IIFX and G4 Cube networking HELP!

[Ajaxermd]

I'm so close to getting these two Macs to talk, could use some expert help. Must be 6 hours into this project.

Some background
1. I'm connecting the G4 Cube and IIFX over the AsanteTalk ethernet/AppleTalk bridge.
2. The IIFX is running 7.5.5 with AppleShare Client 3.7.4 and Open Transport 1.3. It previously ran 7.5.3, but I've upgraded to 7.5.5, installing 7.5.5 first then AppleShare 3.7.4 and finally OpenTransport 1.3.
3. The Cube is running 10.4.11 which according to this chart should allow these two Macs to talk.

I have file sharing turned on. The IIFX can be seen by other classic Macs.

Where I am now.
From the IIFX: I see the G4 Cube in the Chooser, I get a login prompt for Guest and Registered User, but both result in the error "The Connection to this server has been unexpectedly broken".
From the Cube: I can see the IIfx in the finder under "Network", but I get the following error "This file server uses an incompatible version of the AFP protocol." You can not connect to it."

AsanteTalk - I've heard these devices are tricky, so I'm powering it up last after the two Macs are online and I've given them 15+ minutes for AppleTalk to work correctly.

 

[Fizzbinn]

I'm so close to getting these two Macs to talk, could use some expert help. Must be 6 hours into this project.

Some background
1. I'm connecting the G4 Cube and IIFX over the AsanteTalk ethernet/AppleTalk bridge.
2. The IIFX is running 7.5.5 with AppleShare Client 3.7.4 and Open Transport 1.3. It previously ran 7.5.3, but I've upgraded to 7.5.5, installing 7.5.5 first then AppleShare 3.7.4 and finally OpenTransport 1.3.
3. The Cube is running 10.4.11 which according to this chart should allow these two Macs to talk.

I have file sharing turned on. The IIFX can be seen by other classic Macs.

Where I am now.
From the IIFX: I see the G4 Cube in the Chooser, I get a login prompt for Guest and Registered User, but both result in the error "The Connection to this server has been unexpectedly broken".
From the Cube: I can see the IIfx in the finder under "Network", but I get the following error "This file server uses an incompatible version of the AFP protocol." You can not connect to it."

AsanteTalk - I've heard these devices are tricky, so I'm powering it up last after the two Macs are online and I've given them 15+ minutes for AppleTalk to work correctly.

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I think the chart you reference may be misleading, below it the author says (bold/underline added by me):

• Mac OS X 10.0: This software is omitted for stability reasons. Any hardware that can run this OS can run Jaguar. AFP over AppleTalk is not included in 10.0 (only AFP over TCP/IP, there is a use_appletalk field in the NetInfo Manager but it doesn't work) but 10.1 reincorporated it, is fully featured in 10.2, but AFP over AppleTalk was reduced in capability with 10.3, and restricted to printers with 10.4. 10.6 gutted it entirely and thusly 10.5 is the last to deal with the old classes of printers (mostly Color StyleWriters and LaserWriters. Printing is not a subject of this Guide entirely).

So, I guess the idea is AFP over TCP/IP can work but not AFP over AppleTalk. I don't readily recall how you do that on the System 7.5.5 side, I think there is a "Connect to server over IP" button in the AppleShare Chooser dialog? Backing up are both machines getting IP addresses okay, i.e. is the TCP/IP control panel setup on the IIfx?

 

[Ajaxermd]

I think the chart you reference may be misleading, below it the author says (bold/underline added by me):

• Mac OS X 10.0: This software is omitted for stability reasons. Any hardware that can run this OS can run Jaguar. AFP over AppleTalk is not included in 10.0 (only AFP over TCP/IP, there is a use_appletalk field in the NetInfo Manager but it doesn't work) but 10.1 reincorporated it, is fully featured in 10.2, but AFP over AppleTalk was reduced in capability with 10.3, and restricted to printers with 10.4. 10.6 gutted it entirely and thusly 10.5 is the last to deal with the old classes of printers (mostly Color StyleWriters and LaserWriters. Printing is not a subject of this Guide entirely).

So, I guess the idea is AFP over TCP/IP can work but not AFP over AppleTalk. I don't readily recall how you do that on the System 7.5.5 side, I think there is a "Connect to server over IP" button in the AppleShare Chooser dialog? Backing up are both machines getting IP addresses okay, i.e. is the TCP/IP control panel setup on the IIfx?

Yes in 7.5.5 there is a "Server IP address" in the Chooser. I had tried this with the IP address for the Cube (192.168.0.243), tried it with the IP address and also as afp://192.168.0.243

I also looked under the TCP/IP Control Panel and there is no IP address setup. Under the top menu "Connect Via" the only choice is AppleTalk (MacIP)

Any ideas on how to get the IIFX assigned a DHCP IP address? Would that work is its all IP based.

Appreciate the help.

 

[Fizzbinn]

Oh, I forgot you said you were using a AsanteTalk ethernet/AppleTalk bridge... that will work for the LocalTalk to Ethernet AppleTalk (the network protocol, not the original way the LocalTalk serial port based networking was also referred to) conversion but not LocalTalk to Ethernet IP conversion. I've never done it but you are supposed to be able to use a MacIP gateway server to do this which would be another thing you would need to get running in some fashion on your network. MacIPpi is a modern one that runs on a Raspberry PI, looks like you can also run it as a VM (I might give that a try!). The site also discusses some of the background/details.

Don't get me wrong, getting this to work would be a cool challenge but you might be able to find a NuBus Ethernet card which would make this simpler (and put one of the NuBus slots to good use!). Here is one for $30 shipped on eBay: https://www.ebay.com/itm/175069887380

 

[beachycove]

Yes, the Asantetalk does not work with TCP/IP. The easiest and cheapest solution would be to get a Nubus Ethernet card, following which AppleTalk over TCP/IP ought to work between the II and the Cube. — Or downgrade the Cube to X.3.

 

[LaPorta]

I can verify that 10.3 will work with a IIfx even running 7.1 with OT 1.3.1. I just set that up myself.

 

[Ajaxermd]

Thanks all. Sounds like a Nubus Ethernet card would be the quickest solution.
The original goal was to download classic Mac software on the Cube using TenFour Fox and then be able to distribute it to the LocalTalk network between 68k Macs. I have a DuoDock/Duo 210, Quadra 630 and Centris 650 that I wanted to network.

would that still work? Or am I just setting up a share between the Cube and IIfx using a crossover cable?

 

[MichaelLAX]

Oh, I forgot you said you were using a AsanteTalk ethernet/AppleTalk bridge... that will work for the LocalTalk to Ethernet AppleTalk (the network protocol, not the original way the LocalTalk serial port based networking was also referred to) conversion but not LocalTalk to Ethernet IP conversion. I've never done it but you are supposed to be able to use a MacIP gateway server to do this which would be another thing you would need to get running in some fashion on your network. MacIPpi is a modern one that runs on a Raspberry PI, looks like you can also run it as a VM (I might give that a try!). The site also discusses some of the background/details.

Don't get me wrong, getting this to work would be a cool challenge but you might be able to find a NuBus Ethernet card which would make this simpler (and put one of the NuBus slots to good use!). Here is one for $30 shipped on eBay: https://www.ebay.com/itm/175069887380

I am using virtually the same setup between my Mac SE/30 running 7.5.3/1.3/3.7.4 and a MacMini2,1 running OS X Tiger Server with a Powerbook 1400cs in the middle running the LocalTalk Bridge control panel and a Farallon Ethernet adapter connected internally to the 1400 motherboard.

I get similar results: the SE/30 Chooser sees "MacMini2.1" but when I try to connect it offers me a login which then fails with a slightly different message saying to try again later. I cannot figure out how to see in the opposite direction.

I have much File Sharing experience on the standard versions of OS X over the years, but not on the Server Version, so I am trying to find a setup guide that is not the usual Server manual of 200 pages. But I do have AFP turned on on the Server for my "Michael" client that I see on the SE/30.

I used to use a Farallon iPrint in between, but I thought that was the problem so I upgraded my PB1400 with the Farallon connector (I actually bought another used 1400 on eBay that already had the Farallon Ethernet installed).

Any thoughts?

I would like to avoid the install an ethernet card in the SE/30 has the prices have recently gone way up and I really only need this to avoid SneakerNet between the two machine to install legacy software from the WiFi connected 2020 M1 MacMini that is connected by WiFi to the MacMini2,1 successfully.

Thank you.

I'm so close to getting these two Macs to talk, could use some expert help. Must be 6 hours into this project.

 

[LaPorta]

Normal 10.4 has classic AppleTalk protocols disabled. You need SharePoints to enable it. That’s part one. Part two, you need updates AppleShare on the SE/30 with OT 1.3 to connect to that even.