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upusen

SE/30 can't recognize SCSI HDD

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Hi everyone.

 

I'm not English speaker so maybe I can't tell about some problems nicely. sorry about it.

 

Few days ago I bought Macintosh SE/30 with no HDD. it looked some leaking capacitors on the motherboard, so I remove capacitors and then clean the motherboard with dishwasher and dry it out and then recapped.

Then boot up SE/30, it looked boot up nicely. She can boot up from internal FDD and external FDD(Floppy Emu).

 

When turn on the power, internal HDD looks spin up and can see blinking access LED. But can't boot up from HDD and can't see from Finder.

I try format HDD on some third party formatter software but they can't format. They looks recognize the HDD but can't do any functions.

When try check SCSI devices on Lido 7, it says "OSErr= 5 bad scsi command: phase error." on SCSI ID 0. and Pmount shows 0MB Drive on SCSI ID 0. This also happens another 3 HDDs I have.

 

What I can do for fix this problem?

 

 

Thanks

IMG_0614.HEIC

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Hi,

 

Are you sure those hard drives are working units ? the fact your hd is detected doesn't mean it works (i have a lot of detected units that doesn't work)

 

If Lido throws an error, either the HD is bad or a terminator issue is present.

 

another issue is having the HD not properly formatted to Macintosh OS.

 

What brand are your HDs ?

 

 

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Depending on how bad the caps leaked I'd say broken traces around the SCSI controller.

Happens all the time and is easy to spot and fix. Grab the schematics and check all traces between the SCSI chip and the internal SCSI connector.

Also check all the other signals that go from the SCSI chip to somewhere else on the board.

Edited by Bolle

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1 hour ago, bibilit said:

Hi,

 

Are you sure those hard drives are working units ? the fact your hd is detected doesn't mean it works (i have a lot of detected units that doesn't work)

 

If Lido throws an error, either the HD is bad or a terminator issue is present.

 

another issue is having the HD not properly formatted to Macintosh OS.

 

What brand are your HDs ?

 

 

Thank you for reply!

 

I used

  • seagate HD (originally installed Macintosh LC. I don't know is this working correctly) 
  • Maxtor HD (originally installed accelerated Mac SE and it worked before 2 month ago)
  • Apple's official 40MB HD (I don't know is this working correctly)

all HDs are can heard spin noises.

 

Is there problems are possibility to solve by using SD2SCSI or something?

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Given that you've tested many known good units (correctly terminated I assume since you're using them with other macs), I'm afraid the problem must be coming from the SE/30 board. 

Can you please post pictures of the top and bottom area around the SCSI chip? 

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17 minutes ago, BadGoldEagle said:

Given that you've tested many known good units (correctly terminated I assume since you're using them with other macs), I'm afraid the problem must be coming from the SE/30 board. 

Can you please post pictures of the top and bottom area around the SCSI chip? 

Thank you for reply!

 

I'm not sure this is a SCSI chip...

IMG_0643.jpg

IMG_0640.jpg

IMG_0642.jpg

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Yes it is.

 

Nothing obvious from you pictures.

 

I will try to connect your hard drives to a working unit (The SE or LC for instance) and do a proper universal installation first (the system file will show a finder picture on it, so a bootable system)

 

Once this done and with a good known Hard drive in hands, i will follow the schematics and check for broken traces, this a long process, been there several times, but as Bolle said before, capacitors can wreak havoc to traces.

Edited by bibilit

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Agree with bibilit. Sometimes traces that look gone are actually ok, and some that look fine are gone. Continuity testing is the way to go.

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This may not be the answer, I tried trace the board with my cheap multimeter. blue is beep, Orange is nothing.

But I can't understand this result means.

(sorry I forgot line 36. it is blue)

Screen Shot 0001-08-19 at 23.26.33.png

Edited by upusen

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There seem to be some broken traces. You have to solder some small isolated wires to replace the traces.

I would buy a SCSI2SD. All old SCSI drives will fail some day. I have about 10 compact macs and 6 drives are broken. Some drives can be revived, so you can save the software, but sometimes they will fail too.

 

Edited by dochilli

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3 minutes ago, dochilli said:

There seem to be some broken traces. You have to solder some small isolated wires to replace the traces.

I would buy a SCSI2SD. All old SCSI drives will fail some day. I have about 10 compact macs and 6 drives are broken. Some drives can be revived, so you can save the software, but sometimes they will fail too.

 

Ugh...I'm not good at tracing... :sadmac:

 

I think I must buy SD2SCSI devices. so maybe I'll buy it soon.

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Is this chip pin assignment is same as the picture? this picture is came from maybe different chip company document as mine. I couldn't find for my SE/30's SCSI controller assignments...

 

Screen Shot 0001-08-22 at 11.36.34.png

Screen Shot 0001-08-22 at 11.35.56.png

Edited by upusen

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I tried one more time with that picture. also not connected red marked pins.

How to connect these nicely...? Please teach me recommend method.[:(]

Screen Shot 0001-08-22 at 12.12.27.png

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Question I have as well: is this a multi-layer board? Where do half the traces from those pins go? I need that help as well.

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It is a multi-layer board. @LaPorta if you reference the schematics that Bolle linked to, print pages 6 and 6a and lay them next to each other. You should then be able to follow all the traces on the diagram and check for continuity. 

 

@upusen for any bad traces you’ll need to solder a jumper. I would check for YouTube videos on “how to solder a wire to an IC pin” or similar, but one way to do it is to strip then tin the wire, then hold it steadily onto the correct pin (perhaps with a Helping Hands) and touch your hot iron to the tinned wire, holding it there until the solder melts. This should solder the wire nicely to the pin without creating a solder bridge to the other pins. Once you’re done, check that there is NO continuity between adjacent pins, indicating a short. 

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On 8/23/2019 at 11:08 AM, Crutch said:

@upusen for any bad traces you’ll need to solder a jumper. I would check for YouTube videos on “how to solder a wire to an IC pin” or similar, but one way to do it is to strip then tin the wire, then hold it steadily onto the correct pin (perhaps with a Helping Hands) and touch your hot iron to the tinned wire, holding it there until the solder melts. This should solder the wire nicely to the pin without creating a solder bridge to the other pins. Once you’re done, check that there is NO continuity between adjacent pins, indicating a short. 

 

I did several tests on SE/30 board. firstly, Internal and external SCSI pins are not connected to SCSI chip. but internal SCSI and external SCSI pins are connected. so I will try solder internal SCSI pins to SCSI chip. I think maybe both SCSI connector is works if solder is succeed.

Edited by upusen

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I don't know someone see this thread, but I did it!

 

I tried trace the board with the Bolle given me schematics. I know this is not rational trace way.

Screen_Shot_0001-09-01_at_17_59_23.thumb.png.724bb8042e6b3416d9059c8099a3b9d6.png

Screen_Shot_0001-09-01_at_17_59_30.thumb.png.290842534d59749fcde71cebdc506317.png

 

I switched on while praying. and it works!!

 

now my SE/30 can read the internal SCSI HDD, and booted!

 

Screen_Shot_0001-09-01_at_18_07_16.thumb.png.e67b84e49fca215ad187d760e7f6edb9.png

Screen_Shot_0001-09-01_at_18_09_02.thumb.png.269a3e6c18bf15e43f7949099f5bb264.png

 

Thanks for all advices in this thread. Thank you so much!

maybe I'll buy SD2SCSI or something else...

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