Mac G4 Sawtooth Upgraded

[Rick Dangerous]

Hey Y'all.

Recently had Bob over at the Operator Headgap store do up a G4 Sawtooth for me as an OS 9.2.2 "Daily Driver."  It's got:

-Full Ram (I think 1.5 or 2GB-Only 1.5 usable by OS9 obviously)

-1GHZ Sonnet Processor Upgrade

-120GB Dual Boot SSD

-32MB Graphics Card

-80GB Backup Drive with both OS's on them just in case

-5 slot USB card

-External USB powered G3 themed 3.5 floppy drive

-Later DVD Superdrive internal

I have a really nice set of those Harmon Kardon see-through speakers and sub, that sadly will not work with this model (which takes a standard 3.5mm input.)  Can anyone recommend a good period correct speaker set that will look good with this model that i could track down on ebay?  

I'm using the 17 inch flat panel monitor with the pro keyboard and mouse of the era. I also love that this computer was assembled in the USA; which is pretty cool. 

I'll take some pics shortly when i get it setup! 

 

[Cory5412]

There is a later set of the Harman Kardon Sound Sticks which keep the same appearance, but uses a 3.5mm headphone jack for audio.

Not many speaker sets managed to achieve the exact aesthetics Apple had going on in this time-frame. You either had stuff that still looked like the G3-era machines, or you had stuff in beige and flat matte black (or arguably almsot worse: silver plastic) meant to match what Dell, HP, Gateway et al were building at the moment, and then in around 2004/2005 when Apple's aesthetics moved a bit back toward simpler shapes, things started to match a little better again.

Incidentally, any plans for OS 9 on a full gig and a half of RAM or are you going to be doing a lot of OS X dual booting with this system?

I rarely exceed about 200 megs of usage on my own OS9 systems.

 

[Rick Dangerous]

Okay so it turns out i have the later Harmon Kardon speakers with the 3.5mm, headphone jack input.  So at least they will work.  There is a sort of weird ring at the base which is why i thought it was some sort of composite input at first glance when they were in packaging from shipping.  The thing is....my Harmon Kardon sub of the same style is a USB input model, so hopefully they can work together?  If not may have to track down the Sub that matches with the later speakers?  Not sure how that would work, probably more like a current setup; speakers into sub, line out from sub to computer.   Hoping my setup just works as is, i have plenty of USB inputs to spare.  The interesting thing is there is no volume adjust on the sub whatsoever, or speakers, so i guess it's all just through the computers audio panel.

Yes running OS9 on a full gig and a half of RAM!  Works great for 3D gaming etc, though i'm not sure how much i'm actually using.  Would be interesting to run a program to test that.  Will get this all setup soon and upload some pics. 

I know this computer is the farthest thing from rare or necessarily "interesting" but i'm looking forward to having such a beefy and functional computer in which to play around on OS9 and with my floppies of yesteryear. 

 

[Cory5412]

Would be interesting to run a program to test that

About This Mac in the Apple menu will tell you how much RAM each program is allocated and using, and what the "largest free block" (which isn't always the same as the actual total amount of free ram) is.

In general, gaming on Mac tended to aim to the lowest common denominator, so games from that era are designed to work well on iMac G3s with 64-128 megs of RAM.

The thing is....my Harmon Kardon sub of the same style is a USB input model, so hopefully they can work together? 

Hm.

The original iSub was meant to be used with an iMac G3's built in speakers, or the Pro speakers (the globes) on an iMac G4 or the digital audio/quicksilver/QS'02 power macintosh G4.

If you have that, it might not work with this setup, despite OS 9 probably being able to recognize what it is.

However, I don't know if there was any component/PCB sharing at the time, I know the SoundSticks' sub looks nearly identical to the iSub.

There was also a USB-based soundsticks set, which perhaps is what you have and they do connect?

LEM has an article about this, but I don't know if it accounts for the updated SoundSticks III (3.5mm) and the bluetooth version - https://lowendmac.com/2001/harmankardon-compatibility-guide/

 

[MacFox]

I know this computer is the farthest thing from rare or necessarily "interesting" but i'm looking forward to having such a beefy and functional computer in which to play around on OS9 and with my floppies of yesteryear. 

I also have an upgraded Sawtooth (got mine from eBay) and my feelings towards it are the same as yours.  I have both 9 and X on mine, but I love using 9 the most on it.  I really enjoy mine and it's become one of my favorite Macs in my collection. 

 

[Unknown_K]

I prefer my QS single CPU systems for OS 9.2.x use for some reason over the other G4 towers. Both of my Sawtooths have the dual G4-500 CPU upgrades (from a Gigabyte G4 maybe) and run OSX and 9.x on different partitions.

My only G4 with a Sonnet CPU is a QS with a 1 or 1.2Ghz model (forget which) I got as a whole unit because it was not functional for the previous owner (just needed firmware upgrade and works fine).

 

[Rick Dangerous]

Nice---great input everyone; thanks!

Yes my sub has USB (on the packaging you can see it was originally intented for use with the iMac) but it claims it will work with any mac with OS9 with Audio update 1.3 or later so maybe it will work? The globes are the later 3.5 input and should work too if hardwired into the rear panel....so we will see.

I am watching a later isub on ebay with the input for the speakers and volume control; they are pretty cheap these days ($20-$30) so worst case I have to pony up for another isub and save this one for when i find a cherry imac locally  

 

[jessenator]

Like Cory mentioned, a nice upgrade would be a set of H|K SoundSticks II. I bet you could get a set decently priced. I happened to get one from an old employer for showing up to the office on time once  

Just be aware that the glue is starting to get brittle on these early 00s units. Both my "sticks" have separated, just in the process of moving it from office to home. The sub is decent, too. Third party power adapters can be had for $20 or less on Amazon.

 

[Cory5412]

Yes my sub has USB (on the packaging you can see it was originally intented for use with the iMac) but it claims it will work with any mac with OS9 with Audio update 1.3 or later so maybe it will work?

It should work, but by my recollection, it goes like this:

The iSub was "meant for" the slot-loading iMac, which had a very improved amplifier and speakers installed.

You could add it onto any other Mac, in practice, this meant the eMac and later iMac G4s, plus the dA/QS+ G4s that had Pro Speakers attatched.

Adding the iSub on a compatible Mac caused, in software, the lower frequencies to be sent to the sub and the higher frequencies to be sent to the Mac's internal speakers or Pro speakers, on an iMac/PowerMac G4. The other thing this is supposed to have done is increase the maximum possible volume of the internal speakers, I don't know the technicalities of how that worked.

The SoundSticks set was a 2.1 set that did all that work internally, as most 2.1 computer speaker sets do. It used either the same or a nearly identical sub but in a more traditional configuration. I believe audio was routed to the sub and then the satellite speakers.

I don't remember the differences between the SoundSticks, the II, and the newer III and Wireless, but I do know the III has a regular 3.5mm audio jack and the Wireless uses bluetooth.

The other thing people often remember is the USB-based speakers that shipped with the Power Macintosh G4 Cube - those are a separate thing entirely. They require high-powered ports that the Cube and Apple's ADC monitors have.

Mac OS 9 cannot route audio to more than one USB audio device at once, so the iSub and the G4 Cube speakers are not compatible with one-another.

Similarly: If the SoundSticks I used USB, they would not be compatible with an additional iSub.

 

[Rick Dangerous]

So for whatever reason it works; the audio goes to the sub; and the high pitch through the 3.5mm to the Sphere speakers.  Sounds great! Have been playing around with it all afternoon.

And please excuse the terrible MS keyboard and mouse until my period correct pro set comes in.

 

[Cory5412]

Are there three audio jacks on the back of the machine?

If so: This is a Digital Audio and those are the Pro speakers. This would be a great machine to pair with a nice iTunes library on your preferred storage media. (USB 1.1 is fast enough to use for MP3s.)

I think the Microsoft keyboard/mouse look fine.

 

[Rick Dangerous]

Now here is another issue....I for some reason only have one option for monitor resolution. I need 640 x 480 for many older games which I know this 17" is capable of. Recommended is the only option. Any way to force more?

Very strange, haven't encountered this before (only one resolution available).  I'm hoping it isn't the graphics card that is limiting me to this one resolution; usually there are like 4-8 to choose from.  This is in OS 9.2.2.

 

[Cory5412]

I'm betting, but can't guarantee, it's because Apple can sense which monitor it is, 

If you're running games that need 640x480/256, then we're talking about some very old software.

Some of those games can be told to "run anyway" (SimCity 2000 is like that, if I remember correctly, and you can even resize SC2k to use the extra room) but some of them really are expecting that res because, well, it was the most common performa resolution up through like 1996.

One option, which I know you might not love because you talked about going for a specific aesthetic, is to use a regular VGA or DVI monitor, which should show you 640x480, 800x600, 832x624, 1024x768, 1152x870, and 1280x1024 (or more if you were to get a 20-inch LCD like the 2007FP).

 

[CC_333]

Now here is another issue....I for some reason only have one option for monitor resolution.

Hmm, what graphics card is installed? This usually is a problem when the drivers either aren't installed for your particular card (unlikely if it's the factory card for your G4), or, for whatever reason, they aren't loading (perhaps because your card is one for which there are no drivers on a standard OS 9 installation, which includes third party cards and cards which came with later, OS X-only machines).

It can also be what Cory5412 describes, but that's unlikely unless either A: no drivers, or B: the monitor is somehow malfunctioning.

c

 

[LaPorta]

Go in that drop-down menu and change from "Recommended" to "All"

 

[LaPorta]

P.S. - The 19 year-old SoundStick set that I got for my iMac DV I still use as the speakers for my current machine. The satellites do route from the sub. They made later versions that ran off of 3.5 mm mini jack, but mine is the original that uses USB.

 

[Rick Dangerous]

Going to give this a whirl:

http://www.madrau.com/SRXv3/html/SR2/indexSR2.html

I did 640x480/256 with this monitor with my G4 Cube so i know it's not the monitor.  Thinking it may be the graphics card.

As to the above; "reccomended" is all it will alllow me to select. Will report back on the above extension tomorrow. 

 

[LaPorta]

That is somewhat odd...are you able to use 640x480 in Mac OS X?

 

[jessenator]

in 10.4.11 it does, but it gives this warning:

In 10.7 (the only other booting parition right now) smallest I can go is 800x600

Edit: looks like one of my 30" Cinemas is starting to go :/  big dim stripe right in the middle.