iPod 1st gen 5GB - Windows format, can't see in Mac OS 9/iTunes

[Byrd]

Hi all,

I'm trying to get a 1st gen iPod 5GB running on my TAM, which has a USB/FW card working (Sonnet Tango). The iPod is running firmware V1.4 and is Windows formatted according to the device info. I bought it some years ago from the US and quite like the music installed but would like to wipe it and get it running under Mac OS 9.1.

I can charge the iPod but can't mount it or see it under Drive Setup nor iTunes.

I've reinstalled iTunes 2.04 which installs an iPod specific firewire extension, also reinstalled the Apple firewire drivers. Any tips - perhaps I should try it under an OS X Mac next running an early version of iTunes, then install the OS 9 disk driver?

Thanks

JB

 

[SECoyote]

Is the version of iTunes that you are using newer than the iPod firmware? Make sure that the iTunes version is compatible with the firmware and that your Mac OS has support for fat32 (assuming that is the "Windows formatted" file system). From my knowledge, I believe that Windows support was added much later on in the iPod release if I am not mistaken. and older versions of iTunes might not account for that.

 

[MOS8_030]

According to this: https://everymac.com/systems/apple/ipod/specs/ipod.html
The 1st gen iPod requires OS 9.2.1 or later.
If you reformat it using another system your TAM may see it, I don't know. The Sonnet card may be an issue too.

 

[Franklinstein]

9.2.1? Really? That's odd to me. I guess it makes sense, sort of: both the iPod and 9.2 were late 2001. You'd figure they would've supported older versions of Mac OS (at least back to 9.0) but I guess not.

 

[Byrd]

Some really good points, thank you - I think I'll need to rig up a Mac running an early version of iTunes/OS X (and dual boot OS 9 as my combo USB/FW card might be also a red herring), and maybe a firewire equipped PC with Windows XP to steal the music contained within. The later firmware (V1.4) and ?FAT32 partition with no sniff of a native Mac partition might be an issue.

Link to Macintosh Garden which includes a firmware downgrader and .dmg with lots of other early iPod firmware:

https://macintoshgarden.org/apps/ipod-updater

My TAM is running Mac OS 9.1 as it's sweet spot, I will likely not try 9.2.1 on it.

JB

 

[MOS8_030]

Sounds like a plan. I doubt there's any reason to downgrade the iPod firmware.
I don't think the TAM will run anything past 9.1 anyway.

 

[Byrd]

Found some time to try this iPod 1G 5GB on other computers - this time an iBook running Mac OS X 10.5.7, and a Pentium 4 with native firewire port running Windows XP and the last version of iTunes for Windows XP - 12.1.3.6. As mentioned, the iPod is formatted to "Windows" running V1.4 firmware. It looks near new and music playback on the device is great.

Both machines exhibit the same thing - you can charge the iPod, but neither OS detects it as a drive or syncs to it in iTunes. I've tried two different FW cables, jiggling the jack does nothing.

Looks like there is an issue with the FW port or internals of the iPod itself. Some searching suggests this was a relatively uncommon fault and units could be sent to third-party techs for repair. Has anyone come across a similar iPad 1G with a bad FW port?

Thanks

JB

Some links found:

iPod 5GB, Suspected Firewire Connector Open Circuits / Cold Solder Joints

Hi, I posted this as a reply in the iPod lounge website, if doing this is too redundant (or considered cross posting), please let me know. Symptoms: iPod can be charged off the 117v power adapter if I very patiently move the ipod cable around in the connector until I can observe the...

macosx.com

https://flic.kr/p/5KnXxr
https://www.reddit.com/r/ipod/comments/10x6c5o

 

[Byrd]

Took apart the iPod and the FW connector looked reasonable and not roughly treated, still resoldered the 6x FW pins and anchor points. No other damage noted (PCB looks fine). Had a third-party battery I've been meaning to install to it, so replaced this at same time - of note it refused to turn on with this battery but after being on charge for ~ 10 mins it fired up as usual charging.

Still the same. Plugged into an iBook G4 it charges fine under FW but is not detected in iTunes or System Profiler, same goes for the Windows XP setup.

Hmmm - I can perform a hard reset but am unsure if this wipes the partition. Might need to try an older version of iTunes on the Windows side. Another thought is to put the HD from a dicey iPod 20GB 3rd gen (which shares the same CF-like HD, but I think is formatted to Mac/HFS+) and see if this gives more joy.

EDIT: got into internal diagnostic mode, and all checks out:

How To Enable IPod Diagnostic Mode And Troubleshoot Your Broken IPod

Did you know that the iPod has a secret diagnostic mode? If you suspect that there's something wrong with your iPod, then just enable the iPod diagnostic mode to troubleshoot it.

methodshop.com

 

[LaPorta]

Have you tried various FW cables?

 

[Byrd]

Have you tried various FW cables?

Yes, I've come across a couple of dud FW cables over the years. I've a Lacie and thicker generic FW cable and both work on an external HD, I don't have the Apple branded FW to FW but surely not?

Updating my progress, all this interest resulted in the resurrection of some other iPod Classics! I dug out my junker 3rd and 4th gen iPods and have been able resurrect a nice 3rd gen with a 40GB HD (they don't like flash upgrades at all) and am awaiting a 1.8" IDE to CF adapter for a 4th gen 40GB to make solid state. As iTunes can no longer find Apple servers for iPod updates, the iPod Updater utility as referenced above is gold for restoring these. Polished these with car cut and polish, batteries seem good and they're in business once again. The 1.8" 20GB drives seem more fragile than the 40GB drives (sample: 3 x 20GB all click and 2 x 40GB good). Also came found an iPod Photo 30GB (looks like 4th gen) which once worked but now dead, LCD flashes white for a moment.

The iPod 1st gen 5GB still remains the same (plays music, HD super healthy, can charge but not sync/detected) and a solid few hours of Googling suggests no obvious theme of failure. Will tear it down again and did see some SMT fuses on the logic board and give it another close view around the FW section of the board.

 

[Dude.JediKnight]

I remember having stubborn iPods that did not respond to anything short of a full reformat as a FW HDD before iTunes or the restore utility would recognize it, though that was on iPods that did not play music or boot on their own. Sometimes the HDD was too borked to recover, and others were recognized but failed to restore.

Seems a bit drastic for an iPod that’s otherwise fully working… but might be worth a shot. Clearly, back up everything on that iPod beforehand if you decide to go that route.

 

[Byrd]

Thanks - I tried the 5GB HD in a 3rd Gen iPod, it didn't like it refusing to boot past the Apple logo. Must try it the other way (3rd gen 40GB in 1st gen).

Having the later iPods on hand helps, as even with blank HDs they are detected in Mac OS X System Report under the firewire section (simply coming up as iPod). Have read of people converting their 1st, 3rd gens using CF cards and all appears well but you can't sync music (well you can with a 3rd gen if lucky but at USB 1.1 speeds), so they've pulled the CF cards into a 4th Gen, dumped all music across then reinstalled the card. Not very elegant. Am awaiting some cheap 1.8" IDE to CF adapters to experiment some more.

 

[volvo242gt]

Do you have access to a memory card reader, like what's used for reading cards used in digital cameras? Could take the 5GB MicroDrive and insert it into the CF port of one of those, then see if a computer reads it.

Delkin Universal Card Reader

Delkin Universal Card Reader is designed to handle multiple types of memory cards and can transfers simultaneously at a high speed rate.

www.bluewaterphotostore.com

Have the USB 2.0 version myself.

 

[Harryjames]

Did you have any luck?
I’m having the same problem with a second gen. Not being picked up at all by 2021 Mac, 2010 Mac or 2007 Mac. All cables and adapters work.

Windows formatted but not passing FireWire data, does charge though.
The hard drive works and can play music. Just doesn’t handshake anything across to the macs

 

[Byrd]

No, short of a replacement 1st Gen motherboard I have a perfect in appearance 5GB that simply refuses to sync over FW, charges fine. It does however have Will Smith’s complete album featuring “Getting Jiggy Wit It” which is acceptable.

Check your FW port isn’t damaged as first course. There might be a component on the motherboard that fails here, but I’m yet to determine where.

 

[nathall]

nah nah nah nah na nah nah

 

[Harryjames]

No, short of a replacement 1st Gen motherboard I have a perfect in appearance 5GB that simply refuses to sync over FW, charges fine. It does however have Will Smith’s complete album featuring “Getting Jiggy Wit It” which is acceptable.

Check your FW port isn’t damaged as first course. There might be a component on the motherboard that fails here, but I’m yet to determine where.

Oh noo that’s sad. Looks like we’re both on the same path.

My second gen’s hard drive failed so I thought it was that. After replacing it with a working hard drive as well as a cf card drive it still isn’t showing.

I’ve got a 4th gen and I’m gonna load that up with as much music as possible. Timeless stuff. Then transplant that hard drive into my second gen and close it up for good. That way at least I can have a usable 2nd gen!

 

[Byrd]

nah nah nah nah na nah nah

Well said

@Harryjames it'll need another mechanical HD to suit, CF isn't great on anything 3rd gen and below - lots of issues basically.

This is a good guide on what works and what doesn't:

https://yuuiko.github.io/iPodGuide/iPodGuidev2-1.pdf

There are some iPod "experts" that suggest they can fix the 1st/2nd get FW sync issue but I don't know what.

 

[Harryjames]

I’m hoping this will do the trick.
It’s a transcend industrial CF170 which is locked to fixed disk mode - rather than removable. From what I could tell the CFs have a problem as some are fixed disk and others are removable and there’s no way of telling until you buy it and check. And these iPods only accept fixed disk.

Industrial CFs are fixed.

Anyway. Once I get a battery for my 4th I’ll try and get some music on here and see!