G3 B&W motherboard upgrade to G4

[mraroid]

Hello...
 
I just bought this G4 motherboard for under $20.00 and free shipping:
 
https://www.ebay.com/itm/143061278226
 
Is this the Yikes motherboard?  It looks to be a drop in replacement for my version 2 Blue & White G3 motherboard.
 
I am unsure of which G4 CPU this motherboard and socket can take.  Can anyone advise me?
 
Also, I see "G4 heat sinks" and larger G4 "Mirror Drive" heat sinks. Will this motherboard take the larger Mirror Drive heat sink?
 
mraroid

 

[mraroid]

This is the thermal paste I have been using:

https://www.amazon.com/Compound-Performance-Heatsink-Interface-Material/dp/B075FRTRJ5/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1547918923&sr=8-4&keywords=arctic+cooling++MX

Mostly, I use it when I rebuild over heathing PC laptops for friends. It should work fine for my G4 application?

I am also looking for 3rd party heat sinks that might be available.  Suggestions welcomed

I am impressed at how cool the inside of my B&W case is.  It will be even cooler when I swap out the mechanical hard drive for a solid state one.  That will remove a 100 F heater.

I am still puzzled over which CPUs I can install in this motherboard.  I might as well buy a faster one.

mraroid

 

[Paralel]

That thermal paste should be fine

 

[Gorgonops]

It looks like that auction comes with a 350mhz G4, if I'm interpreting the description correctly. As I wasted my time explaining on the other thread this CPU will provide basically *no* improvement over the B&W's stock G3 outside of a few very specific cases involving Altivec.

The board takes "ZIF" CPUs, which was a daughterboard form factor used on three Apple computers; the Beige G3, the B&W, and the Yikes. Any CPU that fits the board you just bought will also fit in the board already installed in your computer. Third party vendors like Sonnet and XLR8 made ZIFs in both G3 and G4 flavors up to around 1Ghz, but anything faster than 500mhz tends to be really expensive. And, again, if that's really what you wanted it would have fit the board you have.

And no, heatsinks for the later G4s won't fit. Some third party upgrades came with bigger heatsinks, or you can modify some Pentium heatsinks with fans to fit.

 

[mraroid]

It is less then $20.00 to upgrade from a G3 to a G4.  I can take the $$ hit.  I do not have any big plans for OSX, but who knows, I might like it.  I hear what you are saying Gorgonops, but part of this hobby that is fun for me is to upgrade where I can.  Playing with this stuff is learning for me. 

mraroid

 

[Paralel]

I like your spirit! 

 

[AwkwardPotato]

@Gorgonops If I'm not mistaken, the board you're describing is one of the listings eBay recommends after the linked one is sold. The one the OP purchased doesn't come with a CPU at all, and unfortunately G4 ZIF's don't seem to be very easy to come by (at least on eBay).

 

[Paralel]

You're right, Potato, the one he bought is sans CPU

As far as the fastest CPU it can take, stock build, that would be a 400 MHz PowerPC 7400.

The 7400 goes up to 500 MHz, but the speed of the processor on that motherboard may be limited by the PLL:CFG. If you do some research you might find the PLL:CFG info for that motherboard somewhere and see how you an re-arrange the resistors to support a 500 MHz part.

The strange thing I'm seeing is that the 7400 series of chips were all BGA, so I'm assuming these were BGA chips that were packaged onto a ZIF carrier for the Apple motherboards?

 

[AwkwardPotato]

Yeah, the CPUs in the G3s and Yikes G4s were a BGA G3/G4 and a couple of cache chips on a ZIF carrier.

AFAIK Apple never produced a 500MHz G4 ZIF since only the Sawtooth's and up came with 500MHz parts and those used a different connector for the CPU card. Of course, there are probably some third-party 500MHz ZIFs.

 

[Unknown_K]

The early G4 motherboards were G3 motherboards with new firmware for the G4 CPU and the ADB port removed. You can still see where the ADB port was connected, you might even be able to solder a port in and use it (unless the ADB controller was removed also).

G4 ZIFs are hard to find and not exactly cheap. I stuck one in one of my B&W G3s ages ago because I needed a G4 to run the Matrox RTMAC card. Since then I snagged a bunch of G4 native machines.

One of my favorite cheap upgrades for G4 towers were the dual 450/500 Mhz G4s stuffed into a Sawtooth AGP machine with the wide heatsinks.

 

[mraroid]

One of my favorite cheap upgrades for G4 towers were the dual 450/500 Mhz G4s stuffed into a Sawtooth AGP machine with the wide heatsinks.

That CPU upgrade would not work on the Yikes! motherboard, correct?

mraroid

 

[Unknown_K]

Nope, it is not a ZIF

 

[mraroid]

I saw this for sale:

Sonnet Encore/ZIF 500Mhz G4 with 1MB 250Mhz L2 Cache, used tested - Low Price $109.77

The Sonnet Encore™/ZIF can make your G3 or G4 Power Macintosh® one of the fastest desktop computers in the world. Designed with 1MB backside cache, the Encore/ZIF G4 deliver the ultimate in processing power. From scrolling windows and launching applications to operating graphics programs, you can expect head-turning performance gains from your newly upgraded Power Macintosh. All Encore/ZIF G4 cards are compatible with your existing hardware and seamlessly integrate with your software. Compatible Encore/ZIF G4 500 MHz models support from OS 9.2 through 10.4.x in G3 Blue & White and G4 PCI Graphics systems. This is a used tested unit. FITS THE FOLLOWING: Beige G3 DT and MT (may require other upgrades), G3 Blue & White, G4 Yikes (PCI Graphics). Our low price $109.77 includes domestic shipping. Limited quantities order now.

*************************************

I am still reading and searching ebay for G4 processors and heat sinks. I would like the machine to be at least as fast as the V 2 Blue and White motherboard I have installed now.

As version 1 of the blue and white G3 motherboard was problematic, I might be able to sell my V2 motherboard to a B&W person who would like to upgrade to V2. 

Will the RAM and video card in my Blue & White roll over to the new G4 motherboard?

mraroid

 

[mraroid]

And I think this would work, and it is less then 1/2 the price of the Sonnet....

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Apple-Macintosh-PowerPC-G4-ZIF-400MHz-CPU-Processor-377-2580-XSC7400HIP400CE/254069641337?hash=item3b27bb1079:g:QjgAAOSwVIZcOoeA:rk:1f:0

mraroid

 

[nglevin]

Looks like there's quite a number of very nice options for ZIFs on eBay now, if you can match part numbers to third party upgrades.

I'm pretty OK with the G3 ones at the moment. My G4 needs are well covered by a PowerBook.

 

[mraroid]

I see several G4 Apple Hardware Test CDs for sale on ebay.  I am not sure which one to buy.  Any suggestions?

mraroid


 

 

[davidg5678]

I would recommend searching online for a Hardware Test ISO to burn as there is no advantage to getting an original CD that may or may not work.

 

[mraroid]

Great tip. Will do.  Thanks

Mraroid