings. It's a rare case when I truly see something "rare"! And folks, any item you see nearly every day on EBAY (like a Mac 128k) cannot be defined as "rare." Grayscale video for the SE/30 though is more true to the definition of "rare" than most other items I've seen on EBAY.

 

Now won't one of you out there just build us a $100 copy of the video board and grayscale card and drivers so we can all enjoy grayscale?! :-)

 

Untested and AS/IS = tested and found to be broken. I don't even bother with most auctions like that unless it contains something that can be salvaged that is worth the price paid.

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Surely you could get an entire SE/30 for far less than $99 though, no? The other compacts don't seem to be worth anything, are SE/30s really worth that much in comparison?
True. Hence back to the ignorance of the buyers.
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The feedback is in for this auction and the buyer is happy. I didn't think it was fraud but the guy certainly wasn't forthcoming in his ad and got really snippy. Check out the stuff the buyer has bought and sold recently. Come on, is it someone on here?

 

cangrande

 

p.s. I still have my Xceed w/grayscale, anyone want to make an offer? I will take as many pictures as you like and I won't be a jerk, I promise 8-)

 

p.p.s. Are socketed motherboards desirable? I don't have any upgrades, but one of the SE/30 logic boards is socketed. Do noninstalled upgrades ever come up for sale?

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Socketed motherboards ARE desirable because they are rare. Socketed upgrades seem to be even rarer, though. But nonetheless a working, socketed motherboard without an upgrade would get quite a bit more than a non socketed one in a traditional auction.

 

Having it re-capped would also increase the value, but you would also run the risk of frying it.

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Untested and AS/IS = tested and found to be broken.

In most cases, I would agree with you. But for the first time ever in my years on EBAY, I landed a brand new item for $0.99 (plus shipping to Japan)! I must say that I was overjoyed because it never fails that some nut will bid up the price, and although I will win it in the end, I usually have to pay a lot more. But this time, I watched the auction all the way to the last 30 seconds and because no one bid, I manually "snipped it" and got the $0.99 opening price. Since there's no ocean shipping to Japan anymore (shame on you USPS!), I had to air mail it over here for $45. But considering the total I've paid for analog boards like this in the past, it was a good deal.

 

This was a Mac Plus Platinum analog board that I had been searching for for years. I was brand new, still in the original Apple Service box with the original anti-static wrap (unbroken seal) and foam cushions and paperwork. The buyer sold it "AS IS/UNTESTED" for two reasons: because he lacked the means to test it (he acquired many Apple Service boxes from another source) and he didn't want to open it (otherwise he couldn't sell it as "unopened.")

 

This seller put up decent photos and his listing was descriptive enough to where I didn't need to ask questions prior to bidding. I also saw he shipped "worldwide," which meant I didn't need to beg the seller to include Japan.

 

All said it was a good deal, even though it was sold "AS IS/ UNTESTED." So you have to be careful with items like that, and often you have to ask questions (if the listing lacks details), but sometimes there is a reason for that description and it makes logical sense. But again, I agree that many EBAY sellers are unethical in their tactics and they sell something "AS IS/UNTESTED" even though they can and maybe have tested it, knowing its bad.

 

cangrande, I've been searching for a working SE/30 logic board for a long time. I've not been able to find one on EBAY over the past couple years for a decent price (because one person in this thread has been buying them all up! :-) I don't need socketed (because I don't want to pay extra for it), and I can re-cap myself. But in light of USPS shipping charges now, I can't pay as much for one as I used to be willing to. However, I would be interested in one.

 

As to your grayscale setup, I'm certain your price would be out of my league. However, if it was reasonable then of course I would be interested. And I could then shoot some photos to add to my Flickr Collection and post some detailed reports about it here (which no other owner of a grayscale setup has ever done for this classic Mac community).

 

I am not a "collector" in name, but rather a Mac enthusiast who is willing to share findings with the community. I do it only because I would like to see others do it. I like to see clear, sharp photos of old Mac stuff, and I like to read interesting reports about them too. Sadly, we don't see a lot of this on Low End Mac, so some of us must post it in forums like this!

 

So anyway, I am more than happy to make some of your items famous on the net, if you decide you wish to part with them.

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