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Skate323k137

Skate finds a iigs

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50 minutes ago, Gorgonops said:

If you'd be happy with just having a digital RGB monitor I'd suggest looking at, I hate to say it, the 108x-series monitors that Commodore sold for the Amiga. (These monitors were actually rebranded... Magnavox? units, but the equivalent units with the original label are really hard to find.) Most of these monitors have both analog and digital RGB ports (along with composite) and thus can be made to work with most 80's home computers.

Or uh, y'know, the Tandy CM-11, which is much cheaper than a 1084 in my experience...

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53 minutes ago, itsvince725 said:

Or uh, y'know, the Tandy CM-11, which is much cheaper than a 1084 in my experience...

The reason I suggested the Commodore monitor is because it does *both* digital RGBI and analog RGB. The CM-11 is *just* a digital CGA monitor. Therefore a 1084 can be a really handy thing to have lying around. (I have a 1084 and it's on my to-do list to make an adapter cable to use it with the IIgs. And of course it works with the Apple II+, the Amiga it came with, would work with a CGA PC if I ever pick one up again...)
 

But, yes, if you just want an RGBI monitor the CM-11 is a fine choice.

It's off-topic for this thread, but another option if you do have an old PC with CGA and you're desperate for a monitor you can connect it to those cheap scaler boards with an inexpensive adapter; said boards are designed for analog RGB but RGBI can be converted to that with a simple DAC. (The simplest version can be made out of just resistors, but this won't look quite right because IBM CGA monitors have special circuitry inside to convert what would be the "dark yellow" color you'd get out of the straight RGBI equation to a more aesthetically pleasing brown. Several people make adapters equipped with a chip that will do this. You can, oddly enough, most easily find sources on forums talking about Commodore 8-bits because the Commodore 128's RGB output is the same as CGA.)

... of course, if you bought the PC to play games on you're *actually* probably better off connecting it to a composite monitor if you have a composite-equipped CGA card, but that's a really off-topic subject.

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If it has to do with analog /digital / old RGB video I don't mind :)

 

The bigger monitor I use the IIGS with has both analog/digital RGB inputs on the back. NEC CM-27 is the model if I remember right, but I've only ever seen the 2 I salvaged, and I sold one of them. 

Edited by Skate323k137

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Seeing photos of a IIgs connected to the original monitor or sufficiently blurry TV sets (via SCART cables) it's kind of shocking how much better its desktop looks than it does on a monitor sharp enough to resolve the pinstripes. (Or in an emulator, for that matter.) It's "blurry" but it's not a stripey eye-killer.

 

(It's funny, I don't think I ever actually saw a IIgs running GS/OS in person before getting one myself. The IIgs came out right about the time I graduated from middle school, and that was the highest grade level that had Apple ][s; high school was 100% IBM compatibles.)

What really kind of gets me about this is I'd swear that if you displayed a similar pinstripe pattern like that on an IBM PC with a CGA monitor it wouldn't "blend" anywhere near as neatly as that. I can't swear to it, though, because most of my memories of CGA involve it running on monochrome monitors. (Our first PC had a Princeton Graphics MAX-12, like this:

 

https://picclick.com/Vintage-Princeton-Graphics-Systems-Ibm-Computer-Monochrome-Pc-322438777633.html

 

Which was an interesting dual-mode monitor that could handle both MDA/Hercules and CGA in shades of amber.) I did for a while in the early 90's have a ridiculously tricked out 5150 (made out of scrounged parts) that had an EGA card connected to a Kaypro CGA monitor and... yeah, again, I'd swear that pinstripes like that didn't 'blend' the way they seem to on the IIgs monitor. (IE, a series of blue and white bars would be clearly identifiable as such, to see it as a dithered color you'd have to take a few steps back and depend on your eyes to mix it.) Maybe I'm mis-remembering, or maybe Apple really did sort of "de-tune" their monitor to make dithers more effective.

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My favorite ever monochrome monitor was a green NEC-branded composite-input unit. (Looked a lot like the contemporary Amdek ones.) It had a built-in amplifier and speaker which made it particularly handy to use with the TRS-80 Model I (I made a cable with phono-plug jack on it to connect it to the cassette cable, which was the standard method of getting sound from games with a Trash 80), and I also, just for laughs, had it connected to an old VCR and running as a television for a while. It had a *sloooooow* phosphor tube which left satisfying "action blurs" when playing video games. (And could have some trippy side effects when watching TV.)

Personally, having had both, I feel like Green > Amber. In particular if you're talking about MDA with its sloooow 50mhz refresh the longer persistence your phosphor the better. The MAX-12 was fine for CGA at 60hz, but I tried it on a Hercules card for a while and it gave me a headache.

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... and, I guess to be clear, what was special about the MAX-12 (and some later monitors like it) was that it did monochrome CGA via the 9-pin RGBI port, IE, it took the digital input and rendered it into shades of gray in hardware. The "standard" way to have CGA in monochrome was via a composite cable (at least in the early days, later third-party CGA cards often lacked composite ports) and that produces a far messier display. (Almost unreadable unless you use "mode bw80" to turn off the colorburst signal, which otherwise renders as a mess of extraneous dots.)

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I skimmed this thread and tried to catch every detail, but...

 

if you recapped/rebuilt the monitor and brightness still drifts as it warms up is a sign of a weak CRT. just FYI. 

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Yeah, I know. I elaborated on that a little bit. I set it to do it's best when it's warm, but I know the tube is old. Always a risk you take I suppose :/

 

Perhaps some day I'll find one with a broken chassis, and steal the tube for this guy. 

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What size is it? I'm sure there were some contemporary TVs that used that tube (or something sufficiently similar to be compatible).

 

c

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I was curious what a trinitron would look like with the desktop pattern. This is the nicest tube I own, PVM 20M4U, which lives in my 2-slot MVS cabinet.

 

It's cool how on the previous page with the pictures of the original monitor you can see how red and blue especially appear to have different thickness of black border around them, where the PVM is quite consistent thanks to aperture grille. 

 

 

 

 

20180712_181846_HDR.jpg

20180712_181905_HDR.jpg

20180712_181950_HDR.jpg

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Those lines definitely don't look quite as good when one can see them clearly. Usable, but not the most fun to look at for hours.

 

Makes me think that it was intentional to have the display slightly off. As to why they couldn't have instead used a different pattern and a "normal" monitor, who knows?

 

c

Edited by CC_333

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Fun with MIDI today...

 

After testing input (playing synthlab instruments via midi keyboard) I figured I would make the IIgs play a duet with my Yamaha keyboard. Channel 1 is the piano, which I mute on the IIgs to make the keyboard receive/play it over midi channel 1. The end result is the iigs speaker playing the accompaniments and my keyboards speakers playing the main piano. 

 

 

 

Edited by Skate323k137

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