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my first Lisa


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#41 falen5

falen5
  • 6502

Posted 25 April 2017 - 04:01 PM

getting an eprom burner 

 

great thing to have

 

i have the .bin files for the roms that 'probally' dont work - just have to write them

 

looking at this one

 

http://www.ebay.ie/i...TUAAOSwBs1XMgdc

 

 

anyone got any advice on these - would be great to be able to write roms for lisa, apple ii, 68k mac's

 

 

more waiting



#42 max1zzz

max1zzz
  • 68000
  • LocationSurrey, England

Posted 25 April 2017 - 06:40 PM

I have one of those, It has been able to read and write everything I have thrown at it so far. (I have used it on Roms as old as my Mac plus's roms and as new as my 2014 MacBook Air with no problems)

 

I can't really think of anything else to say about it... It's cheap and it works, what more could anyone want? :)


68K: Plus, LC, LCII, IIci, Perf 450, Perf 630, Duo 230
PPC: Perf 6200, PM 8600, PB 1400, G3 DT x2, G3 B/W, iBook G3 500, iMac G3 SL, G4 Sawtooth, G4 QS, iMac G4 700, PB G4, PM G5, Xserve G4 Trayload
Intel: Early '08 MBP

#43 falen5

falen5
  • 6502

Posted 25 April 2017 - 07:13 PM

Big Thanks for that Max1zzz

 

nothing worse that getting the wrong thing

 

just bought it - looking forward to messing with this thing


Edited by falen5, 25 April 2017 - 07:22 PM.


#44 Johnnya101

Johnnya101
  • 68000
  • LocationLancaster, NH

Posted 25 April 2017 - 07:31 PM

Jeez that looks cool. I've got to get one...

resized.gif       BRENT RAMBO APPROVES

Apple IIGS, Classic II, SE/30, Color Classic, Quadra 700, 2x Imagewriter II,  Macintosh Color Display, Power Mac 7100 and 7200, LC II, Macintosh Color Display,  and a box full of ADB keyboards... Soon to be owner of another Quadra 700 and PowerBook 165c


#45 CelGen

CelGen
  • 68000
  • LocationKamloops, Canada

Posted 02 May 2017 - 02:08 AM

getting an eprom burner 

 

great thing to have

 

i have the .bin files for the roms that 'probally' dont work - just have to write them

 

looking at this one

 

http://www.ebay.ie/i...TUAAOSwBs1XMgdc

 

 

anyone got any advice on these - would be great to be able to write roms for lisa, apple ii, 68k mac's

 

 

more waiting

 

I've always seen them as a modernized version of the Willem parallel port programmers from a decade ago. They work with relatively no issues. Personally I'm loyal to the Willem because it can also handle oddball chip types including NMOS. The newer programmers seem to favor more modern low power VPP or FLASH memory types.


Edited by CelGen, 02 May 2017 - 02:09 AM.


#46 techknight

techknight
  • 68LC040

Posted 05 May 2017 - 10:00 PM

It actually is a willem. its a clone of the USB willem programmer sold by SIVAVA. 


Main PC: Intel core I7 920, MSI x58 platinum, Radeon4850
PB: tibook G4, ibook G4, ibook g3x2, Lombard, 160, 165, 180, 180c Duo 2300x2, Duo 270c x2, 520cPPC, 3400c, 1400c
Desktop: G3AIO, SE, SE/30, 512k, plus, LCIII, iMac G4, iMac intel, 6400/225

#47 CelGen

CelGen
  • 68000
  • LocationKamloops, Canada

Posted 07 May 2017 - 01:41 AM

Yes, I'm aware. I just don't trust a programmer with a USB port to handle truly ancient chips.



#48 MarNo84

MarNo84
  • 6502
  • LocationRottenburg, Germany

Posted 13 May 2017 - 03:25 PM

Very cool find your LISA :lisa2:

I got my 2/5 beauty from a trade (could let my PDP 8/I go for the L and a lot of other nice machines - my transporter was kind of overloaded with old computers and parts on my way back home xD) some years ago and also repaired/rebuild it from the scratch. It was a victim of these acid leaking little trolls called batteries :-/

This year finally I got a nice working keyboard - an original mouse is the last thing to finish this beauty. It's already up and running like a charme.

 

Hope you can fix everything and get it up and running again [8D]  and for the good, please keep that smashed Widget - just as is. If you want throwing it in the bin, I'll pay the postage/transport to Germany [:D]

 

Cheers,

Marcus


Edited by MarNo84, 13 May 2017 - 03:51 PM.

My Collection: www.marnoweb.de & www.classic-computer-collection.de & MarNoWeb @YT:  www.youtube.com/channel/UCyaeYrRq3IpohMUleaODrUw
I like: pre 1990 portable/luggable/compact & All-in-One Systems


#49 falen5

falen5
  • 6502

Posted 13 May 2017 - 05:10 PM

Cheers Marcus.

 

I wont be throwing anything out. Still waiting on the eprom programmer to see if I can get some life into this machine

 

As for the hard drive, The damage to the widget boards is repairable id say. The problem is the actual drive itself

I had a look through some of the old drives I got from the guy from cork who used to work in Apple.

 

Found this one.  I think its an old mfm drive

Im hoping to find something i can use with the widget controllers....... although from what i have read so far it seems that nothing will work with the widget boards except the original drive

 

Anybody ever hear of someone finding a replacement for the for the widget drive mechanism itself that works with the widget controllers

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Edited by falen5, 13 May 2017 - 05:33 PM.


#50 MarNo84

MarNo84
  • 6502
  • LocationRottenburg, Germany

Posted 14 May 2017 - 12:23 PM

Hi,

 

yep it's an old MFM but I doubt to get it together with the System itself ;-) Apple had it's own things - even between their Apple Computers ;-)

The PCBs on the Widget may be reapirable but how about the Plattern/Drive itself? you could take it to an IT Lab at any University near your place - they often has such clean rooms/boxes, so you could open the drive and check the plattern and especially that little glued glass sensor inside the drive.

 

But I assume that it's totally done - like you said above, someone took it out of the machine and throw it around...why in the world would someone do this? it's so  disgusting :-/

 

Marcus


My Collection: www.marnoweb.de & www.classic-computer-collection.de & MarNoWeb @YT:  www.youtube.com/channel/UCyaeYrRq3IpohMUleaODrUw
I like: pre 1990 portable/luggable/compact & All-in-One Systems


#51 falen5

falen5
  • 6502

Posted 14 May 2017 - 01:50 PM

Hey Marcus - they didnt just take out the hard drive and throw it around, they opened the drive itself and  took the platter and the swing arm. They are gone!.

I have no plattern or swing arm. Just the empty case where they used to live!

 

From reading, i think my only hope is one of the cards for the expansion slot. But they are expensive. I have cleaned and restored everything else. Floppy drive looks good after  a good clean and lube. Hopefully its ready to do some work.

 

Now I understand why there are always widget boards for sale on ebay. my chances of getting just the mechanical part of the drive are pretty much zero.

 

those contact pads inside the keyboard are crazy. As others warned (even before i got the machine) they must all be replaced. Another 'fiddely' kind of job.

Ive ordered the materials to make the new contact pads.

That will be fun.

 

Might have the eprom programmer next week. It is due. Really looking forward to reading eproms.

 

question: I imagine the code from an eprom will be in hex. Is there a program that will list the code into some kind of assembly. I would be really interested to see the code that boots up the machine.


Edited by falen5, 14 May 2017 - 01:51 PM.


#52 MarNo84

MarNo84
  • 6502
  • LocationRottenburg, Germany

Posted 14 May 2017 - 04:00 PM

Hi falen,

 

oh my... thats cruel anyway xD

yeah, so just leave it as is - a brick is a brick - put it in your shelf [;)] 

 

Hmm these Parallel-Interface cards are not that rare..sometimes one pops up for a good price. I trade mine a while ago :-/ I didn't need it, because I have a LISA 2/5 with builtin Parallelport :lisa2: - my ProFile just hooks up on that...

 

You have three options:

1 - get yourself an working Widgetdrive - nearly impossible nowadays

2 - try that X/Profile board - excellent replacement and you can just hookup an ordinary IDE or CF-card "as Widget/ProFile"

3 - find a Parallel-Interface Card and a working ProFile Drive (5MBs are quite common and easier to find or a 10MB - nearly impossible like an working Widget)

 

Anyway - try booting it up with floppy in first place - you could try MacWorks/Macintosh Emulation ;D

That is, what I did the first years until I got my first working ProFile Drive [:D]  you can check out my Videos about the LISA 2 on my Channel on YT:  look for Apple Lisa 2 MarNoWeb or similar xD

 

For god's sake my keyboard works like a charm - I think it was restored not that long ago? It will be quite a lot of fun from what I read in the threads [}:)]

 

Hmm I don't know such program...would be an interesting thing to see every step from hex to code/assembler/realtime [8D]

I should backup my ROMs - good idea - first ToDo after I'm back from holidays

 

Marcus


My Collection: www.marnoweb.de & www.classic-computer-collection.de & MarNoWeb @YT:  www.youtube.com/channel/UCyaeYrRq3IpohMUleaODrUw
I like: pre 1990 portable/luggable/compact & All-in-One Systems


#53 falen5

falen5
  • 6502

Posted 14 May 2017 - 04:37 PM

Thanks for the info Marcus

 

I think I will go the X/Profile route. The unpopulated boards are on ebay, love kits!. Would be much happier with an IDE drive than a drive that WILL die anyway.

 

When i opened my keyboard and removed the pcb to have a look at the contacts, the 'spongey' material had degraded to a state where if you touch it, it just crumbles to dust. The good folks on here were 100% right. I have to replace every one of them. Found a good guide online on how to make them. 

 

Looking at your vids. You are as bad as me!!. Computers of all kinds. My german is not that good, but I hear your passion!!. There are not many people that can get so excited opening a box to find something that is totally obsolete , takes up too much space and makes their partner ever more annoyed every time another machine arrives in the door.

 

I have been officially placed on final warning by her good self.

"No more dam computers" she said when she saw the Lisa coming throught the front door.

 

Its all good fun



#54 stepleton

stepleton
  • 6502

Posted 14 May 2017 - 10:22 PM

If you're comfortable with soldering and kits, you might also consider building an IDEfile, particularly if Patrick Schäfer is still distributing GALs, ROMs, and PCBs for new builds. I built my own a few years ago and have found it to be very dependable. I thought it was a fun kit---there's a lot of soldering to do, maybe more than on the X/ProFile, but not by all that much. An IDEfile does not have the CF socket built-in---you will need to arrange your own IDE to CF adapter. These are easy to find. The X/ProFile also allows you to plug in two drives at once for easy copying, though, which the IDEfile does not do.

 

I built my IDEfile into the case of a broken ProFile, and a scavenged BCD thumbwheel switch from a SCSI drive housing serves as the volume selector. I use a CF card for storage, and since I'm not powering a proper IDE hard drive, 5V and not much current is all I need for the whole show. A tiny switching regulator like this one steps down the power from the original ProFile supply without the heat sink or fan that a linear regulator might need.

 

The red light on the front of the ProFile case still blinks as it should  :lisa: . It's a lot quieter than the real thing, though, and suspicious people might also notice the IDEfile's LCD visible on the back of the drive.

 

Both options are good ones, I think. Best of luck!



#55 MarNo84

MarNo84
  • 6502
  • LocationRottenburg, Germany

Posted 15 May 2017 - 01:03 PM

...

Looking at your vids. You are as bad as me!!. Computers of all kinds. My german is not that good, but I hear your passion!!. There are not many people that can get so excited opening a box to find something that is totally obsolete , takes up too much space and makes their partner ever more annoyed every time another machine arrives in the door.

 

I have been officially placed on final warning by her good self.

"No more dam computers" she said when she saw the Lisa coming throught the front door.

 

Its all good fun

Haha, well I'm over that situation too..but we made an arangement: as long I won't put any of these old toys longer than 24h around the rooms (especially living room and bedroom - yep, on last winter days I did a lot of videos in our beedroom xD) she is fine with my hobby - My playground and so my little "Computermuseum" is on the attic ;-) a few squaremeters of free space/room for my little machines. One day I will make a small tour around my collection and put it on YT ;-)

 

Well, I should make my videos and Homepage in english language too, so it could reach a lot more people - but to be honest - I'm kinda lazy with this... I'm already happy after I could finish a video and just upload it - without editing in most cases. One day i will put subs on my existing videos or I will put a second audio line to them?

 

Do you have a website or similar, videos of your toys? Love to share this hobby with other crazy pple xD

 

Like the good stepleton above already mentioned - an IDEFile would be an interesting and equivalent option besides the X/Profile as replacement.

Recently I was in contact with Dr. Patrick Schäfer - I asked some stuff about Hardware/Drive replacements inside a ProFile Drive - I also thought about, building an IDEFile Drive... I should ask him back about PCB, GAL and ROMs  :lisa2: 

 

Marcus


My Collection: www.marnoweb.de & www.classic-computer-collection.de & MarNoWeb @YT:  www.youtube.com/channel/UCyaeYrRq3IpohMUleaODrUw
I like: pre 1990 portable/luggable/compact & All-in-One Systems


#56 MarNo84

MarNo84
  • 6502
  • LocationRottenburg, Germany

Posted 15 May 2017 - 01:08 PM

Both options are good ones, I think. Best of luck!

Hey stepleton,

 

aren't you THAT genius, who made the NeoWidex tool?? I will try it out in a while when I start my Apple ProFile "Using & Servicing" Project :)

 

Regards,

Marcus


Edited by MarNo84, 15 May 2017 - 01:08 PM.

My Collection: www.marnoweb.de & www.classic-computer-collection.de & MarNoWeb @YT:  www.youtube.com/channel/UCyaeYrRq3IpohMUleaODrUw
I like: pre 1990 portable/luggable/compact & All-in-One Systems


#57 stepleton

stepleton
  • 6502

Posted 16 May 2017 - 01:07 AM

That's me, but all the hard work was done by reverse engineers and archivists like Dr. Schäfer among many others. I hope NeoWidEx is useful to you!

#58 james_w

james_w
  • 6502
  • LocationLondon, UK

Posted 20 May 2017 - 02:48 PM

Great to see more Lisa owners in Europe! Good luck falen5 with getting yours up and running. I'm lucky - mine only needed a PSU recap... but my keyboard's contacts are nearly all gone so will have to build all new ones to get a full working keyboard.


Check out my collection on Instagram (@hypertalking). Currently on a mission to recap my entire collection!
Conquests:
Lisa 2/10, Original 128k (upgraded to 512k), 512k, 512k (upgraded to Plus) x2, SE (FDHD), SE (2 x 800k), SE (800k 20SC) x2, SE/30, Classic x2, Colour Classic (Mystic), IIsi, IIci, LC 450, Quadra 700 x2, Quadra 605, Quadra 660AV, Cube G4, Portable, Portable (Backlit), PB 100 x2, PB 165, PB 170, Duo 230, Duo 280c, Duo 2300c, PB 2400, PB 1400c, PB G3, PB G4 Titanium, iBook, MessagePad 2100, eMate 300. Clones: Dynamac EL 1701, Outbound Laptop 125, Outbound Notebook 2000 Passed on to other collectors: Lisa 2/5, SE/30, Portable, PB 180, Duo 280c


#59 MarNo84

MarNo84
  • 6502
  • LocationRottenburg, Germany

Posted 20 May 2017 - 04:08 PM

Great to see more Lisa owners in Europe! Good luck falen5 with getting yours up and running. I'm lucky - mine only needed a PSU recap... but my keyboard's contacts are nearly all gone so will have to build all new ones to get a full working keyboard.

Oh, I hope I won't have to rebuild mine in near future...I think, it wouldn't damage anything if I just open it and check the pads?

 

Marcus


My Collection: www.marnoweb.de & www.classic-computer-collection.de & MarNoWeb @YT:  www.youtube.com/channel/UCyaeYrRq3IpohMUleaODrUw
I like: pre 1990 portable/luggable/compact & All-in-One Systems


#60 Schafeman

Schafeman
  • 6502
  • LocationTwin Cities, MN

Posted 23 May 2017 - 01:18 AM

When I had to finally fix my keyboard, it was a waterfall effect.  Only a few keys were broken, and after I took off the PCB and started replacing those pads, then more degraded to the point where the keys stopped working.  Now I replaced all of the foam pads with a complete set that DOESN'T work at all.  So I literally have no keyboard now.. be careful :)


Current Mac Collection: Mac IIci w/ 50mhz Daystar / Quadra 700 Mac Classic / Mac SE30 / PowerMac 7300-200 / Powerbook 520 12mb / Quadra 950

Current Non-Mac Collection: Apple IIgs (both ROM01 and ROM3) Apple Lisa 2/10 / Apple Lisa (Macintosh) XL (Now Sold) :sad:





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